Auto or stick?

[Capricorn]

While the manual transmission is better than that of JK, JL's 8 speed auto is awesome. Plus with auto, you have the choice of diesel or 2.0L turbo.

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[jbcrane]

I can't tell if you're referring to two types of people or describing one kind of person. I drive an auto and prefer a stick.

Me neither... just conjecture here but maybe, ‘prefer a stick enough to drive a stick…’ maybe, ‘you can have my stick when you pry it from my cold, stiff clawed hand…’ maybe, ‘you’d never catch me in an auto if a stick were available…’ maybe, ‘as long as I have two feet and one hand I’ll drive a stick…’ my wife just asked if I had an opinion about manual transmissions. Nodding my head yes.

 

[jessedacri]

The 8 speed auto is one of the best automatic transmissions arguably in production right now. Just try to find a negative review - it's blistering fast to make decisions and is always where it needs to be with no hunting, it's got good ratios, and the manual shifting mode is sharp, quick to respond to your action, and crackly on upshifts like a German DSG gearbox. It doesn't force you to change gears if you're too low or too high and allows you to peg the motor at redline if you so choose rather than forcing an upshift. Not advocating you to do that, but it shows the extent of the manual mode's lack of nannies.

It's also relatively bulletproof, has variations across tons of manufacturers, and isn't operating anywhere close to the limit of its hp/torque rating.

The 6MT on the other hand has clutch plate overheating issues that were fixed by a software update that dumbs down the torque figures of the engine rather than an actual fix, and is riiiiight at its maximum hp/torque limit. I just am not sure I'd trust it wheeling a heavy rig loaded for camping/overlanding on big tires, and I'm not satisfied with the software fix as a concept.

All things considered, I love manual transmissions and most of my past vehicles were stick, but I would never give up the 8AT in the JL mated to the 3.6. Especially for technical wheeling / rock crawling type scenarios. Stick it in 4L and you've got a transmission geared for precision vehicle control from anywhere between 0 and 25mph without constantly rowing gears or coming in and out of 4L based on different parts of the trail.

 

[Grayone]

I also have a BMW GSA for those dirt roads! Great bike!! On my 2015 when going over rough roads the stick would gyrate so hard I thought the bloody thing was going to come un done and hit me in the...well, hit me where I didn't want to get hit! True the stick is way cheaper than the auto. I do not want to regear. I guess this time around I will try the auto. Worse case scenario, the 2024 models are only 18 months away and I go through vehicles like most people change socks! Thank you for all the thoughtful replies. It was a great welcome to the board.

 

[Mtrctylarry]

Just traded my 392 for a TRX. Needed a Jeep in the stable so ordered a 2 door Rubicon with Auto and 4.88 gears. 35's in the future. I am having second thoughts about the auto. My 2015 Hard Rock was a stick and it had less than desirable throws and precision. But I do like driving a stick. Query: is the current manual better than that in the 2015. Will I sacrifice performance with the V6 and manual compared to the auto? First post and glad to be here! Included my latest toy.

Always liked a manual trans. But seems to me that very few car manufactures make a good manual gear box anymore. Auto is definetly the best way to go these day's. And NO the currennt manual trans is just as mushy as the last gen.
Happy trails with your new toy

 

[unsavory]

Just traded my 392 for a TRX. Needed a Jeep in the stable so ordered a 2 door Rubicon with Auto and 4.88 gears. 35's in the future. I am having second thoughts about the auto. My 2015 Hard Rock was a stick and it had less than desirable throws and precision. But I do like driving a stick. Query: is the current manual better than that in the 2015. Will I sacrifice performance with the V6 and manual compared to the auto? First post and glad to be here! Included my latest toy.

Don't do it! You will regret the manual, as I did. Hence why I sold mine after 3 years, and have an auto on order. Just couldn't live with it any longer.

I too, enjoy driving manual cars, and went that route with the Jeep. You might consider that as well. However, any delusions of grandeur that you currently have around that sporty feeling of rowing your own gears, downshifting into corners, and keeping the engine revs in its optimal power band, will very quickly be deflated by the reality that these vehicles are not Porsches.

