Thoughts about winches

[Zandcwhite]

The winch option on the new JL/JT has a fuseable link from the factory. I've seen a little 18 gauge wire completely burn the insulation off and melt carpet in the trunk of a car on 2 seconds. Most vehicle fires are electrical. I'm putting a fuse on mine since the winch is in the front where impact from a wreck is most likely. If the fuse blows while I'm winching, I have a $4 spare. If that blows, then I'll bypass it while winching then disconnect it before driving home. Do what you are comfortable with, but in my case, a $30 fuse block and fuse is cheaper than my insurance deductible.

An 18 gauge wire will melt the installation at well under 100A. Good thing I didn't wire my winch in 18 gauge. Also, my engine Bay isn't carpet lined so we should be good there. Pretty sure the turbo and exhaust manifolds get hot enough to ignite carpet every time I drive. A front impact severe enough to damage my winch cables would push the winch/bumper through the radiator and bend the hell out of the frame, pretty sure that's more damage than my deductible. The 2 Guage wires would likely discharge the battery bellow their limit long before they'd catch fire. The battery is only capable of ~700A when fully charged and falls off quickly under heavy load. Run a fuse if you'd like, but again I'm pretty sure warn would suggest it if it was a major concern? Who knows, maybe you have more winch knowledge, experience, and expertise than they do...

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[steelerpsugirl]

Pull the line all the way out free-spooling. When winding-in a winch line, you need a couple hundred pounds resistance to keep the line from tucking under itself during a partial winch-in. Might be the case here. Find a gentle slope, tie off and winch the Jeep up the hill to get a tight wrap.

I’m switching this line to a synthetic (just wanted for my hawse fairlead to be delivered) so the idea was I unspool and take it off. That has proven to be a BEAR. There’s definitely something up with the spool out part. But I’m willing to try anything. Was hoping to get it unspooled all the way and just replace it but it was like being on a strongest man competition! Thanks for all the tips!

 

[Wixo]

The lightest bumper you can find that you can afford. Most expensive winch you can afford that has synthetic line. You can’t underestimate how important both are. Had an accident nothing happened to my rig but it caused 7000$ damage to the other car. Not taking my rig to the body shop was priceless to me. I don’t have a fuse on my winch and have never had any issues.

 

[Zandcwhite]

I’m switching this line to a synthetic (just wanted for my hawse fairlead to be delivered) so the idea was I unspool and take it off. That has proven to be a BEAR. There’s definitely something up with the spool out part. But I’m willing to try anything. Was hoping to get it unspooled all the way and just replace it but it was like being on a strongest man competition! Thanks for all the tips!

Hook the winch up to a stationary object and back up with it in freespool. No sense in killing yourself trying to pull a stuck line by hand.

 

[Mr Lee]

When I was young I worked off and on for a tow company. When doing bad recovery we always used snatch blocks. When pulling heavy equipment or 3 ton and up long wheel base trucks you needed multiple attachment points. Not for your regular side of the road but over the bank roll overs.
I have synthetic winch line, don't know if I would go with it again, it would depend on the price.
I keep my line covered from the UV rays, has anyone here had to replace a syn line from sunlight damage?

 

[HungryHound]

An 18 gauge wire will melt the installation at well under 100A. Good thing I didn't wire my winch in 18 gauge. Also, my engine Bay isn't carpet lined so we should be good there. Pretty sure the turbo and exhaust manifolds get hot enough to ignite carpet every time I drive. A front impact severe enough to damage my winch cables would push the winch/bumper through the radiator and bend the hell out of the frame, pretty sure that's more damage than my deductible. The 2 Guage wires would likely discharge the battery bellow their limit long before they'd catch fire. The battery is only capable of ~700A when fully charged and falls off quickly under heavy load. Run a fuse if you'd like, but again I'm pretty sure warn would suggest it if it was a major concern? Who knows, maybe you have more winch knowledge, experience, and expertise than they do...

I suggest carrying marshmallows or hotdogs around in your Jeep so that battery fire doesn't go to waste.

 

[steelerpsugirl]

Hook the winch up to a stationary object and back up with it in freespool. No sense in killing yourself trying to pull a stuck line by hand.

Ahhh that’s wise

 

[brewski]

The winch option on the new JL/JT has a fuseable link from the factory. I've seen a little 18 gauge wire completely burn the insulation off and melt carpet in the trunk of a car on 2 seconds. Most vehicle fires are electrical. I'm putting a fuse on mine since the winch is in the front where impact from a wreck is most likely. If the fuse blows while I'm winching, I have a $4 spare. If that blows, then I'll bypass it while winching then disconnect it before driving home. Do what you are comfortable with, but in my case, a $30 fuse block and fuse is cheaper than my insurance deductible.

