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jhonn236_AZ
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this thread brings back a few memories - I was on the exact same dilemma years ago... here's a recap:
- Had a two door JK before I got married, and loved it... then I got married and wife wanted something more spacious so we got rid of my Jeep and we got a 2016 T4R trail premium (or TRD off-road now I think) with all bells and whistles (sunroof, rock crawling, KDSS, leather, Nav, etc.). I loved every part of it until the JL came out! Traded in the 2016 T4R for a 2018 JLUR
Pros JL vs T4R:
- Interior design. The 4runner always felt like my dads old truck. Super outdated interior, the infotainment system really suckz ballz and it just felt very 2000's - but comparable to a JK... The new design on the JL just knocked it out of the park.
- Looks. C'mon - a JL Rubicon looks waaay cooler than a 4runner, even the TRD PRO (except the cement color).
- Ability to modify on the cheaper side (in a few years, at least). 4runners are pricey to modify since there are not that "many" vendors that make products for the 4runner - at least compared to the amount of Jeep vendors. So their prices are way higher.
- Removable doors and top. can't beat this point in any way, shape or form. it's just amazing, period.
Pros T4R vs JL:
- Comfort - I'm 6'2 235 lbs and in long road-trips, and regardless of seating position - the JL is very uncomfortable.
- Cabin noise. Wranglers are just way too loud, soft or hard top.
- Interior cargo space - The JL literally has none! whereas the 4runner has space on every single door, and not to mention the cargo area is considerably larger.
- Less drama - honestly, nothing is wrong with the 4runners. Take it off the lot and all you'll need to do is change the oil. Yes, they're old; yes, their V6 5 speed transmission sucks; yes, they're slow on the road. But once you get pass that hump and get used to that, they are very reliable.
- Less expenses in the long run - since there aren't that many aftermarket products to buy, and the ones that are out there are expensive - you get to spend less
The Jeep is just a black hole... once you start with your mods, you'll never be done.
Similarities between JL and T4R:
- Gas mileage. They both suck.
- 4x4 capabilities - unless you are a serious rock crawler, both will take you anywhere (with the proper tires).
Both of these vehicles will get you where you want to be though, I think it's a matter of driving both and making an unbiased decision and stick to it for 5-7 years.
- Had a two door JK before I got married, and loved it... then I got married and wife wanted something more spacious so we got rid of my Jeep and we got a 2016 T4R trail premium (or TRD off-road now I think) with all bells and whistles (sunroof, rock crawling, KDSS, leather, Nav, etc.). I loved every part of it until the JL came out! Traded in the 2016 T4R for a 2018 JLUR
Pros JL vs T4R:
- Interior design. The 4runner always felt like my dads old truck. Super outdated interior, the infotainment system really suckz ballz and it just felt very 2000's - but comparable to a JK... The new design on the JL just knocked it out of the park.
- Looks. C'mon - a JL Rubicon looks waaay cooler than a 4runner, even the TRD PRO (except the cement color).
- Ability to modify on the cheaper side (in a few years, at least). 4runners are pricey to modify since there are not that "many" vendors that make products for the 4runner - at least compared to the amount of Jeep vendors. So their prices are way higher.
- Removable doors and top. can't beat this point in any way, shape or form. it's just amazing, period.
Pros T4R vs JL:
- Comfort - I'm 6'2 235 lbs and in long road-trips, and regardless of seating position - the JL is very uncomfortable.
- Cabin noise. Wranglers are just way too loud, soft or hard top.
- Interior cargo space - The JL literally has none! whereas the 4runner has space on every single door, and not to mention the cargo area is considerably larger.
- Less drama - honestly, nothing is wrong with the 4runners. Take it off the lot and all you'll need to do is change the oil. Yes, they're old; yes, their V6 5 speed transmission sucks; yes, they're slow on the road. But once you get pass that hump and get used to that, they are very reliable.
- Less expenses in the long run - since there aren't that many aftermarket products to buy, and the ones that are out there are expensive - you get to spend less
The Jeep is just a black hole... once you start with your mods, you'll never be done.Similarities between JL and T4R:
- Gas mileage. They both suck.
- 4x4 capabilities - unless you are a serious rock crawler, both will take you anywhere (with the proper tires).
Both of these vehicles will get you where you want to be though, I think it's a matter of driving both and making an unbiased decision and stick to it for 5-7 years.
garfieldtcat
Well-Known Member
I just traded a 14 4Runner Limited for my 19 Rubicon. I hate to say it on a Jeep forum, but the 4Runner was the better car.
Having the full time AWD system on the LTD, with road tires, in any kind of bad weather is much better than the Jeep.