The manual option in this vehicle has several shortcomings:

• The Pentastar V6 has absolutely no low end torque, and without a torque converter it will lug at anything below 2200 RPM. This may not sound like a big deal, but trust me. Revving the engine out constantly just to get it to go anywhere will get old fast. You will also need to run 91 octane fuel to keep it from pinging.
• The gear ratio spreads are all wrong. 2nd is too short, 3rd is too tall, and forget about using 5th at normal speeds. 6th could only ever maintain a constant speed above 75 and on flat or downhill grade. I regeared to 4.88 gears on 35s, and only bothered with 5th above 70 to 75 MPH.
• The transmission was noisy shifting from 1st to 2nd, and 2nd to 3rd. 2nd to 3rd would sometimes grind if you didn't wait until the RPMs were just right. Which brings me to the worst part.
• The Rev Hang. Because these engines have no low end torque, you have to rev it to above 3500 RPM before shifting. But when you let off the gas, the RPMS hang there for a very long time. And so your shifts will be very slow, and you will lose speed while waiting for this to happen. Shift too early in the 1st through 3rd gear range, and you will grind the gears. Hated it!

Lots of other reasons have already been mentioned. But in the end, I decided to switch to the auto because everyone that has one, absolutely loves it. It has more gears, a torque converter to help the anemic V6 at lower RPMS, and generally extremely reliable and trouble free.

 

[Traveller128]

The 8 speed auto is one of the best automatic transmissions arguably in production right now. Just try to find a negative review - it's blistering fast to make decisions and is always where it needs to be with no hunting, it's got good ratios, and the manual shifting mode is sharp, quick to respond to your action, and crackly on upshifts like a German DSG gearbox. It doesn't force you to change gears if you're too low or too high and allows you to peg the motor at redline if you so choose rather than forcing an upshift. Not advocating you to do that, but it shows the extent of the manual mode's lack of nannies.

It's also relatively bulletproof, has variations across tons of manufacturers, and isn't operating anywhere close to the limit of its hp/torque rating.

The 6MT on the other hand has clutch plate overheating issues that were fixed by a software update that dumbs down the torque figures of the engine rather than an actual fix, and is riiiiight at its maximum hp/torque limit. I just am not sure I'd trust it wheeling a heavy rig loaded for camping/overlanding on big tires, and I'm not satisfied with the software fix as a concept.

All things considered, I love manual transmissions and most of my past vehicles were stick, but I would never give up the 8AT in the JL mated to the 3.6. Especially for technical wheeling / rock crawling type scenarios. Stick it in 4L and you've got a transmission geared for precision vehicle control from anywhere between 0 and 25mph without constantly rowing gears or coming in and out of 4L based on different parts of the trail.

I've been all over the web looking up input torque specs for the Aisin D478, and there's reference to a data sheet showing 345 lb/ft (AL6) that the link no longer works for. Aisin changed their websites, and trying to find anything for that transmission is difficult, to say the least.

There was more than one torque rating for the unit, 370 Nm (272 lb/ft) was the lowest rating, there are other higher ratings including 300, and 345 lb/ft. Trying to figure out which one is the issue.

I will find it eventually, the swap guys I've found are quoting the 345 number for use in engine/trans swaps.

 

[RagTopDeluxe]

As mentioned, the AT in the JL is fantastic. If you’re leaning towards “lazy,” as you say, you’ll enjoy it.

I loved rowing my own gears in my Miatas and husband’s Boxster, but am happy I went with the AT in my JL (never mind I had to due to my shoulder ).

 

[BuyHold]

The JL/JT 6-speed is a flawed design. It’s on the third recall. The “fix” is to retard power when it begins to overheat. Ridiculous.

What if I told you that Jeep also has limp modes (i.e. power retardation) that are triggered in their Ecodiesel and the 2.0L Turbo? Both have auto transmissions. I would also assume that the 3.6L with Auto trans also has similar detune triggers for variety of engine error codes though I can't say that I have read any posts from people. Point is that detune isn't necessarily a bad solution.

What I think is the problem with the manual situation is that the issue came up in the first place and that Jeep had to do a recall period. Shouldn't have ever been a problem for an old technology like a manual transmission and clutch. All that, I don't disagree, the auto is better and Jeep engineers have not invested the same amount of energy into perfecting the manual experience which includes the clutch!

I would still buy the manual because my experience thus far with it ('21) has been really good. Can't go wrong with the Auto though.

