Differential oil change

[CarbonSteel]

That's my guess as well. Though customer complaints about damage may have contributed.

I would like to think so, but it could be wishful thinking if you put that into context with the failed locker sensors.

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[21JLURDG]

Wow! I came here to look for suggested differential oils and 400+ posts/28 pages later I think I understand the forum’s consensus. It would be really nice if someone could summarize all of this on the first page @OldGuyNewJeep @CarbonSteel and update it once in a while.

From the owner’s manual:

@Rhinebeck01 (mysterious man with no visible profile but generally posts very helpful & accurate information) stated in post #32 “Regardless of whether you tow or not, DO, put in the recommended weight fluids for the given differential” But he now recommends 75W140 for front and rear axles. Others recommend:
Front: 75W85 or 75W90
Rear (regardless of version): 75W140

Many here noted the published materials, available to JL owners with M220, specified only 75W85. @jellis4148 did some research and could not find any documentation from Jeep/FCA that recommended 75W140 for the M220 rear in North American models, so he asked for a published reference. Our mystery RhineBeck01 took it as a personal affront and the keyboard lit up for a few pages.

A few folks took up the challenge to find a published referenced, and CarbonSteel summarized it nicely in post #335:
Dana recommends 75W-140 in both axles, it is FCA that has deviated by recommending 75W-90.
Front - https://d3qx1uccksbb2n.cloudfront.net/docs/SPECSHEET-JL-FRONT-UD44A-42019.pdf
Rear - https://d3qx1uccksbb2n.cloudfront.net/docs/SPECSHEET-JL-REAR-UD44A-D44A-42019.pdf

Now for the recommended oils, these are them. They should all meet the specified API GL-5. The soft bag (e.g. FlexFill) is recommended for practical use:
Valvoline FlexFill SAE 75W-90 & 75W140
Valvoline SynPower SAE 75W-90 & 75W140
Royal Purple Max Gear 75W90 & 75W140

2022118:

You can add these to the list of recommended oils:

Amsoil Severe Gear (75W-110 + 75W-140)
Castrol (75W-140)
Lucas (75W-140)
Mobil 1 (75W-140)

If not operating in cold weather (and for break-in):

Castrol (85W-140)
Chevron Delo (85W-140)
Lucas (85W-140)
Mobil (85W-140)
Shell Spirax (85W-140)
Valvoline (85W-140)

If you have a LSD, make sure to use the LS additive if it's not already included in the oil you purchase.

Opinions vary on whether the differential plugs need a sealing material. RhineBeck01 recommended yellow Teflon tape, but later changed it to pink Teflon tape because (post #337) “I use this now a days... Nice to work with.. More stout..” However, from his link, both have identical properties and specifications:
https://www.amazon.com/D-N-Premium-...7e-82ef-ded41293973d&pd_rd_i=B08L9B9BK8&psc=1
From his link, both have identical: thickness (0.0004"), temp resistance (-190 to 370C), water pressure resistance (16 MPa), tensile strength (≥8 MPa), elongation (≥25%), density (1.3 g/cm3), made of PTFE, approval CSA 20755 & UL MH25811.

CarbonSteel (post #338) suggested the blue tape which has a lower temperature rating ( +260C vs +370C for yellow) but a higher water pressure resistance (10,000 psi vs 2300 psi for yellow).
https://www.amazon.com/Millrose-70660-Monster-Thread-260-Inch/dp/B00K80KTR6?pldnSite=1


Hopefully this is a fair summary for the 400+ posts, and I even included a tiny bit of the drama for daytime soap fans. Good Night and Good Luck.

 

[Rhinebeck01]

This forum thread has been ongoing for over 2 yrs... Things change over time due to new info, new product and more...


For the record...
Over the last so many months/for months .... and with new data, etc. presented by diff manufacturer's in mind, I am now running 75-140 in both front and rear regardless of whether the JL has the tow package or not. I used to run 75/90 in the front or a mix of 75/90 and 75-140 in the front. I always ran 75-140 in the rear.

I buy this diff fluid.... Additive is in this product already, so no additional additive needs to be added.. Flexfill bags are terrific to use and Valvoline is known to be a very good product.
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B08KB5LTJM/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1

I use pink Teflon tape when I have a choice of both pink or yellow. I have no problem using yellow.
Pink is more stout and specs are not the same as yellow. Teflon tape is not just for sealing... it is also important/helpful... so you can get the plug out next time.

YES, Flexfill bags are a pleasure to use.... I use Flex fills for all the diff fluid changes I do for myself and others..

 

[21JLURDG]

This forum thread has been ongoing for over 2 yrs... Things change over time due to new info, new product and more...

For the record...
Over the last so many months/for months .... and with new data, etc. presented by diff manufacturer's in mind, I am now running 75-140 in both front and rear regardless of whether the JL has the tow package or not.

Pink is more stout and specs are not the same as yellow.

I edited my post to reflect your comments and hopefully keep it relevant. I wish more people would do this so we could cut down on the 400+ post threads that only contain a limited amount of information. I don't see the advantage of keeping old opinions or outdated information just for historical purposes. I think most people come here to gather the latest information and begrudgingly wade through all the extraneous mush.

