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roaniecowpony

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I'm in the middle of my paint correction on my crewcab and dealing with some pretty deep scratches. Some require wet sanding with 2500. I've avoided buying a rotary machine, since I have a Torq 22D long throw orbital. But it's just not cutting it, literally.

I had an old cheap rotary Wen polisher that is rated a 1600 rpm, but seems to be running at around half that and no torque.

So, I grabbed my big Milwaukee concrete hammer drill and put a 6" cheap foam pad in it. The Milwaukee has 2 variable speed ranges, 0-600 and 0-3500 and smooth or hammer modes. In the high range/smooth mode, it seemed to cut well, I bought a couple good 6" pads from Chem Guys to see if I could finish this project with the Milwaukee and my 22D. The big drill had the power and speed but is difficult to handle. I may just spring for a good rotary.

Anyone have some recs for a good rotary? I think a $400+ Flex or Rupes is overboard for pretty much a one time use. So, I was looking at the likes of the Makita 9237CX3 at around $240 to my doorstep.
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I ended up ordering a Makita PV7001C. I wanted to order a Flex 14-2-150 but it was just over the top on cost for my infrequent use and I figure the PV7001C is about the same (light) weight as the Flex and should work well and be more user friendly, adaptable/flexible than a big full size Makita or Dewalt buffer, albeit not as powerful.

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I ended up ordering a Makita PV7001C. I wanted to order a Flex 14-2-150 but it was just over the top on cost for my infrequent use and I figure the PV7001C is about the same (light) weight as the Flex and should work well and be more user friendly, adaptable/flexible than a big full size Makita or Dewalt buffer, albeit not as powerful.

Makita PV7001C.png
You seem quite knowledgeable. But you know I’m obliged to say it, please be really careful using a circular. You’ve been warned! :LOL:
 

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I hear ya. I've used rotary buffers in the past, before orbitals became popular. I've had a couple rotary buffers over the decades, but they seem to have gone by the wayside. My Torq 22D just can't efficiently deal with the mass of scratches on both sides of a crewcab.
 
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I ended up ordering a Makita PV7001C. I wanted to order a Flex 14-2-150 but it was just over the top on cost for my infrequent use and I figure the PV7001C is about the same (light) weight as the Flex and should work well and be more user friendly, adaptable/flexible than a big full size Makita or Dewalt buffer, albeit not as powerful.

Jeep Wrangler JL Good Buffer for Beginner Makita PV7001C
I am only just starting my journey or should I say going down the rabbit hole of paint correction but glad I went with @Chocolate Thunder suggestion on getting a DA polisher, I did not want to shell out a lot of coin as I was not sure on if I was going to pursue this after doing it but I was super pleased with how my wife’s car turned out, I also did not want to burn thru any paint and the G9 polisher was a pleasure to use, minimal vibration even at the higher speeds and seems well balanced, I may at some point get a 5.5” plate for it as the 6.5” one is a bit tough to get into the smaller areas but that may be me being very inexperienced and I have already blown way past my initial budget 😩

Im sure the purist detailers would point out the flaws I made or areas i overlooked but it was a super enjoyable experience and it made a huge difference compared to hand waxing, the Pinnacle Souveran liquid Carnauba along with the Crystal Mist detailer after made the color pop and has a deep rich color.

I figure on my next out after my Jeep gets done I want to look into sealants, I doubt I will ever go down the ceramic coating rabbit hole as there seems to be lots of mistakes that can be made doing it but who knows.
 

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I am only just starting my journey or should I say going down the rabbit hole of paint correction but glad I went with @Chocolate Thunder suggestion on getting a DA polisher, I did not want to shell out a lot of coin as I was not sure on if I was going to pursue this after doing it but I was super pleased with how my wife’s car turned out, I also did not want to burn thru any paint and the G9 polisher was a pleasure to use, minimal vibration even at the higher speeds and seems well balanced, I may at some point get a 5.5” plate for it as the 6.5” one is a bit tough to get into the smaller areas but that may be me being very inexperienced and I have already blown way past my initial budget 😩

Im sure the purist detailers would point out the flaws I made or areas i overlooked but it was a super enjoyable experience and it made a huge difference compared to hand waxing, the Pinnacle Souveran liquid Carnauba along with the Crystal Mist detailer after made the color pop and has a deep rich color.

