Mopar 2" lift, installed wrong. How will affect ride?

[cguareschi]

Update: The dealer owned to their mistake and redid the lift completely including a new alignment. After the lift was redone the jeep drove much better but still not perfect with some residual wobble. Caster on the alignment sheet was only 3.7 and that was the problem. There was also a good bit of brake dive. For this reason I decided to install a set of Rancho geometry correction brackets.
Now the wrangler drives better than stock, no more wobble, no more brake dive. I left the longer lower control arm that came with the lift. Caster measured very rudimentary with an amazon caster measuring tool is now about +8 degrees.

Thanks everybody who helped and chimed in

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[LincolnSixAlpha]

I had a rough country cheap 2" lift (spacers) installed on my 2018 JLU Sport and the jeep was driving horribly even after alignment. Very wobbly at speed > 40mph, particularly after hitting a bump on the road. Tires are 35" @ 32 psi. I felt the car was unsafe so I went to the Jeep dealer looking for recommendations and I was told those cheap rough country lift mess up suspension geometry and the way the car drove was to be expected. I was also told with the Mopar 2" lift, the car would drive much better, close to stock.
So I had the Mopar lift installed last week with high hopes. They did a new alignment. When I picked up the car I was told it was driving ok but not great and that I may need a "caster kit". I was told to drive the car a little, see what I thought and that they would contact me with the price of this "caster kit" if I felt the ride was not satisfactory. As I drove the car I was very disappointed. The Jeep drove worse than with the rough country spacers lift. Need to keep two hands on the steering wheel to constantly correct, If you hit a bump or a pothole the car swerve. I spoke to the dealer and I am going back tomorrow tho have it checked.

In the meantime I noticed a few disappointing things with this Mopar lift install:

1. They did not remove the rear spacers from the previous lift, So the car is 2" taller in the back that it is in the front.
2. The coils with the blue tag were installed on the driver side, the red tags on the passenger side. Reading the forum and the mopar lift instructions (which have screwed up illustrations by the way) I understand they are swapped.
3. The lower front coil isolators are made of black plastic on both side. The pictures I saw in the forum of the new isolator that corrected the spring bow are grey. Did I get an old lift kit?

Are issues 1 and 2 serious enough to cause this poor handling? Is there a chance this car could drive and handle properly with this lift once these issues are corrected or should just forget the lift and go back to stock?

What is a "caster kit" ?

Any explanation of advice would be greatly appreciated.

I'm sorry for your troubles, however, a "Caster" kit is something to "realign" the stock caster in the front wheels. A good/quality suspension lift would have accounted for it in some manner. In my case, I purchased the Teraflex 2.5 Sport ST2 suspension lift as you can see here:

https://teraflex.com/shop_items/jlu...con-2-1-shocks?vehicle=JLU Wrangler Unlimited

In the pic, are two LCA's, or Lower Control Arms that correct the caster of the front wheels, or caster, due to the lift. Worth noting, my jeep did not need any alignments coming from the factory OEM suspension and components to the upgraded Teraflex Suspension.

It's worth a few more bucks to have the correct parts to save you time and trouble when dealing with suspensions. In your case, the dealer should have not let you leave without correcting any front end geometry issues, or at least that's my opinion. Sadly, the Mopar kit does not account for any caster correction as part of their kit. I just dont understand how manufacturers can sell kits that are not complete like this.

I'd recommend researching what lower control arms work well with your Mopar lift and go from there. There are other ways to solve the caster issue in the front, but perhaps the LCA's might be the easiest route. Metal Cloak, Rock Krawler, Teraflex, and many of the larger manufacturers sell adjustable LCA's that will likely fix your issue.

While you're at it, I'd recommend ditching the OEM stabilizer, and replace it with a quality unit. The OEM unit is junk in my humble opinion. It will make your life much, much better as far as driving on the highway, and dealing with wind.

 

[Arterius2]

I'm sorry for your troubles, however, a "Caster" kit is something to "realign" the stock caster in the front wheels. A good/quality suspension lift would have accounted for it in some manner. In my case, I purchased the Teraflex 2.5 Sport ST2 suspension lift as you can see here:

https://teraflex.com/shop_items/jlu-4-door-2-5-sport-st2-suspension-system-w-falcon-2-1-shocks?vehicle=JLU Wrangler Unlimited

In the pic, are two LCA's, or Lower Control Arms that correct the caster of the front wheels, or caster, due to the lift. Worth noting, my jeep did not need any alignments coming from the factory OEM suspension and components to the upgraded Teraflex Suspension.