 

[jessedacri]

What if I told you that Jeep also has limp modes (i.e. power retardation) that are triggered in their Ecodiesel and the 2.0L Turbo? Both have auto transmissions. I would also assume that the 3.6L with Auto trans also has similar detune triggers for variety of engine error codes though I can't say that I have read any posts from people. Point is that detune isn't necessarily a bad solution.

What I think is the problem with the manual situation is that the issue came up in the first place and that Jeep had to do a recall period. Shouldn't have ever been a problem for an old technology like a manual transmission and clutch. All that, I don't disagree, the auto is better and Jeep engineers have not invested the same amount of energy into perfecting the manual experience which includes the clutch!

I would still buy the manual because my experience thus far with it ('21) has been really good. Can't go wrong with the Auto though.

IMO the difference between there being limp modes programmed into the other drivetrains and the one in the MT is what it takes to trigger it is much more rudimentary with the MT clutch pack software patch. Of course the 3.6/8AT has limp modes somewhere in the code, as does probably every vehicle and drivetrain combo but it's mostly triggered via actual hardware failure, i.e. no readings coming back from a sensor, some ignition system faults, etc. The manual transmission doesn't even have a temperature sensor in the bell housing so there's no way other than for FCA to be predicting the clutch plate temperature based on certain driving scenarios, and engaging a detune after particular driving patterns, no failed sensors or other components required.

I agree it should never have happened with such a simple mechanism as your average manual transmission is, but I think the whole issue here is that it's essentially the only "parts bin" manual transmission that FCA had in their stable compatible with this application that didn't require them to engineer something all-new or spec something out from a new vendor, and this unit happens to be right at the limit of its spec. Vehicle manufacturers don't really want to invest tons of R&D into new manual transmissions when the volume is so low. I just feel it's a weak point in what should be a dependable drivetrain on a vehicle that's going to take you 20, 30, 100 miles from the nearest paved road. I'm by no means calling it total junk, but it just doesn't pass the sniff test for me.

 

[Zandcwhite]

You will absolutely be sacrificing performance with the manual, Jeeps solution to melting clutches and exploding flywheels was to simply de tune the weakest engine offering they have in order to make their crap clutch survive. How much it is de tuned is not clear, but I’m guessing it had to be fairly substantial as they did nothing else to fix the weak/failure prone parts.

 

[Omarius]

I don’t know of any manual transmission where you can ride the clutch and not have adverse effects. I don’t know how reasonable it is to increase the thermal capacity to a point where it accounts for every edge case. It’s pretty novel that they have a closed loop system to try and make it idiot proof. Engines have knock sensors to retard timing in case of bad fuel or high intake air temps etc etc. I’m a software engineer so this stuff is not unreasonable to me…

 

[The_Skyo]

I have only had it for a bit over a month but I'm enjoying my manual rubicon with 4.88s.
If I could have ordered an auto 3.6 without the etorque batteries I may have, but that made my choice clear and I'm good with it. Gives me something to play around with and learn.

 

[Tethmes]

I like manuals so I bought a stick. I grew up on old trucks with M/T's and that's how I drive this day to day. It's not a sports car so don't expect it to feel or act like one. That said the manual with the 3.6 will still certainly get up and out of it's own way when you need it to (a LOT more than those old trucks I grew up on). The clutch is light and kind of annoying to get used to, but once you do it's perfectly fine. For me, it took about 1500 miles to fully stop jerking shifts, but it's never once grinded.

If you have any reservations about that, then buy an auto. It's also a great choice.

Buy what makes you happy. Either way you're in a wrangler and that's really what matters most.

It's really that simple. Don't overthink it.

 

[CaJLMetalHead]

Side note not related to the mechanical side of the auto/stick debate...

Do you drive long-distance with a partner perhaps?.. I once was not feeling good while driving but I had to keep going, my girlfriend at the time did most of the driving while I was recovering in the passenger seat... well.. I was glad I had Auto transmission since we know few people nowadays drive stick (at least where I live and most of the US of A) ... although it was not an emergency.. .it got me thinking... What if it was an emergency and my partner was unable to drive stick to save the day?... scary...

I love to drive stick but I got a good offer when I went shopping.. I wanted stick but the discounted Auto JLU sealed the deal, besides.. it was impossible to buy stick at the time and I wanted my JLU like yesterday! I wish I had money to buy a second JLU with manual transmission ! LOL

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