Thinking about 4Xe

[THAW]

It's actually only about 300 more pounds or one fat dude than the diesel. The 4xe gets the gladiator axles, same rear brakes as the 392 which I believe are bigger and I'm assuming some chassis upgrades. The low cg actually makes it handle better on and off road as it's less tippy though. You can go with more lift but keep the cg close to a less lifted regular jeep or lift the same amount and have an even lower one.

300 lbs is 300lbs, but 300lbs is such a small fraction of the total weight it really doesn't move the needle much in one direction or the other as long as the vehicles suspension is set up for it.

It's ~300 lbs for the battery, ~700 lbs additional overall compared to the more typical engines. And any weight above the axle is not going to help handling.

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[BXFXJeep]

One of the major problems with the 4xe is people just absolutely refuse to let the gas engine run ever, then there are others that let the computer decide for them by leaving it in hybrid, and that causes problems.

Especially in the winter, I run trips with the gas going even though I can do it in electric.

It's a PHEV not a BEV.

Not exactly sure what people think that gas engine is there for.

Also all the talk about mpg is a waste of time when it comes to a Wrangler, sure some people can get mid 20s with the gassers, my best over 30 years YJ,TJ, JK,JL is 15 mpg non highway, highway I tend to get 20+.

 

[BXFXJeep]

Also, it's unclear to me how adding hundreds of lbs above the axles helps handling.

It doesn't bounce around, feels planted, then with Max Regen, going around corners mean you don't really need to be hitting the brakes.

 

[aldo98229]

Also all the talk about mpg is a waste of time when it comes to a Wrangler, sure some people can get mid 20s with the gassers, my best over 30 years YJ,TJ, JK,JL is 15 mpg non highway, highway I tend to get 20+.

I love Wranglers but I refuse to drive one that gets 13 MPG. That’s what I used to get on my last JL on 35s.

The speculation on the online forums was that the new Tacoma hybrid would get 27 MPG. As it turns out, those numbers were way too optimistic. Tacoma’s published MPG numbers are comparable to those of JL 2.0T. And 0-60 is in the 8-sec range. That’s 2 seconds slower than JL.

I’m not looking for a race truck, but after building so much anticipation, I find Tacoma’s numbers downright disappointing.

The numbers of upcoming Land Cruiser should be similar given that it will share the same chasis and powertrains with Tacoma. Or perhaps worse, if Land Cruiser ends up being a little heavier.

All in all, Wrangler still appears quite competitive.

 

[THAW]

The speculation on the online forums was that the new Tacoma hybrid would get 27 MPG. As it turns out, those numbers were way too optimistic. Tacoma’s published MPG numbers are comparable to those of JL 2.0T. And 0-60 is in the 8-sec range. That’s 2 seconds slower than JL.

Have the '24 Tacoma hybrid MPG numbers been published?

 

[aldo98229]

Have the '24 Tacoma hybrid MPG numbers been published?

I thought they had.

Going over the posts it appears they haven’t yet.

Land Cruiser won’t come in hybrid, though. So the numbers that Toyota published yesterday should apply to Land Cruiser as well.

 

[Bleda2002]

It's ~300 lbs for the battery, ~700 lbs additional overall compared the more typical engines. And any weight above the axle is not going to help handling.

The lower cg and 50/50 weight distribution makes a bigger difference than the extra weight. The 4xe has a .72g handling vs .69g handling for the gas engine in testing.

The 700lbs is below the standard wrangler cg so it lowers the cg meaning more stable and less rolling in corners. The weight is also mostly on the rear axle to improve weight distribution which means it dips and dives less under maneuvers while not really increasing understeer since it's not more weight on the front axle. If the jeep oversteered naturally then more rear weight would be worse but since they're oversteer prone all this does is make the handling more neutral.

Where the weight is located is very important in determining how it will affect performance, low balanced will do better than lighter and unbalanced.

 

[WannFly]

Haven't read 4 pages, but as a '21 4Xe owner here is my .02 cents. Most people come to forum and complain when they have issues. Happy campers don't come every morning and posts - hey I have no issues today.

I have zero issues yet (lets not jynx it lol). there is one issue that i need the dealer to look at , which is freedom panel leaking. that has nothing to do with 4Xe, its a jeep ownership experience.

