Winch Safety Question

[AmericanPatriot100]

That’s a bad spot to stand

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[Ratbert]

It turned out fine. Comments are a mix of good job and bro don’t stand there. His response Is to tell everyone to calm down. He says his dyneema winch rope “stores no energy” and will “drop like a dead snake“.

This seems to defy what I remember in physics class, maybe less weight and less energy but, no energy, I’m struggling with that. Maybe i slept through that part of class.

I guess he's assuming the line will break cleanly and not something with mass connected at either end. That's a massive gamble.

 

[WXman]

Synthetic rope can still cause injury. The amount of force involved is incredible and when things go bad, they can go bad and be done before anyone can even begin to react.

Set yourself up for success so you can enjoy that beer at the end of the day and share the fun story, instead of being the main character in a sad one.

Treat synthetic rope like it's steel rope. Take the 30 seconds to throw something on it and don't stand right next to it.

Worse case scenario is your setup takes an extra minute or so, and you develop good habits for any situation no matter the material.

This. I don't understand why people won't just spend a few extra seconds. A few extra seconds for safety can save a medivac trip to an ER.

 

[zouch]

i was thankful that in the 2 recovery efforts i was part of last week in Moab that we actually had someone with a Winch Blanket to throw on the rope.
that person had seen a winch rope break, and described it as "ugly".

getting people to stand out of harms way was more of a challenge than anything we did in the recoveries.

 

[ppjcs]

This is a screen shot from a video taken during an active winch situation. The Jeep in the foreground is actively pulling with what appears to be a synthetic winch line. Would you stand along the winch line like this? Is there a good reason to do so as opposed to standing somewhere else? The person closest to the Jeep being recovered is directing the recovery. The person behind him appears to be simply taking a video with his phone. Seeing it makes me uncomfortable and seems contrary to what I’ve been taught, but I’m not very experienced. If you are experienced in recoveries, your thoughts?

I would never stand in the area of the line. I was struck in the legs when a line snapped when I was in the Navy and spent the next two days in sick bay with huge welts on my legs. Luckily no bones broken. When a synthetic or even a metal line snaps there is no idea of where it is going. My winch has a l,ong enough remote control cable that I can sit in my Jeep when winching.

 

[Terrymo]

i was thankful that in the 2 recovery efforts i was part of last week in Moab that we actually had someone with a Winch Blanket to throw on the rope.
that person had seen a winch rope break, and described it as "ugly".

getting people to stand out of harms way was more of a challenge than anything we did in the recoveries.

I keep an ARB winch line dampener in the Jeep 24/7. It takes up very little space. I wheel with some very experienced people and have yet to see anyone use anything on a synthetic winch line. Im the rookie so I stand back and keep my mouth shut. Maybe that’s wrong.

 

[Terrymo]

I would never stand in the area of the line. I was struck in the legs when a line snapped when I was in the Navy and spent the next two days in sick bay with huge welts on my legs. Luckily no bones broken. When a synthetic or even a metal line snaps there is no idea of where it is going. My winch has a l,ong enough remote control cable that I can sit in my Jeep when winching.

My other observation of the video is our instinct to put our hand out like we’re really doing something. Guiding the middle of a winch line under tension, putting our hand out the window of a tipping vehicle, pushing against someone else’s Jeep that’s off camber.

The distances in the recovery are very short. One person got way the hell out of there. Im not sure what the person directing the recovery needed to see at that short of a distance, that he couldn’t see from slightly farther back by the Jeep doing the winching. Also for those taking videos, your phone camera has a zoom function that would allow you to stand back safely.

 

[TravelerTheJLU]

I could be wrong, but physics says in a PERFECT world if the line breaks it will likely snap back in a straight line with the line of force. However, we do not live in a isolated world so abnormal forces do happen and a line can whip to each side. Even though synthetic line is designed to carry as little potential energy as possible and drop. If a winch line breaks and shoots back and hits someone its likely to cause a fair amount of damage. Additionally, I know a many people swear by the line dampers however, others have shown they generally do next to nothing. The speed at which a line would snap back is so fast it would be past the damper before it is able to provide enough force to cause the line to be shifted off course. With that being said if I am using my winch I use a damper because in the slim chance it does do anything it could help.

 

[c20040215]

I always stay the F away behind covers and close my eyes.

 

[NPC 20883467]

There is so much going on in this picture...

There is so much stupid going on in this picture... (FIFY)

As for the safety issue, it would be totally avoided if you don't go wheeling with people like this.

 

[47Jeepster]

@Terrymo ... to answer your question directly ... do not stand along the winchline. And, if you see someone doing it, speak up. If the line is steel and it breaks, there will be blood. If it's synthetic and it breaks, the probability of blood is less, but still not zero.

Opinion:

If the winch control is in my hand, the winch doesn't move until everyone is away from the winchline ... no exceptions. They may think I'm an asshole - I don't care - however, everyone is going home that day without injuries ...

When the winchline comes out, it's because there is a problem. Most everyone is at least a little hyped up and primed to correct the problem. Unfortunately that's when accidents happen. The team needs to pause and rethink through the steps ... maybe even talk through the steps with an experience mate.

PS ... I was a test engineer on pipelayers when CAT went to the high-drive track configuration. During lift testing on the new machines, I broke a number of steel cables. The stored energy in a steel winch cable and the damage it can do is unbelievable.

Here's a good video on testing of cable failures. Most of it covers steel, but synthetic is addressed near the end.

 

[StonerSR25]

I understand everyone’s concerns about stored energy. As a side note I have also attended a two week Heavy rescue training school. That school trained us extensively in the use of ropes and rigging. The only comment I have comes from watching “Matt’s Off-road Recovery”. On the videos they often break synthetic rope and shackles under serious strain. As one poster above said. They drop like a dead snake. Based on my experience I have to agree with this comment.

 

[Ratbert]

I understand everyone’s concerns about stored energy. As a side note I have also attended a two week Heavy rescue training school. That school trained us extensively in the use of ropes and rigging. The only comment I have comes from watching “Matt’s Off-road Recovery”. On the videos they often break synthetic rope and shackles under serious strain. As one poster above said. They drop like a dead snake. Based on my experience I have to agree with this comment.

Like a dead snake? Go to ~14:52 in the video posted by @47Jeepster above your post.

 

[StonerSR25]

Did you happen to Notice what the winch line was attached to. It looked like a giant rubber band to me. That has not been my experience. But you mileage my very.

Like a dead snake? Go to ~14:52 in the video posted by @47Jeepster above your post.

 

[Ratbert]

Did you happen to Notice what the winch line was attached to. It looked like a giant rubber band to me. That has not been my experience. But you mileage my very.

Good point. There's a lot of energy stored in whatever's between the line and the vehicle.

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