Willys vs Rubicon vs 4 runner

[zdr]

Oh for sure and I definitely understand, I just see some crazy statements sometimes. On these very forums I’ve seen people claim that Rubicons cost $15,000 more than Sports. And while that can be true, it certainly doesn’t have to be.

I built a Rubicon at a lower MSRP than my GF's Willys build...
2021 JLUR
3.6 manual
Tow, LED, Proximity
3pc Hardtop
$48,850
2021 JLUW
3.6 Auto
Tow, LED, Winter
3pc Hardtop
$49,300

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[displayname]

I understand but the difference between the Willys Sport and the regular Willys is the power windows, locks, AC , LED headlights ect.. My point is there shouldn't be 2 Willys. All that stuff should come standard for the price of the Willys Sport. All that stuff comes standard on the Base Bronco for $31k. But Jeep makes you pay thousands more. If you don't want it then you should be able to delete it and subtract from the price then. That's what mean.

Well, you can actually get a Wrangler right now. Can't really say the same for the Bronco. I also think Bronco low balled for the intro year to help gain some market share. Then add the dealer markup happening, it makes those low base model sticker prices even less meaningful.

It's a fair point you're making, but because of Ford's inability to deliver, it's kind of meaningless for actual buyers at the moment.

 

[Deleted member 59498]

Plus Broncos are ugly as hell.

 

[JeepViking13]

Well, you can actually get a Wrangler right now. Can't really say the same for the Bronco. I also think Bronco low balled for the intro year to help gain some market share. Then add the dealer markup happening, it makes those low base model sticker prices even less meaningful.

It's a fair point you're making, but because of Ford's inability to deliver, it's kind of meaningless for actual buyers at the moment.

That saying isn't going to last forever. Once all these unfortunate events are behind us there will be Broncos everywhere. Jeep will have to respond. Let's face it the entire Auto industry is being a$$ raped right now. Ford just got unlucky and released a new vehicle right as a freaking pandemic hit. What the chances?

 

[displayname]

That saying isn't going to last forever. Once all these unfortunate events are behind us there will be Broncos everywhere. Jeep will have to respond. Let's face it the entire Auto industry is being a$$ raped right now. Ford just got unlucky and released a new vehicle right as a freaking pandemic hit. What the chances?

I don't disagree that Ford will sell a ton of Broncos. But I think by the time you can get one semi quickly, the MSRP will also increase significantly. So saying "the Bronco does it at xyz price" won't last forever either.

I'm not trying to hate on the Bronco, I think they look very very cool actually. But if we're going to throw Bronco into the mix here, I will just say I don't expect their price points to hold as they start to gain market share.

 

[AcesandEights]

You can order a base Rubicon with no extra options. Dealers don’t want to stock them, but you can get one.

That's exactly what i did, $41k

 

[entropy]

I understand but the difference between the Willys Sport and the regular Willys is the power windows, locks, AC , LED headlights ect.. My point is there shouldn't be 2 Willys. All that stuff should come standard for the price of the Willys Sport. All that stuff comes standard on the Base Bronco for $31k. But Jeep makes you pay thousands more. If you don't want it then you should be able to delete it and subtract from the price then. That's what mean.

A base wrangler starts at 29k.... You are just fixated on the Willys.

But the standard Bronco doesnt have a solid front axle or 32inch M/Ts with nice looking wheels or the rubicon suspension, or a nice working top. It isnt even a Jeep!

But I get it. Even the "cheap" Jeep is kinda expensive. But the same could be said about A lot of cars. Lots of sedans, BMW, Audi, etc.. are overpriced you could argue compared to Toyota, Lexus, etc...

Anyway. Have you priced out a base sport S instead of a Willys? it comes with A/C and infotainment and all the electrical stuff you want and 31.5inch tires.

Remember you are pricing a Willys which is a special edition, cant compare that to a base Bronco.

Get yourself a base sport S with rear LSD. Then buy rubicon takeoff suspension and wheels/tires and youll end up better. Or wheel/tires of your choice.

 

[Deleted member 59498]

That saying isn't going to last forever. Once all these unfortunate events are behind us there will be Broncos everywhere. Jeep will have to respond. Let's face it the entire Auto industry is being a$$ raped right now. Ford just got unlucky and released a new vehicle right as a freaking pandemic hit. What the chances?

But the basic Willys looks better than most Bronco levels, seem to be better off road also. I don't want Wrangler to change in some radical way to keep up with what looks like a lessor competitor.

Thankfully through all the years of Jeep Wrangler brand through many companies the Wrangler has been the bread basket and kept as it is. Jeep Wrangler has been through more than one Bronco and for off roading I don't see any competition with this one either. More dangerous competition could be the 6th Gen 4Runner. If they build it right but I suspect it will be more road vehicle than off road. Plus it is rumored it will not be built in Japan any more which is a set back also. Because they make good stuff.

I think we will see a bunch of Bronco Sports. But at least you can buy a Wrangler sport and have everything you need to build up an awesome Off Road wrangler. I am not sure you can do that and mod up a bronco sport.

