Shock Question For the Experienced Guys...

[AnnDee4444]

I’m not completely sure about having full clearance though. I went with 0 offset wheels to eliminate the possibility based on advice here on the forum and Northridge4x4 who did the lift.

It's been well documented that most 35s will fit on a stock Rubicon with stock wheels (+44mm). Up to +25mm offset seems to work also. Edit: with stock non-XR bumpstops.

Stock vs. AEV +25mm with 315s https://www.willtheyfit.com/index.p...2=70&wheel_size=17&wheel_width=8.5&offset2=25

Stock vs. 0mm offset 8.5" with 315s https://www.willtheyfit.com/index.p...t2=70&wheel_size=17&wheel_width=8.5&offset2=0

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[neil]

Ive had my 2.5 for 2+ years now, no issues, love them.

just ordered some 2.0 for wife's rears that are leaking. She does not like height of my shock....we will see how they do.

 

[Zandcwhite]

That's all well and good, but has anyone actually checked to see what the spring rates are on these new right right systems? It seems to me based on their expected height increases that they're just packaging their existing springs with less parts to bring the cost down. If that's the case, I'd still be cautious of how stiff they ride on the road.

Something I figured out pretty quickly after having Teraflex, Metalcloak, and Rock Krawler springs is just how different all 3 ride based on their different philosophy's. Teraflex largely likes to keep their springs linear which is similar to stock, but the result here is a rate that's the same regardless of where your suspension is in it's stroke. In my experience, that was a pretty harsh initial jolt over bumps before the shocks could dampen the impact. Metalcloak being a dual rate helps minimize that initial jolt but leads to a lot more squishy roll in the meat of the spring that the shocks have to compensate for. Rock Krawler having a triple rate spring gives the planted feeling throughout the range to account for different stages of suspension movement. Something they figured out through their off road racing program. It's extremely satisfying to live with everyday because regardless of what I hit with the tires, the suspension just soaks it up and it doesn't feel harsh at any point. The Fox IFP's I paired with these springs really do work well to balance it all out.

Unless I'm mistaken, I'm fairly certain Clayton takes the same approach as Metalcloak but ups the spring rate to account for that extra squishy feeling which I've seen a couple times be reported as very firm/stiff as a result.

I think you're attributing way too much of the ride difference to the springs while literally describing the difference in ride of all 3 types of shocks you listed and how they will effect ride on the same springs in my experience with all 3. The 5100s will be harsh initially over bumps due to their digressive valving. Rocksports are too soft on road and thus the body roll. Fox 2.0s are the sweet spot of soft enough for road imperfections and enough dampening to control body roll and big hits. The dual rate of the metalcloak springs doesn't come into play on road as they are in the ride zone which is the same rate with any weight on the spring. The top of the spring is the second zone and literally rides around fully compressed most of the time making it effectively an infinite spring rate like a solid spacer or mount. I wouldn't imagine the triple rate comes into effect on road on the rock krawler springs either fit the same reason. In my opinion/experience your felt ride differences are almost entirely the shocks.

 

[DewHawk]

I think you're attributing way too much of the ride difference to the springs while literally describing the difference in ride of all 3 types of shocks you listed and how they will effect ride on the same springs in my experience with all 3. The 5100s will be harsh initially over bumps due to their digressive valving. Rocksports are too soft on road and thus the body roll. Fox 2.0s are the sweet spot of soft enough for road imperfections and enough dampening to control body roll and big hits. The dual rate of the metalcloak springs doesn't come into play on road as they are in the ride zone which is the same rate with any weight on the spring. The top of the spring is the second zone and literally rides around fully compressed most of the time making it effectively an infinite spring rate like a solid spacer or mount. I wouldn't imagine the triple rate comes into effect on road on the rock krawler springs either fit the same reason. In my opinion/experience your felt ride differences are almost entirely the shocks.

That’s an interesting point. However, I’d like to add that I’ve run the Teraflex springs on both the 5100’s and the Fox IFPs. My butt could feel a slight difference in initial shock response but the overall ride quality was still very lack luster compared to Metalcloak and Rock Krawler. Again, the ride quality difference on Metalcloak between 5100’s and Rocksports is definitely noticeable for initial impact as well as body roll resistance. The Fox IFP’s might’ve been the sweet spot here but I’m still not totally convinced Metalcloak has the spring rates right either, at least for my driving preference (can you really blame me for trying something different after running them twice?). The kicker is I haven’t run my Rock Krawler lift on anything besides the Fox IFP’s but I’d imagine the 5100’s and the Rocksports would probably exhibit some of the same characteristics that they did on the Metalcloak setup. My gut tells me though that the triple rate springs would still contribute a noticeable ride difference. If I can find someone to let me experiment with Rocksports and 5100’s paired with these springs, I’d have solid answers. Until then, I still think Rock Krawler has an edge over Metalcloak in road performance since they go the extra lengths to test their product in racing conditions.

 

[AnnDee4444]

Nice gif showing Metalcloak's "True Dual Rate" and road rate. As stated earlier, their road rate is not progressive. Unfortunately I've never seen Metalcloak give spring rate values.

In my opinion the only advantage to a dual-rate spring is if you're shocks are long enough to unseat the coil, otherwise they will perform exactly like a single-rate spring (as shown in the gif above). This happens in the front when the shocks are at 26.25"/27.5" (Sport/XR), rear 27.75" (Sport). Spacers will increase these distances proportionally.

For example: a Sport with a 1.5" spacer will unseat the springs at roughly 27.75" front, 29.25" rear. This is enough to cover almost every 2"-3" shock, and many 3"-4.5" shocks. Plus you get the benefits knowing the exact lift height, lower cost, and not changing the spring rates (which may or may not be desirable).

	Front Rate	Rear Rate
Stock JLUR	123-128	172-176
Stock JL	130-140?	172-176
Mopar 2" lift	131-133	180-182
Stock JT	134-141	N/A
Teraflex Standard	140	170
Teraflex Heavy	170	300
Metalcloak	?	?
Rock Krawler 2.5"	137.5 @ ride	175 @ ride
Rock Krawler 3.5"	140 @ ride	185 @ ride

I also found this video recently. One of the important parts is @10:21

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