Why No Chains?

[flyer92]

I also looked up the code,

California Code, Vehicle Code - VEH § 11713.6
a) It is unlawful and a violation of this code for the holder of any dealer's license issued under this article to fail to disclose in writing to the buyer or lessee of a new motor vehicle, that the vehicle, as equipped, may not be operated on a highway signed for the requirement of tire chains if the owner's manual or other material provided by the manufacturer states that the vehicle, as equipped, may not be operated with tire chains.
(b) The disclosure required under subdivision (a) shall meet both of the following requirements:
(1) The disclosure shall be printed in not less than 14-point boldface type on a single sheet of paper that contains no information other than the disclosure.
(2) The disclosure shall include the following language in capital letters:  “AS EQUIPPED, THIS VEHICLE MAY NOT BE OPERATED WITH TIRE CHAINS BUT MAY ACCOMMODATE SOME OTHER TYPE OF TIRE TRACTION DEVICE. SEE THE OWNER'S MANUAL FOR DETAILS.”
(c) Prior to the sale or lease, the dealer shall present the disclosure statement for the buyer's or lessee's signature and then shall provide the buyer or lessee with a copy of the signed disclosure.

Its pretty clear that the vehicle may not be operated on signed roads that require chains, which does not negate the requirement for vehicles on that road. If you drive on a road requiring chains without them you would be in violation.

Also 100% moot unless the owners manual states your vehicle cant.

I know the code, and believe that you and I are in violent agreement here because it states that the vehicle "...may accommodate some other type of tire traction device." In practical terms, the law permits any traction device, but the road signs and officer who pulls me over dictate that I must use chains (or just have them, in certain circumstances). This is the contradiction to which I am referring, and again...is well beyond a legal debate in an online forum. In addition, the owner's manual doesn't prohibit the use of chains...it only recommends the use of Autosocks, so this isn't necessarily a moot point. In any case, I appreciate your perspective, but I was just asking what others have experienced in real-world situations.

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[alksion]

Anytime I see a decent storm on the radar here in SoCal I get my ass up to big bear and rent an Air BnB. This past January I drove up on a Sunday to 6-7 inches of snow. Typical winter day. Woke up to 18+ inches on top of the day prior.

CHP/CalTrans went R3 and required every vehicle to have traction devices. I bought these ones off Amazon and they worked just fine.

 

[J0E]

When you are stuck and winters and studs do nothing, then you go to proper chains. Have been doing that for 30 years on different 4x4s.

I'm an old fart (60) from Montana , been doing it for over 50 years. Skinny tires and good chains are amazing in deep snow. Litebrite gets it totally wrong when she airs down in deep snow, her and the rest of the internet. Studs rule on ice, chains in deep snow.

BTW, with studs, don't go over 85 MPH. Was ice racing in Montana on the interstate, as soon as I hit 105 MPH on pure ice, it sounded like a machine gun going off. Lost most of my studs.

 

[J0E]

if you need chains on a Jeep Wrangler you have the wrong tires.......just sayin

Guess you've never been in deep snow. Even with front/rear lockers, deep snow, especially with an ice base, require chains.

 

[HeidiHoForTheHills]

Hello,

Since I will be traveling to Canada mid-winter, I have been researching this topic.

1. In regard to regulations and performance. Please refer to:

https://dot.ca.gov/-/media/dot-media/documents/chainrequire-a11y.pdf

(please note it clearly states that chains have been redefined. "When the term 'chains' is used here, it means any 'tire traction device' which meets the requirements of (VC) Section 605.")

https://autosock.us/products/regulations/

2. California has excellent consumer protection laws (comparatively) hence why I believe they created the law with the disclosure.

3. Snow chains can damage your vehicle (happened to a friend) and can throw off the sensors. For the protection of your vehicle, it is best to fit it with the recommended devices.

I will be printing off and storing the data in my vehicle in case I am questioned about my autosocks.