It's worth a few more bucks to have the correct parts to save you time and trouble when dealing with suspensions. In your case, the dealer should have not let you leave without correcting any front end geometry issues, or at least that's my opinion. Sadly, the Mopar kit does not account for any caster correction as part of their kit. I just dont understand how manufacturers can sell kits that are not complete like this.

I'd recommend researching what lower control arms work well with your Mopar lift and go from there. There are other ways to solve the caster issue in the front, but perhaps the LCA's might be the easiest route. Metal Cloak, Rock Krawler, Teraflex, and many of the larger manufacturers sell adjustable LCA's that will likely fix your issue.

While you're at it, I'd recommend ditching the OEM stabilizer, and replace it with a quality unit. The OEM unit is junk in my humble opinion. It will make your life much, much better as far as driving on the highway, and dealing with wind.

Huh??? The mopar lift kit does come with longer LCAs, have you read any of the threads here?

 

[Arterius2]

They’re only a quarter inch longer and fixed, no adjustment, than stock and they don’t provide enough castor for the amount of lift you actually get from the Mopar lift. I tell people when I’m asked to purchase adjustable track bars and adjustable lcas and pack them with you when you have lift installed, this will save you a lot of return trips to the dealership, and aggravation.....

Yes I understand they are not adjustable, but I just wanted to make sure people know that the LCAs that come with the mopar lift are in fact longer so they don't accidentally leave it out of the install thinking it's the same. Albeit not as long as some would like.

 

[xtopherm]

I had a rough country cheap 2" lift (spacers) installed on my 2018 JLU Sport and the jeep was driving horribly even after alignment. Very wobbly at speed > 40mph, particularly after hitting a bump on the road. Tires are 35" @ 32 psi. I felt the car was unsafe so I went to the Jeep dealer looking for recommendations and I was told those cheap rough country lift mess up suspension geometry and the way the car drove was to be expected. I was also told with the Mopar 2" lift, the car would drive much better, close to stock.
So I had the Mopar lift installed last week with high hopes. They did a new alignment. When I picked up the car I was told it was driving ok but not great and that I may need a "caster kit". I was told to drive the car a little, see what I thought and that they would contact me with the price of this "caster kit" if I felt the ride was not satisfactory. As I drove the car I was very disappointed. The Jeep drove worse than with the rough country spacers lift. Need to keep two hands on the steering wheel to constantly correct, If you hit a bump or a pothole the car swerve. I spoke to the dealer and I am going back tomorrow tho have it checked.

In the meantime I noticed a few disappointing things with this Mopar lift install:

1. They did not remove the rear spacers from the previous lift, So the car is 2" taller in the back that it is in the front.
2. The coils with the blue tag were installed on the driver side, the red tags on the passenger side. Reading the forum and the mopar lift instructions (which have screwed up illustrations by the way) I understand they are swapped.
3. The lower front coil isolators are made of black plastic on both side. The pictures I saw in the forum of the new isolator that corrected the spring bow are grey. Did I get an old lift kit?

Are issues 1 and 2 serious enough to cause this poor handling? Is there a chance this car could drive and handle properly with this lift once these issues are corrected or should just forget the lift and go back to stock?

What is a "caster kit" ?

Any explanation of advice would be greatly appreciated.

Explanation:

Part One: What is Caster Angle?
Caster is the imaginary vertical line around which your front wheels pivot as you steer. If it is laid back a few degrees (such as on a chopper motorcycle to give an extreme example) you get very stable steering that wants to recenter and feels steady on the highway. If the angle is less laid back (i.e. more vertical) you get faster twitchier steering that wants to wander a bit and does not feel great. Jeep specifies roughly 4-6 degrees of caster lay back on the JLs - look it up for exact measurements for your model.