It has a lot more trunk space, especially with the seats down and when they are down, there are no gaps for paws to fall into like the Jeep.
If you ever need to tow anything, the 4Runner will tow a bit more and you won't need a 5" drop hitch or have to worry about the trailer jack hitting the spare wheel.
The 4Runner is way more comfortable on the road (but still worse than my old Grand Cherokee or a say an Audi Q7), has ventilated seats (man I miss those!), is easier to get in and out of being lower with bigger doors and has better visibility. I really liked being able to rewind the radio too. I wish Jeep would add that to UConnect. Added bonus, you don't need a drill holes in your roof to add a rack that can carry some weight. I drove cross country in my 4Runner and it was very comfortable for the trip. I wouldn't want to do that trip again in my Jeep.
There really is no comparison between the two. My 4Runner with every option checked had a sticker of $45k. My Jeep with all the options had a sticker of $59k (granted I bought the 4Runner 4 years ago). If you're looking at a Limited, I assume you're like me and would want all the toys. So you're paying a lot more money for a less reliable, less practical vehicle.
That said, I knew all these things going in and I don't regret buying the Rubicon one bit!
Yes it sucks on the road. I get buffeting inside even with the hard top on and all the doors and windows closed. It's loud (the wind noise is especially horrible), it wobbles around on the road so you have to make steering corrections constantly, it really doesn't like cross winds, it's cramped and doesn't have some silly things that any car should have (auto up power window, electric seats...).
But the Jeep just looks better, that radio/nav/audio system is night and day better, has much better lights (with the LEDs), it's quicker with a better engine/transmission and it can go places I wouldn't dream of going in a 4Runner. I'll put it this way... I would take the 4Runner anywhere on road in any weather. It does just fine off road on easy terrain, but I never really trusted it not to get stuck or rip off one of its giant plastic bumpers. On the other hand, I would take the jeep anywhere off road in any weather, but I really don't like driving it around in 2WD in the wet or snow/ice. I live in the desert now though, so not much rain, snow or ice to worry about here anymore.
On paper it seems like you should be looking at a Grand Cherokee. In reality though, if you buy a 4Runner or a Grand Cherokee or anything else, as good and all as they are, you'll always wish you bought the Wrangler! So my vote is to throw logic to the wind and buy a Wrangler MOAB which supposedly rides a little bit better than the Rubicon (although it's even louder on the road with the KM2 MTR tires on it), will still kick ass off road, has all the creature comforts and gives you 4WD Auto for bad weather. You'll be happier in the end that you did.
Having the full time AWD system on the LTD, with road tires, in any kind of bad weather is much better than the Jeep.
It has a lot more trunk space, especially with the seats down and when they are down, there are no gaps for paws to fall into like the Jeep.
If you ever need to tow anything, the 4Runner will tow a bit more and you won't need a 5" drop hitch or have to worry about the trailer jack hitting the spare wheel.
The 4Runner is way more comfortable on the road (but still worse than my old Grand Cherokee or a say an Audi Q7), has ventilated seats (man I miss those!), is easier to get in and out of being lower with bigger doors and has better visibility. I really liked being able to rewind the radio too. I wish Jeep would add that to UConnect. Added bonus, you don't need a drill holes in your roof to add a rack that can carry some weight. I drove cross country in my 4Runner and it was very comfortable for the trip. I wouldn't want to do that trip again in my Jeep.
There really is no comparison between the two. My 4Runner with every option checked had a sticker of $45k. My Jeep with all the options had a sticker of $59k (granted I bought the 4Runner 4 years ago). If you're looking at a Limited, I assume you're like me and would want all the toys. So you're paying a lot more money for a less reliable, less practical vehicle.
That said, I knew all these things going in and I don't regret buying the Rubicon one bit!
Yes it sucks on the road. I get buffeting inside even with the hard top on and all the doors and windows closed. It's loud (the wind noise is especially horrible), it wobbles around on the road so you have to make steering corrections constantly, it really doesn't like cross winds, it's cramped and doesn't have some silly things that any car should have (auto up power window, electric seats...).
But the Jeep just looks better, that radio/nav/audio system is night and day better, has much better lights (with the LEDs), it's quicker with a better engine/transmission and it can go places I wouldn't dream of going in a 4Runner. I'll put it this way... I would take the 4Runner anywhere on road in any weather. It does just fine off road on easy terrain, but I never really trusted it not to get stuck or rip off one of its giant plastic bumpers. On the other hand, I would take the jeep anywhere off road in any weather, but I really don't like driving it around in 2WD in the wet or snow/ice. I live in the desert now though, so not much rain, snow or ice to worry about here anymore.