I figure on my next out after my Jeep gets done I want to look into sealants, I doubt I will ever go down the ceramic coating rabbit hole as there seems to be lots of mistakes that can be made doing it but who knows.
WM,
I agree, your choice of a DA random orbital was a good one. CT steered you right. It's the primary tool for paint correction these days. I have a pretty decent one as well: TORQ TORQ22D Random Orbital Polisher Kit (9 Items) | (chemicalguys.com)

You can also us a DA random orbital to "clay". There are pads available that do the job of traditional clay. I "clayed" the entire top of my crewcab truck (camper, roof, and hood) in very short order. I doubt I'll ever use clay for anything again, except some small detail areas.

A rotary still has utility for certain circumstances. When I use a rotary for cutting, I follow with rotary polishing grade pads and compounds, then polish with my DA random orbital. It is a lot of work, but my truck has a lot of damage from driving thru brush. I probably won't be able to get 100% of the scratches out, but the one door and fender I've done so far indicate it will be greatly improved, and the small percentage of scratches left will be nearly unnoticeable on the white paint.

I'd highly recommend you use a pad conditioner (its a lubricant to reduce heat). IMO, it's probably the best improvement in polishing techniques second to the use of foam polishing pads.
 
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@roaniecowpony yes the G9 seems like a well built piece and has a solid warranty but the 6.5” is a tad large to get into smaller places but will work for now and is 100% better than what I was doing before

I also followed @Chocolate Thunder advice on pads and other items and picked up a (12) pack of LC foam pads with 1/2 of them being white and then (2) orange, blue and green and then the G9 came with a few but when they sent it they sent me the CSS smart pads by mistake as I had picked the flat foam ones, they offered to send back at no charge and exchange but after doing some research the CSS pads are supposed to be less absorbent than the flat foam so I decided to keep them and they said no charge since it was there mistake👍

I have no idea if they are better or not compared to the regular flat foam ones but they seem to work fine, the G9 starter pack I picked also included some pad conditioner and cleaner with the extra pads and a few MF towels and the included extras cost far more than the small additional cost.

The 3D One that i had seems to be oily so it seemed to do well on the pad and I used the conditioner as well but I figured out pretty quick that alittle polish and conditioner goes along way as I initially had a lot of polish sling, I figure when the pad conditioner is gone I will just use detailer but a 3D rep advised that pad conditioner was optional due to the oils in the polish but I will likely use something just in case.

I have no idea when a pad needs changing but when my Jeep comes up in a few weeks when my schedule allows I will likely use at least 3 pads, 1 for hood & front fenders and 2 more for the sides, back and roof as my roof has the SR on the front so not that much to cover, and I figure for applying the wax 1 black pad is fine.

When I did my wife’s car the 6.5” pad was large for a few areas but I can get the 5.5” backing plate but that may even be to big for the smaller recessed areas, they do sell a G8 mini that has both 2” & 3” backing plates and that would be ideal for like A pillars and such but that’s Alice goi g down that rabbit hole 😀 but it would be a much more detailed job especially if I went to a ceramic coating or even a sealant but that another polisher and set of pads $$

I have several hobbies but this particular one seems to feed my OCD well as I just loved stepping back after I did my wife’s car and admired the huge difference in how it looked and if I were to guess I would say 80%+ of the small towel scratches were gone, I did spend about 7-8hrs doing a full exterior/interior job but most of that time was spent on the exterior and I honestly did not mind it at all.

This venture of detailing could be and actually is a deep rabbit hole that one could have a huge investment in but considering what one gets in return I am slowly justifying the cost of soft products and hardware i have invested in.
 

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WM, I think the Griots brand equipment has a big following and most of what I've read was very positive. If I were buying a DA long throw today, I would give some consideration to their G21. It's in the price range I'm confortable with and has the features I like better than my Torq 22D which I purchased back around 2014-15.

One big reason for my chosing to go with Chemical Guys stuff (Torq is their line) is that they are about 8 miles from my house. I can go to their store and pick up stuff any day of the week. Hopefully, they will have service for the Torq when it becomes necessary and their staff has given great assistance and advice in the past.

Regarding your comment about the need for something smaller to do tight areas, you can buy the small back plates from 1" up and an arbor to fit a drill. With the polish grade pads and fine compounds a common power drill with a range around 2000 - 3000 rpm (small diameters produce less surface feet per minute/rpm) I've found these very useful. I have backers for the drill from 3" up to 6", but just use the 3" and 4" in the drill. These modern foam pads and polishes are relatively gentle and it takes a lot to burn with them compared with the old wool pads, especially an old twisted yarn cutting pad.

