Brakes

[Ratbert]

There is no pad that is going to significantly improve the braking power of the OEM brakes nor will rotors--I changed my OEM to PowerStop rotors and Z36 brake pads and there was minimal IF ANY improvement. It was a complete waste of money for the PowerStops--BUT I have a set of rotors and pads with less than 1K miles that I can sell to anyone who wants them!


Look at the difference between the Powerstop rotors with OEM calipers:

Versus the Teraflex:

Here are some data points and these are the largest brakes I can install with my current wheels (17") and here are the differences:

Front:

OEM Rotors = 12.9" versus Teraflex 14" or 17% more total braking surface
OEM Piston = 4 x 2" versus Teraflex 8 x 2" or 100% more total piston surface


Rear:

OEM Rotors = 13.4" versus Teraflex 14" or 8.8% more total braking surface
OEM Piston = 2 x 1.88" versus Teraflex 8 x 2" or 325.5% more total piston surface

Assuming that the braking surface is ~2" wide, don't the fronts have ~9% more surface area instead of 17? It's still significant, but not quite that much.

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[CarbonSteel]

Assuming that the braking surface is ~2" wide, don't the fronts have ~9% more surface area instead of 17? It's still significant, but not quite that much.

8.52% x 2 = 17% more total braking surface in the front versus OEM.

 

[Ratbert]

8.52% x 2 = 17% more total braking surface in the front versus OEM.

The area of a circle is Pi * r squared. Then you subtract the area of the inner circle that isn't part of the braking surface. I'm assuming 2" of braking surface, so that comes out to a total difference of 9.24% for the fronts...correct?

 

[CarbonSteel]

The area of a circle is Pi * r squared. Then you subtract the area of the inner circle that isn't part of the braking surface. I'm assuming 2" of braking surface, so that comes out to a total difference of 9.24% for the fronts...correct?

Well...I am not assuming the braking surface size is 2". Each side is 8.52% larger in diameter. The inner circle is fixed on both the OEM rotors and the Teraflex so from my perspective, there is an additional 17% of braking surface due to the increase in the rotor size.

In the end, this is semantics anyway--there is no comparison between the OEM and Teraflex for braking power and that is all that really matters.

 

[Jgc650i]

I installed the Teraflex Delta brakes on mine a couple weeks ago. Couldn’t agree more with @CarbonSteel. They are awesome and night and day difference from OEM.

 

[Upnarms]

I'm sure teraflex are great but at around 4x the cost, that's tough to swallow. I've never been a fan of drilled and slotted rotors for a jeep. Less surface and more areas for sand and rocks to get stuck imo. I haven't checked but does black magic make pads for the jl? I had them on my tj and they were decent. As far as locking up your brakes, I'm not sure you'll get that with abs. I do wth my tj with no abs.

 

[Ratbert]

Well...I am not assuming the braking surface size is 2". Each side is 8.52% larger in diameter. The inner circle is fixed on both the OEM rotors and the Teraflex so from my perspective, there is an additional 17% of braking surface due to the increase in the rotor size.

In the end, this is semantics anyway--there is no comparison between the OEM and Teraflex for braking power and that is all that really matters.

You're assuming that the entire diameter of the brake (and not just what's being touched by pads) is braking surface area. That's an invalid assumption, right?

 

[CarbonSteel]

You're assuming that the entire diameter of the brake (and not just what's being touched by pads) is braking surface area. That's an invalid assumption, right?

In the end, it just does not matter given the performance improvements, and I have no plans to go and measure the surface area of the Teraflex versus OEM in an attempt to validate either stance.

If 9% is the number that you like...go with it.

 

[roaniecowpony]

I'm sure teraflex are great but at around 4x the cost, that's tough to swallow. I've never been a fan of drilled and slotted rotors for a jeep. Less surface and more areas for sand and rocks to get stuck imo. I haven't checked but does black magic make pads for the jl? I had them on my tj and they were decent. As far as locking up your brakes, I'm not sure you'll get that with abs. I do wth my tj with no abs.

The point is that the OEM HD brakes just don't have the power to get into the ABS regime from highway speed, even with stock 33" tires on a Rubicon. When you go to a 35 or larger, when you add a bunch of heavy mods (winch, steel bumpers, etc), braking (lack of) becomes a (even more of a) liability. Brake limitations are more about highway driving and have little to do with trail needs. If you live in the country and never drive the highways, you may never need to do a panic stop from highway speeds and stock brakes will be fine.

I love my Delta brakes and would not want to be without them on the roads, even with 33s. Everytime I put my foot on the brake pedal, I'm reminded of how good they work and how piss-poor the stock brakes were.

