Balance Beads

[jabtyler]

Been on the highway a little this week and I have noticed that sometimes the steering wheel shakes at higher speeds. if I come to a complete stop then get back up to 65 ish the wheel is not shaking anymore. does that mean I need more beads?

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[J0E]

I routinely tear off big chunks of tread rock crawling. Rather than getting my wheels rebalanced once a week, balance beads seems like a better solution.

I plan on replacing my 37x12.5R17 KM3's with 37x14.6R17 NITTO Mud Grapplers. I'll have the tire shop do the initial balance, then start adding balance beads when I start tearing off rubber.

This youtube video says large off-road tires with aggressive treads are a good candidate.

 

[jabtyler]

The more research I do the more conflicting information I get. let me know how your work out.

 

[Some Random Guy]

Mine worked great, but the counterbalance brand would clog their own valve stems. I don’t think it was meant for air up/down continuously. I went with Magnum this time and will be going back up to my 39’s after axle swap.

 

[U EEDIOT]

Internal balancing works.

In 2006, I bought a 2000 XJ with 60K miles on it.
Put a 5" lift and 33's on it.

Without any external balancing, 8oz of Air Soft plastic BB's inside the tires kept my 33's balanced for more than 60k city/highway miles.

I made a 1200 mile trip 2-3 times a year for over 10 years with those tires.

I never took a chunk out of one of the tires on a rock, so I don't know about that.

After 15 years when I sold the XJ, I couldn't hear the BB's bouncing around i the tires anymore.
They likely turned to dust.

But, it still drove smooth on the highway.

 

[Gorilla57]

37x14.6R17 NITTO Mud Grapplers

There is no Nitto that size.....you’ve said this wrong a couple of times now.

 

[firedude]

I have the balance beads in 37 BFG Ko2's. Anyone who has run these tires knows they take a lot to balance most of the time. I first had them on my 3.6 Rubi. Now on my 392. I have noticed that the faster I accelerate the more vibration I get. If I take it slower they adjust better. Noticed it right off with the 392.

 

[Bambamzx10]

I use beads in my motorcycle and one thing I was told, because im also new to beads is that when they install your tires they're supposed to use a silicon based lube to install your tires. If they use a water based lube the lube can clump up the beads causing them to ride horrible.

 

[zouch]

i used beads in the wheels on my BMW moto and they worked fantastically for many sets of tires (both knobbies and street tires). tried them with weights, without weights, and they always kept things smoother than any static weight-balanced system (including load balancing). they also had the benefit of seeming to take the sharp 'edge' off of an impact with a sharp road edge like a trench cut seam; perhaps by diffusing the energy of the impact.

i use a balancing fluid in the tires of my KTM Adv moto and that's worked well for several tires as well, especially since it has the additional benefit of being a puncture sealant, and it also stays pretty well gooped out at the contact patch area of the tire.
i tried the same fluid in a set of KO2s on my old J**p and it didn't seem to work well, but those tires seemed to be the second-worst set of tires to balance i've ever dealt with; i sold them after a long trip and went back to KM3s. (the first worst was a set of Goodyear Wranglers that were not only out of balance, but out of round and out of true. there was no way to put those tires on the ground such that they wouldn't wiggle and/or hop.)

i've not yet gone to dynamic balancing media on the Willys because i've had other issues to deal with that have had a higher priority, but certainly plan to consider it when i've done the homework to be confident that i've found the proper way to do it with beadlocks that will work with routine highway use and airing down/up.

I use beads in my motorcycle and one thing I was told, because im also new to beads is that when they install your tires they're supposed to use a silicon based lube to install your tires. If they use a water based lube the lube can clump up the beads causing them to ride horrible.

 

[J0E]

There is no Nitto that size.....you’ve said this wrong a couple of times now.

That's the actual size, not the nominal size.

For serious rock crawling, the tires get out of balance due to shredding tread every time you go out. Dynamic balancing via beads seems like the best fit for rock crawling.