I wash my pads and keep them separated in marked ziplok bags. I mark them also by the grade of compound I've used with them. Maybe too much?

I wish had your enthusiasm for this, though I do find the results satisfying. In my old age, I see it as work and pain with my arthritis. I had to lay off for a week after the last session, when my wrists were really bothering me. Voltaran is my friend. So, I try to do a few hours here and there. But, I started the truck almost a month ago now. It is covered in plastic, since it can't fit in the garage (too long, too tall) and I put up a 10'x10' shade pop-up when working. I have a custom cover on order for the entire cab and front end, so at least that will be protected better, long term.

My new rotary should be here by the end of the day.

Enjoy your new hobby.

BTW, what tailgate table did you get? (I saw the taligate cover hanging on your wall)
 
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@roaniecowpony its funny you mentioned Chemical Guys as your choice, I believe they are located in Plainfield In. and I am from the north side of Indy but moved to Texas just over 10 years ago for work and will be heading back to Indy in a few years when I retire, aside from to many ppl and way to much traffic south texas is wayyyy to hot for me and summers in my garage are not pleasant but I still work in it.

I looked at several of the Griots polishers and the G9 caught my attention on its compact size and only weights like 5# and is easy t9 run for hours and it never really got hot and I was not wearing any gloves, they do sell a 3” plate that will fit but the shroud is 4” so it was suggested by them to not use it as it’s somewhat of a safety risk so that’s when I started looking and found it’s baby brother the mini but for now now since my budgeted amount was blown on my recent detail spree I will glue my piggy bank back together and see what happens.

I have done weekly washes on my JL since pretty much day one ( weather permitting ) and I have hand waxed it the entire time and it’s been with spray wax and it’s been done weekly and it’s garage kept and I nor clay it twice a year but as you know these spray on waxes don’t last long and doing it without power polishing the shine just is not as brilliant, I had been using what @Chocolate Thunder referred to as the Jigglemaster 🤪 and it was one of those that cost like $50 and had polish pad on it but I was told those tend to do more harm than good and I can now see that as I have those tiny scratches all over my hood plus other places so that’s when I reached out to get info here and went with the G9 and it was like turning on a light for the first time, aside from being a huge time saver it corrected all the small issues on her 2020 so I am anxious to see what it will do for my 2018 using the same 3D One polish, I will start with a LC white pad but may have to go to an Orange for at least the hood, the 3D is supposed to be like a one step and according to them by using different grit pads you can finish down by just changing pads so it’s kinda like a two step but you are just using one polish and I had the polish already as I used it by hand to correct small scratches.

I know detail experts like @Chocolate Thunder and you achieve better results doing an actual 2-3 step process but I wanted to use what I had on hand but once I started buying things like new sponges and a 5 gal bucket with grit guard I just kept clicking buy..buy…buy and my budget was shot but I have lots of products to try.

The biggest things I have taken away from this is lots of the lesser expensive products just don’t compare the same to ones like Pinnacle and I have been told that Blackfire and several others are even better although lots of these newer SiO2 polishes and detailers even the less expensive ones do a great job so I have the new Megs wax and detailer to try so I may do a 1/2 and 1/2 on my Jeep with the Megs and Pinnacle or just do one and then wait a month or some and do it again with the other to compare and then maybe when Blackfire goes on sale I would like to try that but not on sale it kinda pricy at $60 for a 3 Oz jar of the Blackice Hybrid 😳 but it gets killer good reviews

For now it’s baby steps for me learning good habits to build on and my tailgate table is from Outback Adventures

Jeep Wrangler JL Good Buffer for Beginner 305AF9D2-35E8-4479-968C-EEAD4E835D0A
Jeep Wrangler JL Good Buffer for Beginner 88BA7185-3A94-45DA-ACEA-286ED7F5B4E6
Jeep Wrangler JL Good Buffer for Beginner 883950C4-FF64-4135-9F28-C32F6EA072BA
 

roaniecowpony

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@roaniecowpony its funny you mentioned Chemical Guys as your choice, I believe they are located in Plainfield In. and I am from the north side of Indy but moved to Texas just over 10 years ago for work and will be heading back to Indy in a few years when I retire, aside from to many ppl and way to much traffic south texas is wayyyy to hot for me and summers in my garage are not pleasant but I still work in it.

