Whither a JL?

[roaniecowpony]

Given your physique, you're just going to have to go around trying different vehicles until you fit one. That should be a fun endeavor all by itself. Vehicles like the Toyota FJ come to mind. Chevy Tahoe, square fender Blazer, Raptor, etc. Lots to chose from.

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[Bulletbill]

Where I live, if you want to wheel, odds are it's wet and muddy. Never had an issue with the sway bar nor saw anyone else with an issue. Not saying it doesn't happen but I wouldn't say they all have "problems".

I was about to make a comment saying exactly the same thing. Maybe there was an issue early on, but I also haven’t had any or heard of anyone who has had an issue with mud and the sway-bar disco.

 

[Bulletbill]

At the risk of walking into a lion's den wearing a suit made of pork chops, I have a serious question to ask. My first-ever (and only) Jeep branded product is my 2018 Grand Cherokee Trailhawk. I've kitted it out with a Warn 10k winch, rock sliders, front and bottom armor, bull bar, sump protection and a couple of lights. It's a beautiful rig and until recently I thought it would handle the trails just fine. But apparently it didn't. On one of my rides I must have hit the front sub frame assembly hard enough to take out both control arms and various bushings, to the tune of $6800 worth of damage (dealer cost; estimate coming next week from a body shop). It got me to thinking of whether a JL or a late-model JK might be better. But here's the issue.

When I went to the dealership to pick it up (refused the estimate) they had a new JLUR in the showroom that I was seriously ogling. I sat in it, and...I didn't like it, at least at first blush. My desire is to build a capable overlanding vehicle, but living near NYC there aren't many back-country overlanding destinations that aren't a 5 day drive away, so the only chances for wheeling in my immediate future will be at the big off-road parks in eastern PA (Rausch Creek and AOAA for those who know the area).

I'm not into serious wheeling, but I would like to be able to take on some moderate trails and a Rubicon should be the ultimate ride for this.

Not judging but where did you damage your modded trail hawk? It should have handled any of the easy to moderate trails at AOAA or even Rausch Creek. If you went into the boulder gardens then I could see that damage happening, but those trails are clearly marked.

As far as over-landing goes, the JLUR is a solid platform to build upon. You should check out @wibornz . He has some great posts of his build and trails he has done.

There are some amazing trails and adventures that are not far from New York that you could rent a wrangler and spend a weekend in it to test the fit and drive comfort. Peters Mill Run has camping areas along the trail and isn’t too far from you: https://www.alltrails.com/trail/us/virginia/peters-mill-run

As others have said, there are a lot of great vehicle options based on what your stated needs are. I off-road frequently with my friend who owns a 6g Bronco. His is a two door and set up for overlanding. We run the same trails, and he has had no issues. The inside feels almost as big as my four door and his seats are by far more comfortable. You may want to test drive one as it may be a better fit for you.

One last thing, if you want even more opportunities to overland you should check out this company. It specializes in overland trips in the North East. https://www.northeastadventurecompany.com/

Good luck on whichever way you go.

 

[Dyolfknip74]

I was about to make a comment saying exactly the same thing. Maybe there was an issue early on, but I also haven’t had any or heard of anyone who has had an issue with mud and the sway-bar disco.

Even the JK version was pretty good.

 

[Wabujitsu]

A third recommendation for an FJ Cruiser. However…modding it will be far more expensive, due to the IFS, possible fender-trimming, etc. I had an FJ before I switched to a JLUR. I don’t overland, however. If I was to do so, I would go with the JLUR. Plenty of space with the back seats down, plus you can pull an over landing trailer with it, as many do.

 

[cornercanyon]

We have used FJ40, FJ60, TJ Sahara, FJCruiser, JKUR, and JLURXR for 'overlanding' trips for years.

With the FJ40 it was just me and maybe a gal friend. We pulled everything out and slept on the ground.
With the TJ and FJCruiser we had expedition racks: too top heavy.
With the FJ60 and JKUR everything fit inside, we still slept out on the ground or in a tent.
With the JLURXR we bring a square drop a bit smaller than @wibornz's. We have been from the Texas Hill Country to the California Coastal Redwoods, on the road 13 weeks or so in the last 12 months. We love the JLURXR and our mods are all things like steel front bumper, ham/gmrs radios, recovery gear and other mounted tools.

The JLURXR is the most comfortable best equipped Wrangler we have every owned. Even considering the Teraflex lifts and such on previous vehicles.

Having said that we also own a Grand Cherokee Overland, and have also owned a Cherokee Trailhawk. Our Grand Cherokee is the nicest vehicle we have ever owned and it also drags our Hiker Trailer nicely. Even down most paths and beaches to primitive camp sites. For light duty trips we take the Grand Cherokee, for real off roading we take the JLURXR.