 

[word302]

I’m still wondering if anyone knows whether loctite is required for the diff cover bolts? This picture I came across for an aftermarket Dana diff cover suggests that is the case. As mentioned earlier in this thread the factory bolts on mine appeared to have red loctite on them when I removed them while servicing the diff yesterday.

That is not thread locker, it’s silicone to make your own gasket.

 

[quick66]

That is not thread locker, it’s silicone to make your own gasket.

I wasn't referring to the tube. I was referring to what appears to be thread locker on the bolts in the picture.

 

[word302]

I wasn't referring to the tube. I was referring to what appears to be thread locker on the bolts in the picture.

Ahh that makes sense. I didn't look that closely the first time. I concur that thread locker isn't needed.

 

[CarbonSteel]

Wow! I came here to look for suggested differential oils and 400+ posts/28 pages later I think I understand the forum’s consensus. It would be really nice if someone could summarize all of this on the first page @OldGuyNewJeep @CarbonSteel and update it once in a while.

From the owner’s manual:

@Rhinebeck01 (mysterious man with no visible profile but generally posts very helpful & accurate information) stated in post #32 “Regardless of whether you tow or not, DO, put in the recommended weight fluids for the given differential” But he now recommends 75W140 for front and rear axles. Others recommend:
Front: 75W85 or 75W90
Rear (regardless of version): 75W140

Many here noted the published materials, available to JL owners with M220, specified only 75W85. @jellis4148 did some research and could not find any documentation from Jeep/FCA that recommended 75W140 for the M220 rear in North American models, so he asked for a published reference. Our mystery RhineBeck01 took it as a personal affront and the keyboard lit up for a few pages.

A few folks took up the challenge to find a published referenced, and CarbonSteel summarized it nicely in post #335:
Dana recommends 75W-140 in both axles, it is FCA that has deviated by recommending 75W-90.
Front - https://d3qx1uccksbb2n.cloudfront.net/docs/SPECSHEET-JL-FRONT-UD44A-42019.pdf
Rear - https://d3qx1uccksbb2n.cloudfront.net/docs/SPECSHEET-JL-REAR-UD44A-D44A-42019.pdf

Now for the recommended oils, these are them. They should all meet the specified API GL-5. The soft bag (e.g. FlexFill) is recommended for practical use:
Valvoline FlexFill SAE 75W-90 & 75W140
Valvoline SynPower SAE 75W-90 & 75W140
Royal Purple Max Gear 75W90 & 75W140

If you have a LSD, make sure to use the LS additive if it's not already included in the oil you purchase.

Opinions vary on whether the differential plugs need a sealing material. RhineBeck01 recommended yellow Teflon tape, but later changed it to pink Teflon tape because (post #337) “I use this now a days... Nice to work with.. More stout..” However, from his link, both have identical properties and specifications:
https://www.amazon.com/D-N-Premium-...7e-82ef-ded41293973d&pd_rd_i=B08L9B9BK8&psc=1
From his link, both have identical: thickness (0.0004"), temp resistance (-190 to 370C), water pressure resistance (16 MPa), tensile strength (≥8 MPa), elongation (≥25%), density (1.3 g/cm3), made of PTFE, approval CSA 20755 & UL MH25811.

CarbonSteel (post #338) suggested the blue tape which has a lower temperature rating ( +260C vs +370C for yellow) but a higher water pressure resistance (10,000 psi vs 2300 psi for yellow).
https://www.amazon.com/Millrose-70660-Monster-Thread-260-Inch/dp/B00K80KTR6?pldnSite=1


Hopefully this is a fair summary for the 400+ posts, and I even included a tiny bit of the drama for daytime soap fans. Good Night and Good Luck.

You can add these to the list of recommended oils:

Amsoil Severe Gear (75W-110 + 75W-140)
Castrol (75W-140)
Lucas (75W-140)
Mobil 1 (75W-140)

If not operating in cold weather (and for break-in):

Castrol (85W-140)
Chevron Delo (85W-140)
Lucas (85W-140)
Mobil (85W-140)
Shell Spirax (85W-140)
Valvoline (85W-140)

 

[Tncdrew]

You can add these to the list of recommended oils:

Amsoil Severe Gear (75W-110 + 75W-140)
Castrol (75W-140)
Lucas (75W-140)
Mobil 1 (75W-140)

If not operating in cold weather (and for break-in):

Castrol (85W-140)
Chevron Delo (85W-140)
Lucas (85W-140)
Mobil (85W-140)
Shell Spirax (85W-140)
Valvoline (85W-140)

Some valuable insights....

https://eastcoastgearsupply.com/ft-2536-ecgs-gear-oil-recommendation.html

 

[Rodeoflyer]

Amsoil 75-110 in BOTH front and rear. it's more than sufficient, comes in a little squeeze bag so I can swap it every 20k (severe use). It's MORE than sufficient for anything you could ever do with a Jeep. It's also completely clear gear oil which helps me see it on the stick (ARB covers). I think it's the best stuff you ever use. If you don't have the threaded drain plugs on the axle housing (like the JLUR rubicon d200-210), then buy some aftermarket covers.. prob solved.