I looked at several of the Griots polishers and the G9 caught my attention on its compact size and only weights like 5# and is easy t9 run for hours and it never really got hot and I was not wearing any gloves, they do sell a 3” plate that will fit but the shroud is 4” so it was suggested by them to not use it as it’s somewhat of a safety risk so that’s when I started looking and found it’s baby brother the mini but for now now since my budgeted amount was blown on my recent detail spree I will glue my piggy bank back together and see what happens.

I have done weekly washes on my JL since pretty much day one ( weather permitting ) and I have hand waxed it the entire time and it’s been with spray wax and it’s been done weekly and it’s garage kept and I nor clay it twice a year but as you know these spray on waxes don’t last long and doing it without power polishing the shine just is not as brilliant, I had been using what @Chocolate Thunder referred to as the Jigglemaster 🤪 and it was one of those that cost like $50 and had polish pad on it but I was told those tend to do more harm than good and I can now see that as I have those tiny scratches all over my hood plus other places so that’s when I reached out to get info here and went with the G9 and it was like turning on a light for the first time, aside from being a huge time saver it corrected all the small issues on her 2020 so I am anxious to see what it will do for my 2018 using the same 3D One polish, I will start with a LC white pad but may have to go to an Orange for at least the hood, the 3D is supposed to be like a one step and according to them by using different grit pads you can finish down by just changing pads so it’s kinda like a two step but you are just using one polish and I had the polish already as I used it by hand to correct small scratches.

I know detail experts like @Chocolate Thunder and you achieve better results doing an actual 2-3 step process but I wanted to use what I had on hand but once I started buying things like new sponges and a 5 gal bucket with grit guard I just kept clicking buy..buy…buy and my budget was shot but I have lots of products to try.

The biggest things I have taken away from this is lots of the lesser expensive products just don’t compare the same to ones like Pinnacle and I have been told that Blackfire and several others are even better although lots of these newer SiO2 polishes and detailers even the less expensive ones do a great job so I have the new Megs wax and detailer to try so I may do a 1/2 and 1/2 on my Jeep with the Megs and Pinnacle or just do one and then wait a month or some and do it again with the other to compare and then maybe when Blackfire goes on sale I would like to try that but not on sale it kinda pricy at $60 for a 3 Oz jar of the Blackice Hybrid 😳 but it gets killer good reviews

For now it’s baby steps for me learning good habits to build on and my tailgate table is from Outback Adventures

305AF9D2-35E8-4479-968C-EEAD4E835D0A.jpeg
88BA7185-3A94-45DA-ACEA-286ED7F5B4E6.jpeg
883950C4-FF64-4135-9F28-C32F6EA072BA.jpeg
WM,
There is a Chem Guys near me in Southern Calif., over in Gardena. I don't know if that facility is the main warehouse or if it's elsewhere. It seems they have opened stores or franchises in many locations. The current Gardena store has a large warehouse next to it where the original store used to be.

As for being an expert, I can't make that claim by any stretch. But back when I was in high school, my nextdoor neighbor was always messing with paint and indeed ended up being a great pro body man. Over the years I spent a lot of time over there watching and learning. Some of it rubbed off on me. Those were the days of big 9" wool pads. :facepalm:

My Makita rotary showed up. I put the included 7" backer on it and spun it up. It has a spec decal that shows it runs up to 2350 instead of their website that states 2000. That extra range may help when running smaller diameter pads. My scale shows it's right at 5lbs. It feels very ergonomic, but using it will flesh that out. I'm going to ditch the 7" backer and run 4", 5" and 6" pads, because I have a good selection of them and I really don't see the need to get more pads. I'm looking forward to a cooler day this week to try it out.
Jeep Wrangler JL Good Buffer for Beginner 20210930_161751

That tailgate table is the one I've been thinking about for a while now.
Any noticeable (lack) of venting with the way it covers a lot of the tailgate vents? That was probably my only concern with the table.
 

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No venting issues on the tailgate table, it has a foam edge on the back side edge and then there is a cutout for the cable so it may vent a little but I have not noticed any issues.

It will be close to two weeks before I will have a day to do my Jeep the front end top will take more than the rest and I’m trying to justify in my mind if I should mask off all trim, seems like it would give the best look not having the trim bumped by the pad during correction and then do trim and glass last but that would take some time.

I do have to polish the glass from some small pits so got some glass polish and will try by hand first if not I may put some on a black pad so it’s the polish doing the work, not sure how much it will help but gonna try.
 