 

[bjm00se]

Our electric rates over the last year - 8 cents/kWh in the winter months, about 12 cents/kWh in the summer.
I figured my wife spends about $1.18 in the lower rate months per mile and about $1.70 or so in the summer per mile on battery.

Not sure if there's a typo in your post or an error in your math, but if you're only paying 8¢ or 12¢ per kWh for electricity, your cost per mile (when operating purely on electric) is closer to 6¢ or 8¢ respectively, not $1.70 per mile, which would be absolutely horrific.

 

[THAW]

The 700lbs is below the standard wrangler cg so it lowers the cg meaning more stable and less rolling in corners.

Lowering the CG sounds great, but (all else equal) accomplishing it by adding sprung weight above the axles (no matter how low on the frame/body) doesn't reduce body roll - it increases body roll.

The 4xe may handle well, but if it has less body roll it's not because of the additional sprung electric drive train/battery weight lowering the center of gravity.

Any reduction in body roll would have to come from other factors, e.g. stiffer springs and/or swaybars. Stiffer (relative to weight) suspension is generally seen as compromising off road handling for on road feel - and of course can be accomplished on any Wrangler without adding weight.

Your point about balanced axle weight distribution improving handling feel makes sense, but the 4xe becomes less balanced when adding rear passengers (say a 300lb fat dude ?) and/or cargo whereas a non-4xe becomes more balanced.

 

[GrayWolf.Overland]

4xe weighs 400lb heavier in the front (same as ecodiesel) and 440lb heavier in the rear.

The weight of additional motor, location of the larger transmission parts and the battery is evenly spread on front and rear axles.

Cg is lower compared to regular gas Wrangler. It has a very planted on road feel.
4xe Rubicon (presumably Willys too) comes about 1" taller from factory compared to gas Rubicon - mostly down to thicker coil and higher spring rates. This allows you to slap on 35s (on Rubicon and Willys with high fender flares) and not care about anything else on the suspension.

Eagle Mountain Trail on 4xe rubicon no-lift and 35s. This trail requires minimum 2" lift, 12" diff clearance and 35s bare min

 

[graytag]

I have a 5 mile commute. Love my 4xe. I'm really glad I leased it given the forum horror stories but, luckily, mine has been biullet proof at 2 years and 13K miles. The lease deductions and fact that I fill up once every 6-8 weeks have made it a no-brainer. As a former TJ and YJ driver, it feels downright smooth and the added weight and regenerative breaking(while not Tesla strong) make it fun-ish to corner. The biggest negative is noted in your signature though I'd edit it to "ALL Jeep service sucks"

 

[JerseyJules]

I had been waiting for Toyota to publish its all-new 2024 Tacoma —and by extension Land Cruiser— MPG numbers. Turns out they are disappointing. Especially for hybrids.

A somewhat nearby Jeep dealer has some juicy discounts on 4Xe leases. They have several Saharas listed for $15,000 ($7,500 off + $7,500 instant credit/rebate).

I work from home and live in a small city of 90,000 people; most of my runs are 5 miles or less. Which means I should be able to go without fueling up for weeks.

I swore years ago I wouldn’t lease again but these discounts are tempting.

Thoughts?

I leased one. The deal was too good to pass up. I love it aside from the false advertising about the power box and being able to reverse power outlets which was literally the main factor I got it.
But my first tank of gas I got 490 miles. So if.youre using it for a ton of local in town trips its perfect.

 

[WannFly]

Fair enough, obviously there's some conflicting information.

I'll take your word for it being posted more recently, but it is dated the 22nd (a week ago)?

Mne is affected by this recall. the notice date on Mopar's site is Nov 23

 

[Willys41]

I am very happy with my Wranglers
2018 Rubicon 3.6
2020 Willys 3.6
Exploding lithium batteries and electric motors are not for me
When on the trail or out in the woods I have enough to worry about with out adding a more complicated electrical system to the mix
On my Willys with 37s 4.88s and 1200lb of gear and mods I would quickly deplete any lithium batteries
My last trip to the mountains I averaged 17 to 18 MPG and on the flats I see about 20 MPG
That's good enough for me

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