TrailRecon- Engine Failure

[apettit7]

I did a poll 80% said no problems

So I suppose the 20% of us should just shut the fuck up, tell Jeep to cancel the 12,000 camshafts on backorder and delete the hundreds of pages about this issue across the forums jsut because according to you we are a small minority. Sorry about the rant because many dont have this issue (and I'm glad they don't...its a pain) it doesn't do a thing to help us with our issue. Also many of us DO change oil regularly (3K for me) and do proper maintenance.

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[CarbonSteel]

No. The thinner oils are for modern engines using modern alloys and a lot more schtuff that needs to be oiled, quickly. The "increased fuel mileage" claim is a gimmick backed by oil companies to sell oil. It's not new...they've been selling "fuel mileage" oils for decades. It's a marketing gimmick now just as it's always been.

 

[Ratbert]

Guys, maybe Trail Recon's 3.6 was screwed together when masks were mandatory Mine is 2024, I am pretty hopeful.

I'm pretty sure his Gladiator is a 2023. Are you thinking 2024s are somehow immune?

 

[Odyssey USA]

Wait a minute....someone just said Toyota was the holy grail. Which is it? I´m confused. Lol.

If the 5 quart capacity had anything to do with it you´d see oil breakdown in the UOA´s. I´ve done UOA´s as far out as 8k miles and the oil was perfectly fine. One of those was after a trip to Moab with lots of crawling in 100+ degree heat. So that guess just doesn´t hold water.

There has not been one shred of actual evidence of oil having anything to do with it.

Perhaps I’m misunderstanding your claim but you only know for sure what you have seen yourself. Most don’t send off oil samples or even pay attention so closely to quality of product or oil change intervals outside enthusiast circles. They just put gas in it, maybe toss in an air filter here and there, and wait for the oil change light…again, outside most of those on enthusiast forums, groups, etc. Likely the same ones who go to oil changers, not knowing what products are used, and wait for the oil change light before they go to one. They aren’t even aware there’s places that analyze your used motor oil.

And like diesels, competitive endurance engines, and even Jeep Wranglers that Jeep previously must have thought it to be advantageous to have an increased 6 qt (an extra 20%) oil capacity given the same oil, there are irrefutable benefits to increased capacity with viscosity modifiers’ shearing, anti wear additives, and contaminate dispersion. Given the same conditions, the test results will be better, even if marginally, with more capacity. Jeep didn’t do customers any favors by cutting it.

 

[TheRaven]

Perhaps I’m misunderstanding your claim but you only know for sure what you have seen yourself. Most don’t send off oil samples or even pay attention so closely to quality of product or oil change intervals outside enthusiast circles. They just put gas in it, maybe toss in an air filter here and there, and wait for the oil change light…again, outside most of those on enthusiast forums, groups, etc. Likely the same ones who go to oil changers, not knowing what products are used, and wait for the oil change light before they go to one. They aren’t even aware there’s places that analyze your used motor oil.

Yes. 200k+ JLs are sold every year, and 198k+ of those are regular joes who are putting the recommended octane and recommended 0W-20 in whether they do it or Jiffy Lube does it. So 99% of these engines are running 87 octane and 0W-20 and the majority are doing great. This problem is rather prevalent but it's still not over 30% so that's all the proof that's needed...and that's ignoring the fact that WE KNOW EXACTLY WHAT THE PROBLEM IS.

 

[svtrit]

Plus his vehicles must be tax write off

I’ve often thought the same thing. He rotates them like a farmer rotates equipment for the tax write off.

 

[Lionel Hutz]

I’ve often thought the same thing. He rotates them like a farmer rotates equipment for the tax write off.

He'd be foolish not to. His vehicles, trips, and lifestyle are all a business expense for the channel.

 

[Jeep Junkie]

Jerry told me this when I messaged him.

 

[DanW]

Perhaps I’m misunderstanding your claim but you only know for sure what you have seen yourself. Most don’t send off oil samples or even pay attention so closely to quality of product or oil change intervals outside enthusiast circles. They just put gas in it, maybe toss in an air filter here and there, and wait for the oil change light…again, outside most of those on enthusiast forums, groups, etc. Likely the same ones who go to oil changers, not knowing what products are used, and wait for the oil change light before they go to one. They aren’t even aware there’s places that analyze your used motor oil.