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A bit OT, but after using the Makita PV7001C rotary for a day, I am very pleased with the ergonomics and the performance of this rotary. It's not for someone new to paint correction, but it is very controllable and relatively easy to handle for those of you experienced enough that are seeking a lightweight but decently powerful rotary. I used it with 6" microfiber and foam cutting pads today as well as a 3" microfiber cutting pad. I really like this machine.
 
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A bit OT, but after using the Makita PV7001C rotary for a day, I am very pleased with the ergonomics and the performance of this rotary. It's not for someone new to paint correction, but it is very controllable and relatively easy to handle for those of you experienced enough that are seeking a lightweight but decently powerful rotary. I used it with 6" microfiber and foam cutting pads today as well as a 3" microfiber cutting pad. I really like this machine.
That thing looks like a beast..for me I think it’s best I stick to a smaller less aggressive machine and pad as @Chocolate Thunder suggested, the G9 and a combination of white, blue and black pads using the 3D One and Pinnacle yielded great results on my wifes car and I will likely use the same on my Jeep, I may have to go up to an orange LC CSS pad for the hood but will do a test section to see how it goes with the white first, I figure the less aggressive I can be the better off my CC finish will be, also still undecided on the 3” polisher, I can get the majority of the work done with the G9 but a 3” would be ideal for lots of tight areas like around the windshield frame, hinges, grill etc.. but it’s a added expense for the polisher and pads for the hobbyists detailer like me.
 

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That thing looks like a beast..for me I think it’s best I stick to a smaller less aggressive machine and pad as @Chocolate Thunder suggested, the G9 and a combination of white, blue and black pads using the 3D One and Pinnacle yielded great results on my wifes car and I will likely use the same on my Jeep, I may have to go up to an orange LC CSS pad for the hood but will do a test section to see how it goes with the white first, I figure the less aggressive I can be the better off my CC finish will be, also still undecided on the 3” polisher, I can get the majority of the work done with the G9 but a 3” would be ideal for lots of tight areas like around the windshield frame, hinges, grill etc.. but it’s a added expense for the polisher and pads for the hobbyists detailer like me.
Sounds like your dealing with paint that is in relatively good condition. For a small area detalier, you might consider using a common variable speed electric drill with the less aggressive pads in 1", 2", and 3", along with finishing polishes. I don't think you can get in trouble very easily with that type of setup. In the really small areas, an orbital is impractical. It's either a small rotary or hand polishing.

The new Makita rotary is what I'd call a midsize polisher. It has about a 950w motor and is 5 lbs. More than enough for my needs. The big ones are 7-8 lbs and 1400+watts. I can't handle a big polisher like that for very long. But, yes, compared to the G9, the Makita PV7001C is on the other end of the scale. Different tools for different tasks. My truck paint has been badly damaged and there is probably 3 to 4 times the painted surface area compared to my JLUR.
 
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Sounds like your dealing with paint that is in relatively good condition. For a small area detalier, you might consider using a common variable speed electric drill with the less aggressive pads in 1", 2", and 3", along with finishing polishes. I don't think you can get in trouble very easily with that type of setup. In the really small areas, an orbital is impractical. It's either a small rotary or hand polishing.

The new Makita rotary is what I'd call a midsize polisher. It has about a 950w motor and is 5 lbs. More than enough for my needs. The big ones are 7-8 lbs and 1400+watts. I can't handle a big polisher like that for very long. But, yes, compared to the G9, the Makita PV7001C is on the other end of the scale. Different tools for different tasks. My truck paint has been badly damaged and there is probably 3 to 4 times the painted surface area compared to my JLUR.
The G9 is supposed to be 1000 watts for the motor with 6 speeds at 2000-6400 OPM and a 9mm throw and seemed to have alot of power to do the wife’s car at setting 4-5, I did ramp it up to 6 just to see and it seemed to be very smooth and balanced and I was able to hold it with one hand. The thing that pushed me over in getting it versus other ones was primarily the cost initially but the lifetime warranty was a big selling point.

They do sell a 3” backing plate but the shroud is 4” so that’s what has me thinking about a dedicated 3” polisher, I did compare the G8 mini to the PC 7424XP but the PC is slightly larger but is lighter than the G8, the PC is about the same price as the G8 when you add in the 3” plate but it only has a like a 3” warranty but I am in no hurry and have to justify the investment for the amount of time it will be used.
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