Without knowing where you wheel, how you damaged your Grand Cherokee, or at least some photos of obstacles you enjoy it is hard to offer opinions beyond: for the money you are focused upon two of the best and most capable vehicles available—

 

[Whaler27]

Our 2016 GC “Overland” was one of the most comfortable highway vehicles we’ve ever owned. Better than most sedans. Great seats, quiet, soft leather, good handling, comfortable ride, etc. We sold it after six years only because it was a diesel, and the gubmint-mandated reflash ruined the performance and fuel economy while causing dash lights to come on all the time. The GC had nothing in common with our Wrangler except the brand name.

Also, if “bigger” means taller, the wrangler may be even less comfortable over time. I’m only 6’3, and my head was almost touching the sound-bar until I modified the seat. My brother is a couple inches taller, and he HAD to have the seat lowered to avoid hitting his head the sound-bar (and lowering the seat isn’t easy because of the leg configuration. Most solutions leave the seat rocked back, which many folks don’t like. )

 

[Shibadog]

Like the guys have said, a Wrangler is far from a great road vehicle-it makes too many compromises for off road capability. You live in the land of long winters and snow. Lockers will not be your friend in on road driving in the snow. Limited slip is better and the full time option is better still. iMHO you need to buy the vehicle for how you will ACTUALLY use it everyday, not for a couple days a year or some “hoped for” great American trip. A stock JL with limited slip and decent tires will go down any moderate trail you may encounter IF the driver does his part. You “can” get stuck/tear up ANY vehicle if you try hard enough. A JL is NOT for everyone, and if you aren’t comfortable in one it’s not going to be a great experience, esp on a long road trip. Do yourself a huge favor and rent one for a week and drive it as you will drive it normally. If you aren’t happy you’ll have saved yourself a Ton of $$.

 

[NJRadioGuy]

Not judging but where did you damage your modded trail hawk? It should have handled any of the easy to moderate trails at AOAA or even Rausch Creek. If you went into the boulder gardens then I could see that damage happening, but those trails are clearly marked.

I'm honestly not sure which trail caused the damage; it's apparently been that way for quite a while. I suspect it was either a blue at AOAA, or Crawler Ridge at Rausch. There were some almighty bangs coming from down below on that one.

As far as over-landing goes, the JLUR is a solid platform to build upon. You should check out @wibornz . He has some great posts of his build and trails he has done.

I will check that out, thanks!

There are some amazing trails and adventures that are not far from New York that you could rent a wrangler and spend a weekend in it to test the fit and drive comfort. Peters Mill Run has camping areas along the trail and isn’t too far from you: https://www.alltrails.com/trail/us/virginia/peters-mill-run

I did PMR in 2021 but just as a day trip. I didn't know camping was permitted on the trail. My plan is to head up Flagpole Knob in late June for amateur radio Field Day (ham radio is my #1 hobby, and I've been at that for 43 years) and spend 4 or 5 nights wild camping there. The GWNF and the Green Mountain Nat'l forest in VT are where I go, with VT the default since it's the closest wild camping to NYC. I'd like to find a group to do some Class IVs with in VT at some point, but after the damage I took, I'm hesitant to do much more than a dirt road in the WK2, unfortunately. That will be an insurance fix and if I were to make another claim for any reason I shudder to think at the insurance premiums. Especially for a trip out to Moab/Ouray.

One last thing, if you want even more opportunities to overland you should check out this company. It specializes in overland trips in the North East. https://www.northeastadventurecompany.com/

Funny you should mention NORA! I'm taking a full-day recovery course with them in April as a pre-requisite for joining. I've heard great things about the group, and ran into a couple of members at OK4WD's open house last year and at the 4X4 Place up Rt. 15 as well (they're the shop that modified my Grand).

 

[JW-UK]

On one of my rides I must have hit the front sub frame assembly hard enough to take out both control arms and various bushings, to the tune of $6800 worth of damage

My desire is to build a capable overlanding vehicle,

I'm not into serious wheeling, but I would like to be able to take on some moderate trails

A GC Trailhawk is a perfectly capable vehicle for Overland trips and moderate trails.

Misuse or abuse of any vehicle will cause damage. (I've done it!) More experience with driving your vehicle, learning it's capabilities and limitations, and perhaps revised expectations, will reduce the damage. The real skill in offroad driving is achieved over time, knowing how to pick a line, when to stack rocks, when to pull the winch, or turn back, that will save you the $6800 repair bills.

A JL isn't for you, you don't like it now and won't like it more with time. A Rubicon is overkill for what you described.
My advice would be stick with the Trailhawk and find out how to get the best out of it.

