OEM Battery Replacement

[Punk'n2doorsport]

Yeah....my goal was to run a 4.5W dash camera, which I was able to do with a 20 amp/hour one of these.....still a fortune on an amp hour comparative basis, but much cheaper than the larger ones that you might be interested in.

The thing is that Lithium Iron Phosphate batteries are awesome but for the one limitation of not charging them below freezing or risk ruining them. The can be charge cycled so much more than lead acid ones, don't off gas, experience limited voltage drop with temperature, and are super safe.

I considered that very warmer you linked. Then I said to myself that it would be better if I let the battery's BMS (battery monitoring system) figure out how much to first allow itself to warm up with the charging source's current, before beginning to charge it. But yeah, shopping for your amp hour needs, no way could I afford these batteries either.

I have a little 32AH for my trailer, and 103AH for house battery, but my DC-DC is being a dick and either isnt charging or charging wrong or my fridge isnt reading right (has a built in voltmeter... supposedly)

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[WranglerMan]

Im having a hard time justifying the cost of that set up due to me having my big battery in the back already and im trying to not go overkill on power haha, i currently have a triple battery set up, crank/agm/trailer battery.

I have 32AH in my trailer to run desiel heater and a few 12V sockets, but my DC-DC is giving me shit and im not happy about it

For me I first justified my need and my initial need was to get rid of the tiny ESS dissimilar battery located in a inconvenient spot and second have a power source that would allow me to run a air compressor and also winch that did not tax my main crank battery, it also allows me to run additional items like a fridge etc... and tie those items into the +/- bus bars on my aux battery.

There are other options less expensive like doing a battery hack designed by Jerry and if the ESS battery worries you then you could remove it and move the positive from ESS to the main crank positive and leave the ESS negative disconnected and your JL will run fine on one battery but DONT USE ESS IF GOING THIS ROUTE ...

 

[Punk'n2doorsport]

For me I first justified my need and my initial need was to get rid of the tiny ESS dissimilar battery located in a inconvenient spot and second have a power source that would allow me to run a air compressor and also winch that did not tax my main crank battery, it also allows me to run additional items like a fridge etc... and tie those items into the +/- bus bars on my aux battery.

There are other options less expensive like doing a battery hack designed by Jerry and if the ESS battery worries you then you could remove it and move the positive from ESS to the main crank positive and leave the ESS negative disconnected and your JL will run fine on one battery but DONT USE ESS IF GOING THIS ROUTE ...

Yeah, see thats what i wanna do cause then my electrical is absolutely bullet proof, and i have so much power i dont have to worry

 

[Kreepin1]

Kirk: question from ignorance.

Is purchasing of backup batteries and putting them on a shelf in my basement for potential long term (months) storage until needed a bad idea unless they are connected to a trickle charger?

Thanks.

I did not mean to come across as some sort of expert on battery storage. My reasoning is this: when you purchase a battery there is a warrantee period and they punch out the little dots which starts the clock ticking. If you put that battery on the shelf for 18, 24 or 36 months until your current battery dies it is probably not as good as a more recently manufactured battery.

Now, if you are just talking a couple of months then it doesn't matter. But if your current battery if that close to failure then you should just replace it instead of trying to squeeze a little more use out of it.

 

[twisty]

I have found out thru informal testing that the Deltran plus that I was using originally on my JL’s stock setup seemed to work but after chatting with them, Shane and Mike at Genesis, NOCO and Odyssey they all advised that the 128ah that my Full River batteries need to be charged at that the 1.25ah tender would be lacking due to the small ah output, they advised it would be fine for say using daily to keep the batteries topped off but to actually charge them from say a 40% DOD back to 100% would take possibly several days.

Full River recommends .20-.35% as their sweet spot so for me that would be a 25ah charger and the Odyssey I have is 20 amps and it holds the 14.6 volts for several hours during optimization, the NOCO ramps up to the same but then seems to come down based on temperature, I have considered charting the charging process with a Bluetooth monitor but after speaking to Full River on multiple occasions and telling them what I was using in regard to the Deltran they kinda chuckled and advised me to put that on my lawnmower

Batteries are a consumable item and the best we can hope for is maybe 3-5 years before being replaced but I will do my best by utilizing my NOCO for a overnight top off and use the Odyssey when it’s parked for days.

I used my Deltran for several years and will continue to use it on my wife's car but with the high amp hours of my current setup I will take the advice of those who made the batteries and built my dual system as these batteries were not inexpensive and I want to get the most I can from them.

Like i said I used the Deltran for several years without issue but the stock setup requires the voltage output from a charger to be a max of 14.4 I believe and the Deltran was like 14.2 but when I connected it to my new setup it was like 13.8-14.2 and I believe the reduction is due to charging two full size batteries with a load in the middle coming from the relay, the Full River ones require 14.6 and they need to see that 14.6 for several hours and the Odyssey does this, the NOCO comes in at 14.2-14.3 but does ramp up to 14.6 but does not stay there long and that may have to with the temperature compensation so in the end I gave all the info to Full River and the Deltran did not make their to use list for proper care and since these are warranted for 5 years I want to ensure if they crap out it’s not because I used the wrong charger/maintainer and am denied any warranty compensation.