 

[CarbonSteel]

Some valuable insights....

https://eastcoastgearsupply.com/ft-2536-ecgs-gear-oil-recommendation.html

ECGS has been my go to for gears and the like for a while, but there are a number of points where I disagree. There is no conventional oil that will outperform a synthetic period. Synthetics handle cold and heat far better than a conventional and they typically handle shearing and have better anti-foaming qualities. In extreme cold, a conventional oil will not flow properly where as a synthetic will--example here:




Conventional oil will also begin to break down from high temperatures long before a synthetic will. Additive packages vary between manufacturers and is not unique to conventional versus synthetic and I would love to see the data that substantiates this statement--especially the part that is italicized:

"Amsoil severe duty: Better than all economy Dino's and all synthetics on the market, but marginal over a quality dino with additive package."

I am not an Amsoil shill by any stretch of the imagination (I think their engine oils are far overpriced for the performance versus OTC synthetics), but I have used their gear oil long enough and for enough miles to know there is no conventional oil even with the best additive package that money can buy (whatever is meant by that statement) that will outperform Amsoil and it is certainly not Lucas.

With that said, I use Chevron, Shell, or Valvoline 85W-140 to break in all of my gears--IF ambient temperatures allow for its use. Why? It's cheap, it will be dumped every 500 miles for the first 2K miles, it provides ample protection, and it is "good enough" for break-in. I switch to synthetics after break-in is complete.

 

[Tncdrew]

ECGS has been my go to for gears and the like for a while, but there are a number of points where I disagree. There is no conventional oil that will outperform a synthetic period. Synthetics handle cold and heat far better than a conventional and they typically handle shearing and have better anti-foaming qualities. In extreme cold, a conventional oil will not flow properly where as a synthetic will--example here:

Conventional oil will also begin to break down from high temperatures long before a synthetic will. Additive packages vary between manufacturers and is not unique to conventional versus synthetic and I would love to see the data that substantiates this statement--especially the part that is italicized:

"Amsoil severe duty: Better than all economy Dino's and all synthetics on the market, but marginal over a quality dino with additive package."

I am not an Amsoil shill by any stretch of the imagination (I think their engine oils are far overpriced for the performance versus OTC synthetics), but I have used their gear oil long enough and for enough miles to know there is no conventional oil even with the best additive package that money can buy (whatever is meant by that statement) that will outperform Amsoil and it is certainly not Lucas.

With that said, I use Chevron, Shell, or Valvoline85W-140 to break in all of my gears--IF ambient temperatures allow for its use. Why? It's cheap, it will be dumped every 500 miles for the first 2K miles, it provides ample protection, and it is "good enough" for break-in. I switch to synthetics after break-in is complete.

Wow! 4 diff oil changes in 2K miles!

 

[CarbonSteel]

Amsoil 75-110 in BOTH front and rear. it's more than sufficient, comes in a little squeeze bag so I can swap it every 20k (severe use). It's MORE than sufficient for anything you could ever do with a Jeep. It's also completely clear gear oil which helps me see it on the stick (ARB covers). I think it's the best stuff you ever use. If you don't have the threaded drain plugs on the axle housing (like the JLUR rubicon d200-210), then buy some aftermarket covers.. prob solved.

If you would have said Amsoil 75W-140, I would be in full agreement and for clarity I have used Amsoil 75W-110 in the front axle of many of my trucks and even in the front axle of my Rubicon (only because I had some left over from my F-250 PSD).

With that said, there is a reason that Dana (NOT FCA or Stellantis) recommends 75W-140 in both Dana 44 Advantek axles and it has to do with overall operating temperatures, the redesign of the gears themselves, as well as the load on the axle. Let us not forget the ring gear in an M220 axle is smaller than the ring gear in a 1980's Ford Mustang, yet the Mustang axle holds 25% more oil than the Jeep does and does not seem the loads many Jeeps do.

A little background on why 75W-110 was invented--before the SAE J306 tables were updated some years ago, xW-90 covered a kinectic viscosity (KV) range @ 100°C cSt from 13.5 up to 24.0. This was deemed to be too large of a range and xW-110 was introduced thereby splitting the range to:

xW-90 = 13.5 to 18.5
xW-110 = 18.5 to 24.0
xW-140 = 24.0 to 32.5

Ergo, IMHO, 75W-110 is a heavier duty version of 75W-90, but it cannot match 75W-140 and equally IMHO, 75W-110 is perfect for the front, but I would still use 75W-140 in the rear. When considering that (at least the last time I checked) only Amsoil and Redline make 75W-110, it makes sense to buy a more readily available (and definitely more cost effective) OTC 75W-140 instead.

 

[CarbonSteel]

Wow! 4 diff oil changes in 2K miles!

Yeah, but that is just me--not saying that anyone else should, but given the metal generation that happens in these D44's, $14 in Valvoline oil is nothing compared to the cost of the re-gear and I want the metal out of the axle versus allowing it to run all over and in and out of the bearings.

 

[Tncdrew]

I'll be breaking in, and likely running the 140W in both ends. That weight will have a bit of quieting effect with the front torq locker as well.

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