Any regrets going automatic?

PatrickR

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That the automatic (even with the engine output reduced to simulate additional drivetrain loss), puts more force to the ground than the manual for the majority of speeds. More force transmitted to the ground should equal greater acceleration (not accounting for weight, shift times, clutch dumping, torque converter flashing, etc.). It's gearing vs. gearing, multiplied by the engine torque.
Ok I see what you're trying to do. You need to compare through theoretical shift points. Comparing gearing only isn't going to show what you'd need to show. Then, you'd need to account for a bunch of other variables.

I'll take the (limited) mag tests and person experience...

Of course, drive what you like. Subjective experience kind of trumps everything else on these kinds of purchases.





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Toycrusher

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Does it hold back?

I know autos have come a long way and performance-wise they seemed to have pulled ahead in most vehicles. I know guys who complain about shift feel and pedal placement but I've always driven a stick in pretty much every vehicle. I thought it made my 2.5L TJ fun to drive and heel-toeing that thing really felt like an accomplishment lol.
Personally, geared right, I prefer climbs and descents in a manual. Once the clutch is out, the tires are turning and you can focus on other things. Need a little more wheel speed? Give it a little more gas. The 3.6 has enough torque (well, with a Centerforce clutch for sure) to push up against a wall and have the four tires spinning slowly without stalling.

In an auto, you are playing a dance with the throttle, trying to maintain enough pressure to not roll backwards yet not give it to much throttle where the converter catches and you jump forward.
 

Rodeoflyer

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Personally, geared right, I prefer climbs and descents in a manual. Once the clutch is out, the tires are turning and you can focus on other things. Need a little more wheel speed? Give it a little more gas. The 3.6 has enough torque (well, with a Centerforce clutch for sure) to push up against a wall and have the four tires spinning slowly without stalling.

In an auto, you are playing a dance with the throttle, trying to maintain enough pressure to not roll backwards yet not give it to much throttle where the converter catches and you jump forward.
Agreed. I can stand on the brakes with my butt off the seat and it doesn't stall, even stock with 4.10 gears. With 5.13's it would be even better. The crawl ratio is something like 88:1(?) stock. I can get out and walk alongside the jeep in 4lo and 1st gear.
 

AnnDee4444

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Ok I see what you're trying to do. You need to compare through theoretical shift points. Comparing gearing only isn't going to show what you'd need to show. Then, you'd need to account for a bunch of other variables.

I'll take the (limited) mag tests and person experience...

Of course, drive what you like. Subjective experience kind of trumps everything else on these kinds of purchases.
I can assume the automatic shift points are at or near redline when WOT. The manual shift points are dependent on the driver, but will probably be similar.

I agree about the actual testing though. We need to find two equal Jeeps with both transmissions.
 

AnnDee4444

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Agreed. I can stand on the brakes with my butt off the seat and it doesn't stall, even stock with 4.10 gears. With 5.13's it would be even better. The crawl ratio is something like 88:1(?) stock. I can get out and walk alongside the jeep in 4lo and 1st gear.
I got this:
Stock Rubicon auto: 4.71 first gear x 4 transfer case x 4.1 differential = 77.2 crawl ratio
Stock Rubicon manual: 5.13 first gear x 4 transfer case x 4.1 differential = 84.1 crawl ratio
Your Jeep: 5.13 first gear x 4 transfer case x 5.13 differential = 105.2 crawl ratio (edited first gear ratio)

Anyone ever successfully used the hill decent function?
 
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Rodeoflyer

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Thanks for breaking the numbers down AnnDee! The manual doesn't have hill descent, nor needs it lol.

I have the manual btw, so over 107 crawl ratio with 5.13 gears? It's crazy. Specifically why I wanted the manual trans 5.13 first gear..
 

Heimkehr

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How well does the auto do when holding back compared to the manual?

I've always liked driving manual transmission-equipped vehicles but one of the biggest advantages has been the ability to put it in 1st gear at the top of a steep snow hill or a muddy trail and let it creep down.
It does well.

Hill Descent Control is included with the 850RE. There's a discrete button on the HVAC control panel, and a good read in the Owner's Manual regarding how to best use the feature.

Hill Descent.jpg
 

AnnDee4444

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Thanks for breaking the numbers down AnnDee! The manual doesn't have hill descent, nor needs it lol.

I have the manual btw, so over 107 crawl ratio with 5.13 gears? It's crazy. Specifically why I wanted the manual trans 5.13 first gear..
Guess I should have read your signature... I just assumed you had a manual. I fixed the calculation in the earlier post: your crawl ratio is a ridiculous 105.2.
 

