5W 30 versus 0W 20

[Jeep Junkie]

most likely in how the oil was stored or mixed or transported ie might use aluminum vats or pipes it could have come from the other additives ie maybe they came in contact with minute parts of aluminum..multitude of reasons..try asking the oil manufacturer..

Done!

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[CarbonSteel]

Done!

Again, massively overpriced, zero approvals or certifications, and wear elements and other chemicals that show up in a VOA?

Seriously, hard pass...

 

[CarbonSteel]

My point exactly...

 

[Jeep Junkie]

Again, massively overpriced, zero approvals or certifications, and wear elements and other chemicals that show up in a VOA?

Seriously, hard pass...

This Mobil 1 VOA also has 2 Iron and 2 Aluminum

 

[CarbonSteel]

This Mobil 1 VOA also has 2 Iron and 2 Aluminum

2 != 9.

There can always be traces of wear metals, but HPL had multiple plus sodium and potassium.

Put that aside--look at the price of an oil that has no approvals.

Where is the cost justification?

 

[azjl#3]

Sorry, long read:

Has anyone dug deep to find the exact specs to comply with mopar MS-6395 specification ??

Best I can find is fluffy verbage, no hard details.

Here is AI find, with nothing concrete.

Key Aspects of the MS-6395 Specification:

• Purpose: It ensures that oils meet specific requirements for lubricating Chrysler engines.
• Engine Coverage: This specification is formulated for many Chrysler, Dodge, Jeep, and Ram models, specifically mentioning 5.7L Hemi V8, 3.6L V6, and 2.4L gasoline engines.
• Oils Covered: Both synthetic and conventional oils can be certified to meet the MS-6395 standard.
• Requirements: The certification specifies viscosity grades and other properties to ensure proper lubrication, engine protection, cleaner pistons, improved fuel economy, and performance in varying temperatures.
• Basis: The MS-6395 standard is based on the API SM / ILSAC GF-5 standards, along with additional testing specifically for Chrysler engines.
• API and ILSAC: Oils seeking MS-6395 certification must first meet all API Engine Oil Licensing and Certification System (EOLCS) requirements for ILSAC GF-5 certification and have a current API license. ILSAC GF-5 oils improve fuel economy and performance, including high-temperature deposit protection for pistons.
• Recommended Viscosities: The specification covers a range of viscosities, including SAE 0W20, 5W20, 5W30, and 10W30. However, some sources emphasize 5W-20 and 5W-30 as particularly important.
• Certified Oils: Several major oil brands, such as Pennzoil, Quaker State, and Royal Purple, offer oils that meet the MS-6395 specification in both synthetic and conventional varieties.

And worse this:

Important Notes:

• The acquisition of Chrysler by Fiat led to some changes regarding certified oils, with Mobil 1 being removed from the list but many other popular options remaining.

Also of note, the spec does not cover the 2.0


Now, I can only believe there is one reason Mobil was removed from the list, they didn't pay stelantis enough money, not sure where AI got the info, looks like mobil has a 6395 spec oil.

Which brings me to believing, MS6395 is nothing more than a good oil meeting GL5 standards, and then limiting that group to certain viscosities and manufacturers who buy their way in.

Reviewing Royal purple, which meets and exceeds GL6 specs, their 5w30 meets 6395, and then this:

• INCREASED FUEL EFFICIENCY - A low coefficient of friction results in optimized fuel efficiency (our 5W-30 meets the fuel economy requirements of a 0W-20 oil; our 0W-20 meets fuel economy requirements of a 0W-16)
https://images.oreillyauto.com/part...rformance-motor-oil_dexgen3-pds-10dec2024.pdf

 

[roaniecowpony]

Here you go.

 

[roaniecowpony]

A more contemporary version.

 

[Jeep Junkie]

Again, massively overpriced, zero approvals or certifications, and wear elements and other chemicals that show up in a VOA?

Seriously, hard pass...

Received their reply.

 

[Jeep Junkie]

Wait, so $123 total or $20.50 per QT? Seriously??

There is NO way I'm paying that for an oil that has ZERO approvals or specifications.

Given your propensity to fall into paralysis by analysis, I am floored that you are...

Good luck!

Also this

 

[CarbonSteel]

Also this

While it theoretically explains the aluminum, that does not explain the other components that were found, it does not compensate for zero approvals/certifications, and definitely does nothing to mitigate the cost.

This does not change my mind that this is a massively overpriced oil that has zero approvals or certifications.