 

[NJRadioGuy]

A GC Trailhawk is a perfectly capable vehicle for Overland trips and moderate trails.

Misuse or abuse of any vehicle will cause damage. (I've done it!) More experience with driving your vehicle, learning it's capabilities and limitations, and perhaps revised expectations, will reduce the damage. The real skill in offroad driving is achieved over time, knowing how to pick a line, when to stack rocks, when to pull the winch, or turn back, that will save you the $6800 repair bills.

A JL isn't for you, you don't like it now and won't like it more with time. A Rubicon is overkill for what you described.
My advice would be stick with the Trailhawk and find out how to get the best out of it.

The 'Hawk is a heck of an impressive vehicle and I absolutely adore driving it, but yes, it absolutely has its limitations, even in off-road 2 height. For camping it's certainly serviceable, however the way the cargo bay is set out it's far from ideal. A 4Runner would definitely perform better in that regard; I've been out with them and you could fit half the Grand Canyon in those suckers...at 9 MPG or less. An FJ would be a decent choice too (again, because Toyota), but dang do those hold their value even more than Jeeps...and at the end of the day it'd still be an old rig. Import a pre-DEF Diesel Troopy, fix it up and fully kit it out? A dream I could never afford, sadly.

As for comfort, I feel a bit better about it now. I took a 20 minute test drive (pavement, stoplights, etc...because New Jersey, that's why), and I got to love the way it handled. I need to see how it feels at speed. Sure the steering wasn't as tight as my WK2 but that's not a biggie. It was on factory 35s, and I was the first person who'd ever driven it (16 miles on the clock after I hoisted myself up into it). I don't love the seats, and the cabin was definitely loud at 55 MPH., but I loved the feeling of being up high, and it was far more comfortable to drive than I had initially feared. Since nobody will ever drive my rig except me, having a power 6-way seat is kinda pointless, but I would like to be able to slide it back an extra inch or two.

Next step will be to rent one if I can find anybody who rents Wranglers around here, and see what my opinions are after driving it for a few days.

As for the WK2 and revising my expectations, that's frankly why I'm looking at the JLU platform. I'd rather have more Jeep than I regularly need or would use, but have it ready to tackle anything I would want to use it on out west. The problem is living where I do, the only off-roading available to me within 3 hours are two rock crawling parks, so if I want dirt under my tires at all for 48 weeks a year, it will have to be there, and will thus need to handle that kind of thing. Dana 44s rather than 30s, and the ability to lock and disconnect would all sure be nice. But day to day it will just be a pavement princess.

 

[Gripster]

You've fixed the death wobble, right?

Well, it has not returned if that is what you mean. I checked the torque at lower and upper ball joints and installed a Steersmarts track bar and frame brace. Dealer replaced the oil dripping dampener under warranty.

I cannot with any confidence tell my wife it is fixed until I upgrade the steering knuckles and ball joints and install a Fox dampener. Even then I wont lie but will only say "it should be fixed and I would be very surprised if it happens again".

I wish Toyota made a 2 door small equivalent to the JL so I could trade for a brand with better reliability. We bought her the 2 door JLR specifically looking for a small vehicle with excellent visibility and a tall seating position.

 

[CulpMinMn]

Here’s my two cents:

Rent a wrangler for a weekend and drive the hell out of it. Take it in the highways, byways, and in the city. I’d rather spend the money on a weekend getaway and renting a vehicle that I’m considering buying and finding out it’s not the right fit, than signing on the bottom line of a vehicle that you may end up disliking in the future

I still own my 14 WK2 Overland, I love it and it’s so much better on long interstate drives.

The last two road trips (Virginia to Texas) I have taken my 21 JLURD. My diesel wrangler sips on the highway, but it’s no where as comfty as the WK2.

cheers

 

[NJRadioGuy]

I wish it were that easy. Nobody rents them around here (I've checked). 4WD vehicles if offered are typically pickups for work sites, etc. NJ is the least Jeep friendly state in the country in terms of off-road, so nobody stocks them around here.

I enjoyed the one I test drove, but I agree, having one for a few days kitted out as I'd like it to start with (Rubicon on 35s as a start) would go a long in the go/no-go decision.

 

[unsavory]

I wish it were that easy. Nobody rents them around here (I've checked). 4WD vehicles if offered are typically pickups for work sites, etc. NJ is the least Jeep friendly state in the country in terms of off-road, so nobody stocks them around here.

I enjoyed the one I test drove, but I agree, having one for a few days kitted out as I'd like it to start with (Rubicon on 35s as a start) would go a long in the go/no-go decision.

Just checked, and you can rent JL Wranglers on Turo in Jersey.

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