On paper it seems like you should be looking at a Grand Cherokee. In reality though, if you buy a 4Runner or a Grand Cherokee or anything else, as good and all as they are, you'll always wish you bought the Wrangler! So my vote is to throw logic to the wind and buy a Wrangler MOAB which supposedly rides a little bit better than the Rubicon (although it's even louder on the road with the KM2 MTR tires on it), will still kick ass off road, has all the creature comforts and gives you 4WD Auto for bad weather. You'll be happier in the end that you did.
angrynewyorker
Well-Known Member
I wouldn’t take a limited anywhere off-road either as it’s not designed for anything serious. My TRD Pro on the other hand, while not Rubicon capable, is capable enough with the locking rear diff, much improved approach and departure angles over the limited, and the atrac which will all take me anywhere I need to go. I’m still not 100% sold on the crawl control, but there must be something to it as Ford now has their version in the Raptor and the Ranger FX4. The looks thing is subjective. I’ll post a pic of my previous TRD Pro and the wrangler I traded in for it side by side. To me the 4runner looks a lot tougher, but looks is all just personal preference.
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Jcsieman
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I went through the exact same decision a year ago when I preordered my JLUS. I have two younger girls and was coming from a new Mercedes so I was worried about safety. I tried to talk myself into the 4Runner because it is safer for them, has more cargo room, has a greater towing capacity, and is more reliable. Ultimately, though, I couldnt talk myself into it. I couldn’t justify getting a $40k+ SUV that is so dated. Toyota should be ashamed with how dated they allowed the 4Runner to become. The JL is more fun, more advanced, has WAY more tech, has a more timeless look, allows more options for customizing and making it “your own”, and is more put together. Plus, you can take the top and doors off!
There are only two reasons I think you should get the 4Runner over the JL right now....1) it is your primary vehicle and you do a lot of traffic driving. If so, the 4Runner is safer with less road noise for kids in the backseat. 2) you need the extra cargo room/towing capacity.
For me, my JL is not our main family car. It’s more like a fun around the town car where there is little risk of a side impact at a significant speed.....and our kids are in car seats anyway. I didn’t need the extra cargo room/greater towing capacity, and although Jeep sucks at quality, I did enough research to convince myself the Jeep is mechanically sound if you go with the Pentastar engine.
Until Toyota updates the 4Runner like Jeep did the Wrangler, the JL is the winner by far.
jedisrus
Well-Known Member
I started looking at Wranglers a little before the Summer of 2018. Decided it just might be perfect for me but wanted to do my due diligence on other SUVs in the market. There just isn't anything else out there that even comes close.
That said, if I had two kids in car seats, there is no way I would have gotten the Wrangler. But I also wouldn't have gotten the 4Runner. It is just too dated to want for the next 5+ years. My wife's 2017 Honda Pilot is perfect for that and if I needed a second vehicle to fit the same bill I would go with a Trailhawk.
I would think you need to put a lot of weight on how easy it is to get the kids in and out of the back seat, but if the only thing really keeping you from a Wrangler is a question of reliability and concerns on the steering, go get you a Wrangler ASAP. I think the steering complaints are skewed and most Wranglers that have reliability issues are heavily abused off-road and it doesn't seem that you would be doing that.
Just my 2 cents.
That said, if I had two kids in car seats, there is no way I would have gotten the Wrangler. But I also wouldn't have gotten the 4Runner. It is just too dated to want for the next 5+ years. My wife's 2017 Honda Pilot is perfect for that and if I needed a second vehicle to fit the same bill I would go with a Trailhawk.
I would think you need to put a lot of weight on how easy it is to get the kids in and out of the back seat, but if the only thing really keeping you from a Wrangler is a question of reliability and concerns on the steering, go get you a Wrangler ASAP. I think the steering complaints are skewed and most Wranglers that have reliability issues are heavily abused off-road and it doesn't seem that you would be doing that.
Just my 2 cents.
Jeepo
Member
I have both, Rubicon and a TRD Off Road. I use the Rubicon if I'm by myself and I use the 4Runner or Ram 1500 when I have my family with me. The Rubicon is my go to work and home ride. on long rides, the 4Runner is more relaxed and smoother. The base TRD Off Road does not have a sun roof.
Other than regular service, I have not taken the 4Runner for any other reason in the past year and half. I have the Rubicon for the past 4 months and took it to the dealership three times, for the same reason, loose/wandering/jeep thing steering. I still have the loose steering. I still love my jeep though.