 

[Jeepfamilia]

As far as the Broncos go….
I drove one for a few hours and here’s my opinion :

mall crawlin, grocery trips and going to work , highway…it vastly superior to the jeep in ride quality .

as far as “feel” and or “character”, it’s soulless and feels like I’m driving a Ford Focus base… I mean it’s a great setup but doesn’t feel solid or induce confidence in any way .
The Jeep Wrangler has character and provides a special driving experience that the Bronco didn’t pull off.

the interior….the bronco feels cheap and flexy….i Don’t get that with the wrangler at all . Much better touch points and higher quality interior materials .

I’m partial to the 2.0 in the jeep and I drove the 2.3 eco boost bronco…..I like the 2.0 better as well…

 

[viper88]

I daily drive both, 4Runner and two-door Rubicon. The 4R is a nicer daily driver that does all the weekend warrior stuff. The 4R A-trac works almost as well as a mechanical lsd but the vehicle is nicer when not on the trail, so...its nicer 99% of the time to drive on road and as effective on 95% of the trails. The 4R is boring though. It just goes, comfortably, but lacks character.

How is the 4 Runner's transmission compared to the 8-speed ZF in the JL? Does the 4 Runner's trans take anything away from the driving experience? People say the Toyota gets worse mpg also. Is that true?

 

[Deleted member 59498]

I love that ride

How is the 4 Runner's transmission compared to the 8-speed ZF in the JL? Does the 4 Runner's trans take anything away from the driving experience? People say the Toyota gets worse mpg also. Is that true?

Yes the 4Runner is the worst for MPG but not much worse than JL. People are really happy with there 8 speed though. But I have drove the 4Runner for couple years and it is not awesome just kind of bland and not exciting.

 

[jimim]

Hey welcome to the forum- Why are you wanting a Willy's when you have had 3 late model Rubicon's? I believe you already know the answer to the question you are asking.

The Willy's and Rubicon are more capable off road than the 4 runner but for what you are wanting to do, it doesnt matter. They are all equally capable of doing basic trails.

I’m glad I’m not the only one thinking this exact same thing? Why even ask. Op says he is doing trails. A willys can handle that day and night? A willys is cheaper. Op says he wants to save money cause of his 83k 392. So it’s kinda a no brained? What am I missing here?

 

[Creeker]

My $0.015 worth.

If you can swing it, get the Rubicon.
The 4-to-1 xfer case, 4.11's, Dana 44's, lockers, etc. make the JLR a good deal.

In my fleet, a couple that may help answer the question

2020 JLR 2-Door with M/T with RK 3.5" lift and 37's plus a bunch of other goodies
2021 Tacoma Off-Road with M/T (somewhat similar to 4-Runner)

Tacoma:

• Better ride than a JLR.
• Reliability is well known
• Not as much fun.
• No Jeep "Wave"
• Much more work to go 35's or bigger

Jeep:

• Lots of Fun
• More capable
• Easier to add mods like 37's
• Doubt I will see another JLR like mine after mods (https://www.jlwranglerforums.com/forum/threads/manual-2-door-rubicon-bikini-build.48532/)
• Jeep Wave :D
• Can be towed in x-fer case neutral
• Always have a smile on my face driving the JLR

Anyway, best wishes going fwd.

 

[JeepViking13]

A base wrangler starts at 29k.... You are just fixated on the Willys.

But the standard Bronco doesnt have a solid front axle or 32inch M/Ts with nice looking wheels or the rubicon suspension, or a nice working top. It isnt even a Jeep!

But I get it. Even the "cheap" Jeep is kinda expensive. But the same could be said about A lot of cars. Lots of sedans, BMW, Audi, etc.. are overpriced you could argue compared to Toyota, Lexus, etc...

Anyway. Have you priced out a base sport S instead of a Willys? it comes with A/C and infotainment and all the electrical stuff you want and 31.5inch tires.

Remember you are pricing a Willys which is a special edition, cant compare that to a base Bronco.

Get yourself a base sport S with rear LSD. Then buy rubicon takeoff suspension and wheels/tires and youll end up better. Or wheel/tires of your choice.

I understand. But as you said the Willys is a special edition model. So it definitely should come standard with AC and l the power amenities without costing more. I like the Willys but I think Jeep can make it better for their customers. If I'm going to pay extra for a special edition I'd like to see power everything standard and a rear Locker instead of a throw away LSD that eventually eats itself down the road and better gearing then the crappy 3.43s.

If Jeep was smart they would make the Willys competition for the Black Diamond Bronco model which comes standard with a lot of good stuff. Power everything, washout water proof interior, rear Lockers, 4.46 rear axle, Auxiliary switches, ect ect.. Especially since the Willys is like a rough and tough military throw back model.

I don't know I'm not trying to turn this into a Jeep vs Bronco rant. I would just like to see Jeep make something I like better. I would actually buy a Willys if they made these changes for 2022 because I love the styling of the Willys.

 

[viper88]

I love that ride



Yes the 4Runner is the worst for MPG but not much worse than JL. People are really happy with there 8 speed though. But I have drove the 4Runner for couple years and it is not awesome just kind of bland and not exciting.

I had a '19 JLR 2.0 wTorque. 100% stock. I loved the 2.0 and ZF 8-speed. Great power, fast for what it was. The ZF shifted great. I averaged 20-21 mpg combined, average 23-24 mpg highway and had as high as 26 mpg highway. Driving on flat city streets and highways.

Planning on replacing it soon. I was just going to buy another JLR or Willys. Just wondering if I should try something different?

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