Balance beads are tricky. You read pros and cons and there never seems to be a middle ground. Why? Lack of info. I've heard it many times. They are either the best thing ever or the biggest waste of money. I believe people fall into a trap when looking at a chart to pick their required weight.

The charts lie.

I have personally experienced many different wheel and tire combos that require zero OZ's of weight to balance. So what happens when the chart says you need 10oz's of weight to balance your combo? The media has to offset itself. Which isn't a fun situation.

Wheels and tires are out of round. So you need to balance them. We all believe that. But no 2 combos are the same. You can mount up 5 wheel and tire combos and get 5 different weight requirements. Why? Because wheels and tires aren't perfect.

If you have a combo that is so far out of round there is nothing you can do to balance it. I also believe that people get trapped into a false sense of balance when the tire monkey puts the combo on their machine and gets it to read 0.

You have to start with the out of round nature of a wheel and a tire. Years ago wheels and tires were balanced using a bubble balancer. You place your combo on the bubble balancer and you'll see one side is usually closer to the ground than the other side. I call that the heavy side because that is the direction the combo is out of balance.

If you get the heavy side of the tire on the heavy side of the wheel you'll have a difficult time getting the combo to balance. That's why road force balancers were created. You can measure what's going on and adjust the tire on the wheel to get the least amount of hop in the combo.

Then you balance.

In my opinion, that step has to happen for balance media to have a chance at being right. Once you find out how to mount the tire on the wheel you need to put the combo on a bubble balancer to see how much weight you need. You put weight out at the tread and however much it takes to bring the combo level is how much goes inside the tire.

I'm a big fan of media. Especially when we go chunk tread off road. The media will move around and help you out. I feel like installing media correctly is a bunch of work. Mount them up just to measure then tear them down again to install. Not a lot of people like going that distance to get it right. If you're one of those people... pay to have them balanced traditionally with stick on weights.

Suppose you do it right but then shred a bunch of tire out wheeling? It seems like balance beads would keep it closer to balanced.

 

[Old Dogger]

Road Force Balancing, will give one the most accurate Balance!

 

[zouch]

initially, perhaps; but that's just a start.
things start to change as soon as the tire touches the ground, and even more significantly on the trail.

that's where Dynamic balancing comes in.

Road Force Balancing, will give one the most accurate Balance!

 

[jabtyler]

After adding more balance beads and getting no better results, I took all the beads out and got a road force balance done. These tires ride great now. I can now say I have experience with balance beads and they do not work.

 

[five9dak]

I don’t know how they told you they were doing a road force balance and ended up installing beads. AFAIK those are two incompatible processes.

RF requires installing fixed weights to equalize the force against a simulated road surface roller.

Beads are moving weights obviously.

The road force system can optionally identify when a wheel and tire assembly can improve from "clocking" the tire relative to the rim so their respective imbalances help cancel each other out. The rim weights are part of the process either way. After both of these procedures some imbalance may remain, either because it is acceptable, the best achievable, or some error in user application of the weights compared to the theoretical position. Beads could still compliment both of these procedures after the fact, albeit a smaller amount needed.

The clocking procedure is a hassle with a normal bead. If this shop was doing it with beadlocks, they are saints.

 

[DOOKEY]

Dookey strikes again!

If you get the heavy side of the tire on the heavy side of the wheel you'll have a difficult time getting the combo to balance. That's why road force balancers were created. You can measure what's going on and adjust the tire on the wheel to get the least amount of hop in the combo.

Then you balance.

In my opinion, that step has to happen for balance media to have a chance at being right.

So... to expand all the knowledge here.

After adding more balance beads and getting no better results, I took all the beads out and got a road force balance done. These tires ride great now. I can now say I have experience with balance beads and they do not work.

What wheel and tire combo do you have and how much weight did it finally take to get them in balance?

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