Winch Wiring Question

[Zandcwhite]

It looks like that chart is for Class T fuses from BlueSea but the table below is for Class T JJN, TJN and A3T fuses. I’m not saying this is *the* table for my fuse but the numbers are similar. They match up better than your graph.

With you running a 500 amp winch with 500 amp capable cables, and perhaps a stock alternator, I’d go with a 500 amp ANL fuse and certainly not a Class T slow blow. If you get in a pickle where safety of the circuit is a lesser concern, you can always stack your lead on the hot side of the fuse (absent a short) and hope for the best.

I didn’t go with ANL even though they’re cheaper by a long shot but I’ll be damned if I can remember why….LOL

You could still see up to 15s at 600A before your fuse pops, like I said you 650cca stock battery won't output that kind of power for that kind of time. And your alternator doesn't put out near enough amps to keep the battery from discharging in a hurry. I wouldn't test it with the sensitive electronics in the Jeep, but I'd bet you could take your fused lead right to the negative post and not blow your fuse.

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[VKSheridan]

Yeah for mine, the math came up to maximum 10 seconds.

Assuming our battery is 650 CCA, that means it is rated to put out 650 amps at 0 degrees for 30 seconds while keeping voltage above 7.2 VDC. As you probably observed when you were using batteries for welding, the amperage was mucho higher and lasted much longer than a few seconds. It’s that green arc flashing, plate warping, copper melting opportunity that I‘m looking to avoid.

The fuse don’t add much weight and I hope I never come in here and say I popped it. It’d mean I rolled a boulder or took front end damage while the circuit was energized and that would suck.

Those guys that wire straight to the battery are nuts in my book. Accidentally rear end something and put that hot lug of that winch into their frame will make their bad day a whole lot worse……

 

[azjl#3]

Come on now, winch wires usually connect at back of or top of winch. If whatever I rear end or hit head on, damages the wires to ground out, the Jeep is already a total loss.

I guess decades of guys using warn m8274 we’re all crazy.

I have never seen or heard of a report citing a winch wire causing more damage. I have never seen a report of a fuse saving a winch or vehicle.

fusing a winch is a solution to a problem that does not exist.

that said, if you want one, knock yourself out, just don’t claim anything you cannot prove.

full disclosure, I do have an off on switch by battery to isolate power to the winch. It’s got Bluetooth and sitting there a little blue light is on. Besides that, I don’t think it a great idea to have a winch some kid could play with while it sits there. But, I don’t have the switch to prevent grounding in an accident.

 

[Zandcwhite]

Come on now, winch wires usually connect at back of or top of winch. If whatever I rear end or hit head on, damages the wires to ground out, the Jeep is already a total loss.

I guess decades of guys using warn m8274 we’re all crazy.

I have never seen or heard of a report citing a winch wire causing more damage. I have never seen a report of a fuse saving a winch or vehicle.

fusing a winch is a solution to a problem that does not exist.

that said, if you want one, knock yourself out, just don’t claim anything you cannot prove.

full disclosure, I do have an off on switch by battery to isolate power to the winch. It’s got Bluetooth and sitting there a little blue light is on. Besides that, I don’t think it a great idea to have a winch some kid could play with while it sits there. But, I don’t have the switch to prevent grounding in an accident.

And our batteries are held in by plastic hold downs these days. The battery becoming dislodged is more of a concern than my winch in my opinion.

 

[VKSheridan]

Come on now, winch wires usually connect at back of or top of winch. If whatever I rear end or hit head on, damages the wires to ground out, the Jeep is already a total loss.

I guess decades of guys using warn m8274 we’re all crazy.

I have never seen or heard of a report citing a winch wire causing more damage. I have never seen a report of a fuse saving a winch or vehicle.

fusing a winch is a solution to a problem that does not exist.

that said, if you want one, knock yourself out, just don’t claim anything you cannot prove.

I can easily prove a cable shorted to ground will do damage. Heck, don’t trust my magic, you can test your wisdom yourself!

Take your anchor chain, block, steel rope, pry bar or wrench and jumper the lug to ground. Share the link on YouTube video to prove your genius.

Get on now, I’ll wait…..

 

[Zandcwhite]

I can easily prove a cable shorted to ground will do damage. Heck, don’t trust my magic, you can test your wisdom yourself!

Take your anchor chain, block, steel rope, pry bar or wrench and jumper the lug to ground. Share the link on YouTube video to prove your genius.

Get on now, I’ll wait…..

Show me how you twist the front of the Jeep so that the winch lug is touching the frame though? The only thing it is anywhere near is the plastic grill. I don't care about melted wires when my Jeep is totaled.

 

[VKSheridan]

I hear ya on the battery hold downs Zach.

As to metal around the winch, it can be accidental contact with slinging the hook, snatch block, rigging chain, rope, tools, etc. Hell, I’ve seen guys lay jack handles on their bumper and then do a panic grab. Sh*t happens.