I've taken both to mild off roading, both performed very well, although, I used the crawl control in the 4Runner, just to try it. The crawl control is awesome, and the Rubicon is like a tank, especially in 4L.
To me, it's a preference on your end. If I have to keep just one because of of a growing family, I will take the 4Runner, but I will be butt hurt to give up the jeep.
Other than regular service, I have not taken the 4Runner for any other reason in the past year and half. I have the Rubicon for the past 4 months and took it to the dealership three times, for the same reason, loose/wandering/jeep thing steering. I still have the loose steering. I still love my jeep though.
I've taken both to mild off roading, both performed very well, although, I used the crawl control in the 4Runner, just to try it. The crawl control is awesome, and the Rubicon is like a tank, especially in 4L.
To me, it's a preference on your end. If I have to keep just one because of of a growing family, I will take the 4Runner, but I will be butt hurt to give up the jeep.
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Trauma PA
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As others have mentioned, the 4Runner is definitely dated. It is lacking technology that other SUVs offer. My TRD Off Road premium package has a crappy navigation/stereo unit. There are no memory seats or climate control air conditioning. There is not a telescopic steering wheel. After 1 year the leather at the 12 o'clock position on my steering wheel started to peel. You can look at my truck the wrong way and the paint chips. LED headlights are not offered. I could keep going on with it's shortcomings but I think I'm getting my point across. But for some reason, Toyota 4Runner sales for 2018 were the most for any year since the 5th generation 4Runner was released in 2009. What does that tell you?
dfwmountainbiker
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The 4runner is being re-introduced in the 2021 model year. Just a heads up http://suvsandtrucks.com/2021-toyota-4runner/
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BrntWS6
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I test drove two 2018 JLs before ordering a '19 and the steering was extremely tight in both. Each tracked straight on the highway in the middle lane. Honestly i thought they handled better than my wifes SUV. Both were hard tops and quiet inside with no headliner.
Only thing that was weird and is going to take getting used to is the small windshield and the cabin in the drivers seat seems a bit claustrophobic. But i did not know that the steering column could telescope so that may have helped.
Honestly i did not even consider any other vehicles because none compare to it in the fun factor.
Only thing that was weird and is going to take getting used to is the small windshield and the cabin in the drivers seat seems a bit claustrophobic. But i did not know that the steering column could telescope so that may have helped.
Honestly i did not even consider any other vehicles because none compare to it in the fun factor.
ThirtyOne
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Very interested to see what they do. The market has basically come to them and they haven't done anything with it. If they just update the tech and powertrains they should have a real winner.
I'm a top-off doors-off guy so it's not really appealing to me. But if I was looking for that kind of vehicle I would go Grand Cherokee right now. But update the damn thing and I would definitely look at the 4Runner.
It's like when I was looking at a 2016 JKU. Just too much money for something that felt 10 years old the day you bought it.
Ravager
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I would expect the TRD to be very good. It's competing with the Bronco also, which will be topless IIRC. Maybe not the first year but the second and third for each vehicle would add some competition to Jeep.
Todkavonic
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I traded in my 4Runner Limited for the Rubicon.
After reading this entire thread and agreeing with pretty much every bit of it, all I have to add is that the Toyota just felt sort of "meh."
It was capable and reliable and dependable and so entirely, soul-suckingly, God-awfully boring I could hardly stand it. So boring. So, so boring.
I don't regret the trade, not one bit. That said, I don't have two young children, and, given that reality, I would strongly suggest that you take your whole family to both a Toyota dealership and to a Jeep dealership, load them all up with all their gear, and take a real-world test drive. Maybe try and convince the salesperson to let you have the vehicle for few hours. I suspect, at this point in your life, that you'll be happier with the Toyota.
That's ok. Jeep's not going anywhere.
After reading this entire thread and agreeing with pretty much every bit of it, all I have to add is that the Toyota just felt sort of "meh."
It was capable and reliable and dependable and so entirely, soul-suckingly, God-awfully boring I could hardly stand it. So boring. So, so boring.
I don't regret the trade, not one bit. That said, I don't have two young children, and, given that reality, I would strongly suggest that you take your whole family to both a Toyota dealership and to a Jeep dealership, load them all up with all their gear, and take a real-world test drive. Maybe try and convince the salesperson to let you have the vehicle for few hours. I suspect, at this point in your life, that you'll be happier with the Toyota.
That's ok. Jeep's not going anywhere.
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ThirtyOne
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I can tell several tragic stories about people who would have been saved by this kind of tech. Remember the stupid/lazy drivers usually are not the victims. I can tell you for a fact you’re indignation does nothing to console the victims’ loved ones.
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