Color me exceedingly skeptical that this "magic elixir" will facilitate engine longevity in any shape or fashion over any commercial off the shelf oil that has the appropriate approvals.

Think Amsoil or Royal Purple here...

 

[Jeep Junkie]

While it theoretically explains the aluminum, that does not explain the other components that were found, it does not compensate for zero approvals/certifications, and definitely does nothing to mitigate the cost.

This does not change my mind that this is a massively overpriced oil that has zero approvals or certifications.

Color me exceedingly skeptical that this "magic elixir" will facilitate engine longevity in any shape or fashion over any commercial off the shelf oil that has the appropriate approvals.

Think Amsoil or Royal Purple here...

That's true, this oil falls in the category of Redline, Amsoil and Driven. Those also have zero approvals. Because Oil Geek says that you can't qualify for approvals if you use stuff more than what API and ILSAC allow. API and ILSAC will not allow 1000 ppm Zinc and 2,600 ppm Calcium.

 

[CarbonSteel]

That's true, this oil falls in the category of Redline, Amsoil and Driven. Those also have zero approvals. Because Oil Geek says that you can't qualify for approvals if you use stuff more than what API and ILSAC allow. API and ILSAC will not allow 1000 ppm Zinc and 2,600 ppm Calcium.

Not exactly correct; it means that with the levels of zinc and calcium they cannot obtain API SM/SN/SN+/SP approval, but there are older approvals that can be obtained such as API SL or similar that are typically used in older engines that require those levels of zinc and calcium such as a few of the racing oils on the market--which would give some level of confidence. It also would not prevent them from obtaining other certifications from OEMs particularly since the name of the oil is "Super Car".

In the end, they are asking you to trust them with zero third party verification and/or via word of mouth as a form of record their oil is good and it may well be, but no way would I pay that for it.

However, given the zinc and phosphorus levels of this oil--no one should be using it long term in any vehicle that has a catalytic converter.

 

[Jeep Junkie]

Not exactly correct; it means that with the levels of zinc and calcium they cannot obtain API SM/SN/SN+/SP approval, but there are older approvals that can be obtained such as API SL or similar that are typically used in older engines that require those levels of zinc and calcium such as a few of the racing oils on the market--which would give some level of confidence. It also would not prevent them from obtaining other certifications from OEMs particularly since the name of the oil is "Super Car".

In the end, they are asking you to trust them with zero third party verification and/or via word of mouth as a form of record their oil is good and it may well be, but no way would I pay that for it.

However, given the zinc and phosphorus levels of this oil--no one should be using it long term in any vehicle that has a catalytic converter.

Maybe because they cannot sell as much oil as Mobil and Pennzoil so they can't afford those certifications. If they get those certifications, their prices would go even higher. Shell is sitting on top of gas fields in Qatar, and they're turning all that cheap natural gas into oil. While hpl buys PAO at top dollar. PAO is not cheap, and this Supercar is full of it. It has as a poor point of-86° f

 

[CarbonSteel]

Maybe because they cannot sell as much oil as Mobil and Pennzoil so they can't afford those certifications. If they get those certifications, their prices would go even higher. Shell is sitting on top of gas fields in Qatar, and they're turning all that cheap natural gas into oil. While hpl buys PAO at top dollar. PAO is not cheap, and this Supercar is full of it. It has as a poor point of-86° f

At more than $20 a quart (including shipping costs), they should be able to afford whatever is needed to obtain approvals/certifications IF they wanted to. Irrelevant from my perspective...it makes no sense to use this oil.

For example:

Mobil 1 ESP 0W-30 = $5.60 per QT (without tax), will not poison your catalytic converter, and has these approvals:
MB-Approval 229.31
MB-Approval 229.51
MB-Approval 229.52
Porsche C30
VW 504 00
VW 507 00

and meets or exceeds:

API SL
ACEA C3
API SN Engine Test Requirements
API SN PLUS ENGINE TEST REQUIREMENTS
API SP ENGINE TEST REQUIREMENTS
API SQ Engine Test Requirements

HPL Super Car 0W-20 = $16.80 per QT (without tax/shipping), will poison your catalytic converter, and has these approvals:
<none>

and meets or exceeds:

VW 502 00/505 00
ACEA A3/B4
API SL
Daimler MB 229.3/229.5
Renault RN0700/0710
Volvo 95200356

Which one makes more sense to use in a passenger car or light truck?

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