 

[CarbonSteel]

The point is that the OEM HD brakes just don't have the power to get into the ABS regime from highway speed, even with stock 33" tires on a Rubicon. When you go to a 35 or larger, when you add a bunch of heavy mods (winch, steel bumpers, etc), braking (lack of) becomes a (even more of a) liability. Brake limitations are more about highway driving and have little to do with trail needs. If you live in the country and never drive the highways, you may never need to do a panic stop from highway speeds and stock brakes will be fine.

I love my Delta brakes and would not want to be without them on the roads, even with 33s. Everytime I put my foot on the brake pedal, I'm reminded of how good they work and how piss-poor the stock brakes were.

 

[Bill_BCNtoNY]

You guys just made me add sth I didn't plan for to my ever-growing Jeep wishlist - those Teraflex brakes look great and would make for an interesting (if expensive!) opportunity for me to learn working on my brakes

 

[CarbonSteel]

You guys just made me add sth I didn't plan for to my ever-growing Jeep wishlist - those Teraflex brakes look great and would make for an interesting (if expensive!) opportunity for me to learn working on my brakes

If you have a heavy Jeep or large tires--they are totally worth the price and effort. They have speedbleeders on them which makes the initial bleeding a one man operation.

You will need to use JSCAN or similar to put the ABS system into bleed mode to ensure that you have removed all of the air. I highly recommend DOT4 or DOT 5.1 (not 5.0) for the brake fluid over DOT3.

 

[Upnarms]

I've got 35s on my rubicon, my brakes are decent. I drive highways and off road. Im absolutely convinced you are right the teraflex would be better based on your experience, but I haven't had a situation, even a panic stop, where my factory ones didn't do the job. I have a 2.5" lift and a RTT, but other than that no extra heavy steel bumpers, winch, etc.

I am impressed with the life of the mopar pads so far. 52k miles and they probably have 50 percent life left.

 

[OSCAR II]

There is no pad that is going to significantly improve the braking power of the OEM brakes nor will rotors--I changed my OEM to PowerStop rotors and Z36 brake pads and there was minimal IF ANY improvement. It was a complete waste of money for the PowerStops--BUT I have a set of rotors and pads with less than 1K miles that I can sell to anyone who wants them!


Look at the difference between the Powerstop rotors with OEM calipers:

Front:

OEM Rotors = 12.9" versus Teraflex 14" or 17% more total braking surface
OEM Piston = 4 x 2" versus Teraflex 8 x 2" or 100% more total piston surface


Rear:

OEM Rotors = 13.4" versus Teraflex 14" or 8.8% more total braking surface
OEM Piston = 2 x 1.88" versus Teraflex 8 x 2" or 325.5% more total piston surface

Gotta agree with you on the Powerstops. We got a great deal on them (complete kit) but we didn't notice any difference in braking.

But what was really disappointing was at 40K when they needed pads replaced all the seals were dry rotted just shot. I've never had a brake job where I couldn't get at least one change without having to rebuild the calipers. Even the original calipers the seals are in better condition.
That was about a year and a half ago. Couldn't find seals or pistons anywhere (one was pretty scored up), wound up getting another setup .... had to get it back on the road.

They weren't leaking any fluid thats just from sitting in the box.

 

[CarbonSteel]

Gotta agree with you on the Powerstops. We got a great deal on them (complete kit) but we didn't notice any difference in braking.

But what was really disappointing was at 40K when they needed pads replaced all the seals were dry rotted just shot. I've never had a brake job where I couldn't get at least one change without having to rebuild the calipers. Even the original calipers the seals are in better condition.
That was about a year and a half ago. Couldn't find seals or pistons anywhere (one was pretty scored up), wound up getting another setup .... had to get it back on the road.

They weren't leaking any fluid thats just from sitting in the box.

That is pretty bad. I did not go the whole caliper/rotor/pad route (only rotors + pads) but I was more than a little disappointed in the cost vs. performance. I spent 25% of the cost of the Teraflex's on the Powerstops with no improvement.

I have not been a fan of @TeraFlex products in the past (thought a few were rushed to market and they were acquired by an investment group), but one thing I can easily say is they take the feedback from the user base and ACTUALLY use it to improve their products.

I looked at Alcon, Baer, and Brembo prior to choosing Teraflex and for the money and the fact that I did not have to change my wheels--you will not find a better braking upgrade for a Jeep. If FCA had any brains at all, they would just add Teraflex as an option and be done with it.

FCA's definition of HD Brakes and mine are not even in the same dictionary.

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