I’m not saying it’s a guaranteed barbecue if ya fold in your bumper but damn, why risk it by wiring straight to B+ (with or without a fuse). I said I think that’s nuts but in hindsight, I think it’s downright stupid.

What possible motivation could one have to skip using a main power relay or manual disconnect between their battery and winch?

 

[Zandcwhite]

I hear ya on the battery hold downs Zach.

As to metal around the winch, it can be accidental contact with slinging the hook, snatch block, rigging chain, rope, tools, etc. Hell, I’ve seen guys lay jack handles on their bumper and then do a panic grab. Sh*t happens.

I’m not saying it’s a guaranteed barbecue if ya fold in your bumper but damn, why risk it by wiring straight to B+ (with or without a fuse). I said I think that’s nuts but in hindsight, I think it’s downright stupid.

What possible motivation could one have to skip using a main power relay or manual disconnect between their battery and winch?

History, tradition, most manufacturers recommendations, the fact i want my winch to work until I melt down is windings if that's what it takes to get me out. Not to mention I install large battery arrays regularly, unfused. You'll have to show me how to short out anything with a rope, synthetic winch line, or soft shackles, as I would never use chain, steel cable, etc. Not sure about your winch, but my power leads are inside the control box. The exposed leads on the winch itself are only hot when winching in and out, and they are covered with rubber boots. As others have stated it's a solution to a problem that doesn't exist.

 

[azjl#3]

I can easily prove a cable shorted to ground will do damage. Heck, don’t trust my magic, you can test your wisdom yourself!

Take your anchor chain, block, steel rope, pry bar or wrench and jumper the lug to ground. Share the link on YouTube video to prove your genius.

Get on now, I’ll wait…..

none of those things anywhere near the winch connections, which are all housed inside engine bay, or inside housing of winch. Nothing can ground the winch hot wire, which, is dead until i turn it on.

You do you, enjoy. I'll do what millions of other dudes have been doing since the 60's, without shorting a winch out, using common sense.

 

[VKSheridan]

I respect your confidence but my Jeep doesn’t have a short-proof winch with lugs hidden behind crush proof boxes and cables that cannot be shorted in any possible way. Snagging things and rolling boulders just isn’t that that uncommon where I go.

Because of that, I sized and routed the cables as best I could. I put a power relay in the circuit to prevent uncommanded energization and I put in a ~$35 fuse to disrupt flow if bad things happen.

If my luck holds, the fuse will be as big of a waste as carrying extinguishers, a spare tire, ducks and insurance.

And if my luck fails me, I’ll replace the fuse. No clue why this concept discomforts some folks.

Stay safe out there….

 

[Whiskey 13]

Been using winches for will over 45 years, many with steel cables and today with rope. All of my winches have been direct wired. In all my years of using winches and my many friends also using theirs, I have never seen a single one short out at the connections. I have seen many batteries break loose and short out. My way of thinking is when you need a winch, you need it to run. Don't add anything into the system to enhance failure of the system.

 

[Zandcwhite]

I respect your confidence but my Jeep doesn’t have a short-proof winch with lugs hidden behind crush proof boxes and cables that cannot be shorted in any possible way. Snagging things and rolling boulders just isn’t that that uncommon where I go.

Because of that, I sized and routed the cables as best I could. I put a power relay in the circuit to prevent uncommanded energization and I put in a ~$35 fuse to disrupt flow if bad things happen.

If my luck holds, the fuse will be as big of a waste as carrying extinguishers, a spare tire, ducks and insurance.

And if my luck fails me, I’ll replace the fuse. No clue why this concept discomforts some folks.

Stay safe out there….

Rolling boulders through your radiator? You wheel your Jeep upside down regularly? If you're crushing the winch box I'd say you have far more to worry about than potentially shorting a feed cable? Nobody said you're paranoia or extra parts made them uncomfortable at all? You said wiring per the manufacturer was "nuts"? Weird that you insult others and then claim to be the victim? If 40 fuses in series and 17 switches make you more comfortable, go for it. But to claim that you're overkill method is the only right way is one hell of a stretch.

 

[VKSheridan]

Yes Zach, I think it’s smart to use battery isolation and a fuse for circuit protection.

I’ve said that for like 6 pages now. Holy sh*t, we’ve had a breakthrough!

Can we finally end this conversation or are you gonna necro it again?

 

[THAW]

I don't fuse my winch, though I fully understand the fusing-for-dead-short-protection argument.

In any case, at this point in the thread, it's worth repeating: 12V electrical best practice is to size a fuse to protect wiring (and size wiring based on device peak current draw).

Winch wiring, however, is typically sized to support only intermittent use (i.e. undersized), so fusing a winch to allow rated max winch amperage will not fully protect wiring during extended, continuous use. In general, winch pulls aren't long and sustained enough for that fact to cause a fire, but it's important to stay vigilant with regard to winch wiring heat buildup even when a fuse is present.

Apparently, some winch owners attempt to solve this fuse riddle by selecting a fuse rating based on intermittent winch use (instead of peak draw). Personally, I'm not convinced teetering on the edge of fuse blow time is sound fusing practice.

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