I disco'd by battery IBS and it ran at 14V's or more. I did get an light on the dash but once plugged back in it went away. Wondering that if in your situation or others that need a periodic big charging, disco-ing the IBS might work well enough??

 

[WranglerMan]

I disco'd by battery IBS and it ran at 14V's or more. I did get an light on the dash but once plugged back in it went away. Wondering that if in your situation or others that need a periodic big charging, disco-ing the IBS might work well enough??

I do periodic charging and reconditioning as I have two full size 64ah batteries and I just want them at peak all the time, I currently have the IBS turned off with JSCAN so it’s kicking 14+ all the time but not 100% sold it will keep both batteries at peak

 

[twisty]

I do periodic charging and reconditioning as I have two full size 64ah batteries and I just want them at peak all the time, I currently have the IBS turned off with JSCAN so it’s kicking 14+ all the time but not 100% sold it will keep both batteries at peak

What isjscan

 

[WranglerMan]

What isjscan

http://jscan.net/

 

[zscooby]

I bought a lot of DieHard batteries through about 1996, and had trouble with them. By chance I bought an Interestate in 1996 and had good luck with it so I've stayed with that brand and have not had any problems with them.

In my experience with my family's vehicles since 1996- a car that is driven daily, in a hot climate, with the battery under the hood, will require a new battery every 36 months. Put the battery under the floorboard like in my daughter's Grand Cherokee, away from the heat under the hood, and it might last closer to 60 months.


I've been planning to visit places far off the beaten path, by myself, and I was intending to carry a small jump-starter for safety. My understanding is they don't with if you have both batteries, running a single battery might be safer.


I bought a 2018 this year, have no idea if it has been flashed or not. I would like to find an easy solution to fix my vehicle. And BTW my ESS has not functioned sinde I bought it, saves me pushing the button.

do you wear your seat belt?

 

[txj2go]

do you wear your seat belt?

always

 

[txj2go]

There is a harmless way to find out if your vehicle has been flashed, aside from asking the dealer. Provided it is a 3.6L:

1) Locate the negative battery terminal on the main battery.
2) Remove from it the cable NEARER to the passenger's side front quarter panel temporarily (it's a metric 10 bolt I believe.) That's the ESS/Aux battery's cable coming from its negative terminal. Leave the other terminal connected: that's the cable that leads to the body ground. You've just temporarily taken the ESS/Aux battery out of service.
3) Go into your vehicle and attempt to crank. I guarantee you that you'll fail. It's what happens next that will answer your question.
4) A second later attempt the crank again. If the engine starts and an ESS disabled light is displayed in the dash, you have this flash. If the engine continues to not be able to crank you do not have this flash.

OK what is the third option?
I tried this test today because the Jeep is just over 3 years old and I'm planning a trip to remote places.
I disconnected the ground cable from the battery- 13mm wrench.
I got inside and pushed the start button- the engine started immediately, no fail. So I still don't know if the Jeep has the flash or not.

 

[Gee-pah]

OK what is the third option?
I tried this test today because the Jeep is just over 3 years old and I'm planning a trip to remote places.
I disconnected the ground cable from the battery- 13mm wrench.
I got inside and pushed the start button- the engine started immediately, no fail. So I still don't know if the Jeep has the flash or not.

@txj2go : please know this by no means is some....reprimand, but I can't help but worry if you did the test correctly based on your description

Lets start over, and this is for the 3.6L JL:

1) Identify the negative terminal of the main battery.
2) Two factory cables connect to this negative terminal. You may other things there as well if you've installed electrified accessories but lets focus on these two factory cables.
3) One of these cables will lead to the grounding bar on the passenger's front quarter panel. Don't touch this cable. Keep it attached on both ends. I think it's this cable you disconnected last time.
4) Focus on the other cable. It came from the ESS/Aux battery's negative termina;l. THIS is the cable I'd like you to temporarily disconnect and try starting the JL with.
5) I believe on first attempt to crank (i.e. hold down the break pedal and press the start button) your JL will fail. It's what happens on the second attempt that interests me.
6) Try again to crank the vehicle (i.e. hold down the break pedal and press the start button). If the Wrangler doesn't crank you don't have the flash.

If the vehicle does crank expect it to throw up to the panel an ESS off light. Don't worry about that. The vehicle is just saying, "hey buddy, I won't be engaging ESS on your vehicle because it appears you have no ESS battery.....and you don't...you just disconnected it.)

7) shut off the vehicle.
8) Regardless of the outcome of this test, reconnect the cable that came from the ESS/Aux battery back to its place on the negative terminal of the main battery.

9) Recrank the vehicle. The rig should sense voltage on the ESS battery now and turn off the ESS off dash light if it in fact illuminated it in step 6.

If you could start the vehicle on step 6 then you have the flash.

 

[txj2go]

@txj2go : please know this by no means is some....reprimand, but I can't help but worry if you did the test correctly based on your description

Lets start over, and this is for the 3.6L JL:

It's nighttime now, I can try again tomorrow.