Hope this data helps!

 

[NewsShooter]

Can't wait to leave this stupid state, but until then, I'm wondering what would happen if you drive on a road that requires chains, but are using Autosock as prescribed in the owner's manual. On one hand, CA DOT is requiring us to use chains....but on the other, they also made us sign disclosures stating that we can't. So which is it?

Should I ever find myself in that situation, I'll be sure to keep a copy of that no-chain disclosure in my glove box so I can hand it over to the officer after I get pulled over.

Nothing will happen, lots of vehicles still use chains, Cal Trans uses them on snow removal vehicles. Most people use cables these days.

 

[Murphydog]

Hello,

Since I will be traveling to Canada mid-winter, I have been researching this topic.

1. In regard to regulations and performance. Please refer to:

https://dot.ca.gov/-/media/dot-media/documents/chainrequire-a11y.pdf

(please note it clearly states that chains have been redefined. "When the term 'chains' is used here, it means any 'tire traction device' which meets the requirements of (VC) Section 605.")

https://autosock.us/products/regulations/

2. California has excellent consumer protection laws (comparatively) hence why I believe they created the law with the disclosure.

3. Snow chains can damage your vehicle (happened to a friend) and can throw off the sensors. For the protection of your vehicle, it is best to fit it with the recommended devices.

I will be printing off and storing the data in my vehicle in case I am questioned about my autosocks.

Hope this data helps!

Following up here, have you used the Autosocks? Curious to here your experience

 

[Murphydog]

Anytime I see a decent storm on the radar here in SoCal I get my ass up to big bear and rent an Air BnB. This past January I drove up on a Sunday to 6-7 inches of snow. Typical winter day. Woke up to 18+ inches on top of the day prior.

CHP/CalTrans went R3 and required every vehicle to have traction devices. I bought these ones off Amazon and they worked just fine.

Your Amazon link seems to be broken. Which ones are you using?

 

[alksion]

Your Amazon link seems to be broken. Which ones are you using?

Here’s the link: Security Chain Company SZ447 Super Z6 Cable Tire Chain for Passenger Cars, Pickups, and SUVs - Set of 2 https://www.amazon.com/dp/B000HZA2ME/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_apip_AZ6TUs1PCuG5R

 

[J0E]

For the ultimate, get a good set of RUD chains.

 

[bjm00se]

... The user's manual doesn't restrict the use of chains ...

I direct you to page 418 of the 2021 JL user manual, that talks about "snow traction devices"

SAE "S Class" is a classification for measuring clearance of tire chains (and other "snow traction devices.") At the "S Class" level, there's enough room that some actual literal tire chains meet this clearance classification. As you see in column 3, it is recommended for use only on Sport with the 245/75R17 Tire. For all other configurations and tire sizes, the Owners Manual is recommending against tire chains, and instead the use of "Autosock."

"Autosock" meets the California requirement for "tire chains" when installed whenever chains are required.

Based on these facts, you were given a disclosure telling not to use actual literal tire chains, and instead use the "snow traction devices" recommended in the owners manual.

Despite all the other nonsense in this thread, there's nothing in CA vehicle code preventing the use of actual literal tire chains, and I saw more of them than I can count on the road just this evening. All of which had to drive through a Caltrans inspection checkpoint.

 

[Jeepsmashin]

So what Cables are you guys running? I'm looking for some for my JLUR with 315/70/17 MT'S

 

[Blanco Willys]

I use these.

 

[Jeepsmashin]

I use these.

Oh okay I found them for $80 on Amazon but they only fit up to a 285 tire. Mines 315/70/17 MT's

 

[NewsShooter]

If I need chains on a 4wd jeep with decent snow tires then it's really icy and I'd rather have studded tires. While you're supposed to have them I've never needed to put on chains when driving a 4wd vehicle on snow covered roads. Hell when I was in my teens I'd put the truck in 2wd and go drive the unplowed roads for fun.

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