Duluth Diesel

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Random thought and given that the new 392 monster does little for me because I have and only want a 2 door Wrangler. I’ll only give up my manual 2-door Wrangler when Jeep offers a 2-door with a factory 5.7 Hemi. They’d have me then. A 5.7 would rip in a little 2-door, and even if it only came backed by an auto, I’d sign up for one.
 

Bran

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I loved manuals when I was able. As a service disabled veteran with back problems I can’t anymore, but still want to. The last 2 trucks I had I used the “manual” overide on the auto, the JRUL, I haven’t felt the need. Smooth as “butta”. Excellent tranny, love it!!
 

03RMK800

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Reluctantly went to the auto, and now think its great. I compare the experience compared to other auto transmissions in cars and a Bronco I had as the difference between a mere automotive auto and a hydrostatic drive in the combine or tractor, loader, skidsteer, etc-- put it in gear, and its under power without lag. I like the positive engagement feel.
I can't believe how hard the computers work to keep engine Rs about 1800 in lots of circumstances. Tranny doesn't upshift just because you lift off the accelerator-- it will when it decides too, and it makes pretty good decisions.
Best discovery-- in highway driving, downshift on downhill by brake taps. Hardly ever use manual selection for highway downhills.
Next best discovery-- offroading with the auto actually works, and using the manual position is fast and easy. Sometimes, I even leave it in auto/4L and handle shifts with gas and brake. Amazing control.
Descent control-- not yet sold but maybe I'll learn about it.
Readout showing transmission position at all times is really good- some others only show "D" if you're in auto mode; its good to know what "D" gear you're in at all times.
By the way, I have for sale or trade one eighth gear, very low mileage, hardly used. Cheap!!!!
 

sixspeed

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I know the automatic transmission is way better than the manual transmission. I’m seeing the new 392 rubicon is offered in automatic only and I’m not saying I’ll be getting one anytime soon. I’ve been driving manual for a long time to a point where driving an automatic is uncomfortable for me because my foot is constantly reaching for a clutch pedal that’s not there and my hand is constantly going for a gear change that’s unnecessary. Just out of curiosity how many of you out here made the switch to automatic from manual and if you have any regrets or love it better?
With a couple of small exceptions, I’ve been shifting gears since I was 20. I’m now 64. My last Jeep was the Wrangler Sport with a six speed. We frequently go to the mountains in eastern Arizona, a rise of over six thousand feet in elevation with a lot a winding roads. One recent time, we went up with the Jeep fully loaded and it hit me how hard it was to accelerate, especially uphill. To get real power, you would have to downshift twice and then you rev up to over 5000 rpms, jerk my wife awake, etc. This was constant. The six speed gearing is bad and since so few people buy it, FCA provided a so so shifter, much less quality than what they probably sell in Europe. The next trip up was the hillier route and it was a bad experience passing cars and losing speed going up hill. It also hit me that I probably shifted 1000 times that trip.

I traded in the Sport for a (much heavier) Rubicon. With a test drive with an automatic, it hit me there was no way I could shift as fast or efficiently doing it myself, which was confirmed during the next trip to the mountains. The 8 speed is a joy.

Maybe I had this revelation because of age and I would still get a manual for a small car (if possible), but the current Jeep manual gearbox is not fit for a 5000 pound beast.
You will eventually get over phantom shifting but it could take weeks. For years, I could always drive more efficiently with a stick, especially with upshifting. But I don’t miss it on the Jeep. I actually do a tad of manual shifting with the automatic—down hill stops and upshifting—and it works well, so you can still use your manual smarts.
 

Sean K.

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Agreed. I can stand on the brakes with my butt off the seat and it doesn't stall, even stock with 4.10 gears. With 5.13's it would be even better. The crawl ratio is something like 88:1(?) stock. I can get out and walk alongside the jeep in 4lo and 1st gear.
I'm geared 265:1 in double low first gear but stalling isn't the problem with manuals. It's wheel speed on bigger climbs. Giving it more gas just results in more RPM, not really much increase in wheel speed. You need a higher gear and that's not something you're going to be able to shift into on a 20' waterfall face. Gear selection becomes even more problematic if the base of the climb is littered with large boulders.
 

SoK66

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If you plan to wheel your JL you are much better off with the automatic. Enables better torque application on obstacles and eliminating the need for a third foot allows you to left foot brake, apply throttle and release torque with the left foot. The durability and capability of automatic transmissions have evolved significantly over the past 25 years and unless you just enjoy rowing through the gears old school there’s hardly any reason for a manual these days.
 

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