And like diesels, competitive endurance engines, and even Jeep Wranglers that Jeep previously must have thought it to be advantageous to have an increased 6 qt (an extra 20%) oil capacity given the same oil, there are irrefutable benefits to increased capacity with viscosity modifiers’ shearing, anti wear additives, and contaminate dispersion. Given the same conditions, the test results will be better, even if marginally, with more capacity. Jeep didn’t do customers any favors by cutting it.

Still, there's no evidence at all of 5 quart capacity causing problems with the millions of these on the road. And you can put 6 in it if it makes you sleep better. Many dumb dealerships have been mistakenly filling them to 6 quarts with no problems and most people never noticing. The design standard for FCA when the PUG was created was an old one...they have to meet all performance requirements whether 1 quart low or 1 quart overfilled. I just wouldn't recommend flirting with 6.1 quarts or more.

 

[DanW]

Jerry told me this when I messaged him.

I have never heard of that and many run 5w30 with no CEL.. Ow20 when cold is thicker than 5w30 that is hot, so why doesn't the CEL show up when I start my engine at 5 below zero and the oil is cold and thick? So I call BS on that one.

 

[Odyssey USA]

Still, there's no evidence at all of 5 quart capacity causing problems with the millions of these on the road. And you can put 6 in it if it makes you sleep better. Many dumb dealerships have been mistakenly filling them to 6 quarts with no problems and most people never noticing. The design standard for FCA when the PUG was created was an old one...they have to meet all performance requirements whether 1 quart low or 1 quart overfilled. I just wouldn't recommend flirting with 6.1 quarts or more.

If people change it often enough, that’s possibly correct, it shouldn’t be a problem. I was saying SOME do not and additional capacity, not overfilling a shallow sump that would cause more harmful oil aeration and windage with the crankshaft beating against the surface of the oil in the crankcase, would only help with oil life.

And I don’t think there’s been any scientific data collection comparing failure rate with different capacities. With the varying operating conditions, mileage intervals, that would be pretty difficult outside of an engine dyno room simulating driving.

Also, I could see testing done for differing oil levels and that being how they likely come up with the crosshatch marks on the dipstick. However, they are not going to recommend an oil level where oil aeration and windage are unnecessarily high and harmful IE, load bearing capacity of the hydrodynamic oil wedge going down at the main and rod bearings.

The only way would be a properly designed higher capacity oil pan.

 

[svtrit]

I have never heard of that and many run 5w30 with no CEL.. Ow20 when cold is thicker than 5w30 that is hot, so why doesn't the CEL show up when I start my engine at 5 below zero and the oil is cold and thick? So I call BS on that one.

The engine has no idea what oil you are putting in it, and to think it does gives Chrysler/Stellantis WAAAY too much credit. You could put 15w-40 in it and it would fire right up. That knocked him down a few pegs in my book.

I'm curious what the recommended oil is for the 3.6L in Australia and Africa. I bet it isn't a 20 weight oil.

 

[jeepingib]

Jerry told me this when I messaged him.

I would not trust anything Jerry says. This information is not based in fact. I can't even imagine a scenario where a thicker oil will turn on a CEL.

 

[jeepingib]

There is some merit to an argument for higher octane fuel and heavier weight oil. But don't expect them to save you from bad design entirely. The 3.6 does have some detonation issues, especially in hotter temps. When this happens it increases the load on the engine. This can cause surfaces to go beyond the hydrodynamic layer of oil, and get into what is called boundary lubrication, which is a metal on metal situation. Higher octane fuel, and thicker oil both can assist with this. But the 3.6 seems to have more issues than just this. Most of the scenarios I've seen are cylinder #1, or #6 failures. This has me thinking that there is an oiling issue. Also it's been reported that some of the head bolts were not torqued properly from the factory. If that is true, then oil and fuel aren't going to do anything to help.

 

[Jeep Junkie]

The engine has no idea what oil you are putting in it, and to think it does gives Chrysler/Stellantis WAAAY too much credit. You could put 15w-40 in it and it would fire right up. That knocked him down a few pegs in my book.

I'm curious what the recommended oil is for the 3.6L in Australia and Africa. I bet it isn't a 20 weight oil.

Unfortunately it is, 0w20 is for the whole world for 3.6 pentastar upgrade

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