It was a little hard to trace the 2 large wires from the negative terminal because about 6" from the terminal the 2 wires are both wrapped into the same loom. If I had disconnected the battery ground to the frame, that should have killed all power in the vehicle.

Check the 1:00 point at the start of this video that I found linked in another thread here. This video gives a clear view of his JL battery. There is a 13mm nut on a longer stud on the left side in the video, and a 10mm nut on a short stud on the righthand side. The 10mm nut holds a bigger connector onto the battery terminal connector. The larger nut holds a loop connector on top of the larger first connector. Take off the 13mm nut and one cable comes off, the other cable stays connected. If you take off the 10mm nut then essentially both connectors come off. No way to take off the 10mm nut and leave one wire connected to the negative terminal.

My terminal looks just like the one in the video, except I have no extra wires connected to mine. In the video he appears to have a winch connected and a separate smaller red wire, maybe 12 ga or less.

 

[txj2go]

In my experience with my family's vehicles since 1996- a car that is driven daily, in a hot climate, with the battery under the hood, will require a new battery every 36 months. Put the battery under the floorboard like in my daughter's Grand Cherokee, away from the heat under the hood, and it might last closer to 60 months.

As a followup on this, I checked and the batteries I've been buying for my CTS-V are flooded batteries, not AGM. Interstate says they are their best flooded battery, but still not AGM. Some sources on the net say that an AGM battery might last twice as long as a flooded battery, so compared with my experience that would mean about 6 years. I think I've read that some people think the JL OEM battery is pretty good but other people have had failures at well under 36 months which pretty much shows that batteries are a crap shoot and anything can happen. YMMV.

 

[Gee-pah]

It's nighttime now, I can try again tomorrow.

It was a little hard to trace the 2 large wires from the negative terminal because about 6" from the terminal the 2 wires are both wrapped into the same loom.

Okay. So you are at the main battery's negative terminal and you are not sure which of the two wires leads to the ground bar, and which leads to the negative terminal of the ESS/Aux battery.

Fair enough.

Disconnect either. Put your battery tester's positive side on the main battery's positive terminal and its negative side on the wire you just removed. If it shows power you have removed the correct cable (unless the ESS/Aux battery is dead.) If it does not show power you have likely accidentally removed the cable that leads to ground. Reconnect it and disconnect the other factory cable attached to the main battery's negative terminal.

If I had disconnected the battery ground to the frame, that should have killed all power in the vehicle.

There are two cables at the grounding point on the front passenger's quarter panel. I admit it beyond the knowledge in my head right now as to the second ground's connection point at its distal end and purpose/function. But perhaps its existence might explain why your removal of the cable between the main battery's negative terminal and this grounding plate didn't deenergize vehicle appliances.

At the risk of stating that you may know, many vehicle appliance's ground wire travels only to a point of unpainted metal on the vehicle's frame. The frame serves as a conductor to the grounding plate on the front passenger's quarter panel, which in turn heads back to the main battery's negative terminal completing the circuit. But if an appliances has its own dedicated ground that finds its way directly back to the main battery's negative terminal, bypassing the ground plate, it should continue to remain energized despite your removal of the cable between the main battery's negative terminal and the grounding plate, right?

Check the 1:00 point at the start of this video that I found linked in another thread here. This video gives a clear view of his JL battery.

Agreed. His main JL battery, but not his ESS/Aux battery, agreed?

There is a 13mm nut on a longer stud on the left side in the video, and a 10mm nut on a short stud on the righthand side...

@txj2go : I admit that it is hard for me to follow your description of that connected to the main battery's negative terminal, and thus to comment on it. Perhaps things have changed since this video I link below was released, but I've queued it to the point that details the cable in need of temporary disconnection, in order for you to see if your 2018 has the flash we discussed in previous posts on this thread.



As for the video you linked, I'd like to comment on some of the things I don't like about it.

First off, its poster hooks up his jump starter and starts the JL in what seems to be a pretty short time span. In reality, things may take longer because in the JL you may need to keep your jump starting source hooked up to the main battery's terminals for a few minutes--consistent with the manual. It's not that I can make better videos, but I think the poster knows this, and why, and might have best stated it.

By way of explantion, in a conventional 1 battery vehicle this longer wait time normally wouldn't be necessary, but in the 3.6L JL this wait period is all part of charging the ESS/Aux battery--and interestingly enough, brings us full circle to the essence of what is happening and why we are testing, I'll explain.

Go and attempt to crank your 3.6L, and regardless of what, if anything is connected to the main battery's terminals in the way of a jump starter, and such a device, along with the main battery, is going to, for a brief moment, be isolated by the vehicle's PDC, from the ESS/Aux battery. Once this happens, that ESS/Aux battery's voltage is going to be tested prior to crank, all on its "pretty" own. If it lacks sufficient power, the 2018 JL without the flash will not crank.

Second, the poster removes the ESS/Aux battery an acceptable, but not FCA blessed way. FCA suggests doing this via access by the front passenger's tire. Is this critical...I don't think so, and maybe FCA's guidance on this was released after this video was produced.

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