Part Two: How Does A Lift Affect Caster Angle?
When you do a lift, you are essentially dropping your front axle down in an arc. It goes down, but since it is attached to the drive shaft and the upper and lower control arms, it has to travel in an arc which means that the axle effectively rotates a few degrees - the top of the housing moves slightly toward the front of the jeep and the bottom towards the rear. If the caster angle is an imaginary line bisecting the axle on the vertical, you can imagine what this lift would do to your caster angle - it makes it go from laid back a little to laid back less. The MOPAR 2" lift and other relatively complete lifts come with longer lower control arms to try and rotate the axle back a little toward stock to restore caster. (Note it is also possible to adjust caster by making the upper control arms shorter, but most kits address it via the lower control arms.) The issue you may be having is that most people feel that the MOPAR lower control arms are not long enough to fully correct the problem. The reason for this is that the lift is marketed as 2" and assumes that with bumpers, winches, some armor, passengers, recovery gear, the ravages of time, etc, most jeeps will sit at about 2". But right out of the box on a relatively lightly loaded or lightly built jeep, this lift sits at more like 3.5"-4.0". That means that the control arms designed for an assumed 2" are a little short to properly correct the caster angle.

Part Three: What is a Caster Kit?
I have no idea what hardware they have in mind when they refer to such a thing, but it is probably either a pair of adjustable lower control arms (i.e. can be lengthened or shortended by turning a threaded piece), or a bracket that moves the mounting holes forward a bit. As a general matter, you'd probably be better off with a really good pair of adjustable lower control arms than a flimsy bracket because you'd have the quality and the adjustability. Brackets are just another thing to squeak, rust, rattle, or oval out from banging against bolts if not kept tight. If they are offering you the "kit" for a lot less than you could pick up some good adjustable lower control arms, maybe you could give it a try, but you will want to keep the bolts tight over the life of the vehicle. If you want to do it right, you probably want to get good adjustable lower control arms that will allow you to adjust and readjust the caster over the life of the vehicle as your build changes and the springs naturally settle over the years from use.

Part Four: Unsolicited Information
One thing that comes through in your note is a level of bewilderment and frustration that your lifted jeep does not drive as well as your stock jeep. It is worth keeping in mind that, despite marketing materials to the contrary, NO lifted jeep rides as well as stock. (Nor, frankly, will it be as safe in terms of roll-over propensity.) The fact is, these jeeps are crude, heavy live axle, body on frame vehicles with fairly primitive rugged suspensions. Jeep took a lot of trouble to get them to an amazingly high level of refinement off the showroom floor (JL steering issues notwithstanding). It is simply not realistic to think that you could mess with those settings, angles and geometries in a pretty profound way and raise the center of gravity of the vehicle up higher (and maybe add bigger wider tires) and not have it affect the factory handling dramatically. With good parts and expert tuning and alignment you can tame the worst of the problems introduced by a lift, but the driving dynamics of a lifted jeep will NEVER be the same as stock. Some people get them dialed in pretty well or simply don't notice or mind the ride and handling of lifted jeeps (or like the plush long wheel travel), while others are really bothered by it. If you are someone who really prioritizes ride and handling (and safety) over looks or off-road capabilities, you might not be a good candidate for any lift at all. If you really like the lifted look and plan to use it off-road, spend the time and money to get it dialed in properly and live with the compromise of a little bit messier handling for cooler looks and better off-road capabilities. (FYI, in my case, I am in the worst of all worlds: I am really sensitive to handling dynamics and care a lot about it, I want the vehicle to be as safe as possible, AND I wheel off-road and want good off-road capabilities, so I am condemned to the purgatory of tuning and tweaking my lift forever.)

 

[19 JLUR Bright Whit3]

I'm not 100% sure on this one, but I believe the newer spring isolator is black.

Yes, I have the third version ending in "AC" of the Mopar "2in" lift. It came with the black isolators. There is still a slight bow on the driver's side, but nothing like the first generation Mopar lift.

I believe they screwed up your install.

 

[DustWarriorRubz]

Does anyone know if the dealerships/vendors that sell the Mopar lift were required to make any changes/updates to defective parts in existing kits?

 

[RAMSTEEL]

Thanks to this thread I was able to determine the coils were not installed correctly on my Jeep. We just purchased a Rubicon with the 2" lift already installed and there was a noticeable lean, almost 2" in the back from side to side. The color-coded coils did not align and were Blue/Red Front and Red/Blue Rear. The dealership is fixing them on Monday.

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