With all that hassle why not just do a kill switch. A fused winch line is asinine to me and it is something you shouldn’t do. I’ve seen some people who are worried about it throw an engine kill switch on the positive line, you can get those pretty cheap from places like Summit Racing. The people who know about winching just hook it up straight to the battery. Winch companies recommend just hooking up the winch straight to the battery... hmm do you think they might know a thing or 2 about winches...

 

[HungryHound]

With all that hassle why not just do a kill switch. A fused winch line is asinine to me and it is something you shouldn’t do. I’ve seen some people who are worried about it throw an engine kill switch on the positive line, you can get those pretty cheap from places like Summit Racing. The people who know about winching just hook it up straight to the battery. Winch companies recommend just hooking up the winch straight to the battery... hmm do you think they might know a thing or 2 about winches...

Maybe, but I know a lot about electricity. Sure, if you trust yourself to remember the cut-off switch, that is an option. Keep this in mind: during a severe wreck, the JL will kill the ignition to GREATLY reduce the risk of fire. A #1 or #2 wire running directly to the battery is an enormous fire risk. Again, a fuse and a switch will be the same price so why not opt for automatic protection? It will not nuisance trip if sized properly and if you overwork the winch so that it does blow, you have the option of moving the wire to the battery to get unstuck.

The problem with forums is that incorrect and unsafe information is seldom removed. Just like the fool who recommended the 32/36 Weber for the 258 engine when it turns out the 38/38 is less expensive but better. Or the whole nutter bypass mess when an HEI is far superior. I fell for this mis-information. It's irresponsible to tell folks no fuse is fine. If you truly believe this, then unhook the ground wire going into your house. What's the chance you'll get electrocuted? How about telling folks to not wear their seatbelts off-road because they're driving so slow? Again, bad advice that someone might unwittingly follow.

 

[HungryHound]

Hook the winch up to a stationary object and back up with it in freespool. No sense in killing yourself trying to pull a stuck line by hand.

I was going to suggest that too. Maybe find a parked police car to hook to. They're pretty stout.

 

[Zandcwhite]

Maybe, but I know a lot about electricity. Sure, if you trust yourself to remember the cut-off switch, that is an option. Keep this in mind: during a severe wreck, the JL will kill the ignition to GREATLY reduce the risk of fire. A #1 or #2 wire running directly to the battery is an enormous fire risk. Again, a fuse and a switch will be the same price so why not opt for automatic protection? It will not nuisance trip if sized properly and if you overwork the winch so that it does blow, you have the option of moving the wire to the battery to get unstuck.

The problem with forums is that incorrect and unsafe information is seldom removed. Just like the fool who recommended the 32/36 Weber for the 258 engine when it turns out the 38/38 is less expensive but better. Or the whole nutter bypass mess when an HEI is far superior. I fell for this mis-information. It's irresponsible to tell folks no fuse is fine. If you truly believe this, then unhook the ground wire going into your house. What's the chance you'll get electrocuted? How about telling folks to not wear their seatbelts off-road because they're driving so slow? Again, bad advice that someone might unwittingly follow.

We are glad that you are so confident in your opinion that it is now fact. What’s even better is that anyone who disagrees with you is a fool, including the entire winch industry. I’m sure you are lots of fun at parties. At least your name rhymes with the attitude you display.

 

[HungryHound]

We are glad that you are so confident in your opinion that it is now fact. What’s even better is that anyone who disagrees with you is a fool, including the entire winch industry. I’m sure you are lots of fun at parties. At least your name rhymes with the attitude you display.

I'm not trying to be right. I am right. You're arguing from an uneducated position from all I know. You say some Tier 2 supplier is correct just because they sold a lot of winches while ignoring the fact that an OEM manufacturer IS using protection on their winch wiring. You seem to be arguing from a redneck "that's the way we always done it" standpoint. And yes, I am fun at parties. Just ask your mom.

 

[Zandcwhite]

I'm not trying to be right. I am right. You're arguing from an uneducated position from all I know. You say some Tier 2 supplier is correct just because they sold a lot of winches while ignoring the fact that an OEM manufacturer IS using protection on their winch wiring. You seem to be arguing from a redneck "that's the way we always done it" standpoint. And yes, I am fun at parties. Just ask your mom.

Power wagons aren’t OEM? Vehicle manufacturers don’t make winches, calling the actual developers and manufacturers of winches foolish, uneducated, ignorant, and wrong is foolish at best. A 12v lead acid battery doesn’t have the available fault current to melt 2 gauge wire which is why you can weld with a set of jumper cables and a battery. Resistance causes heat, a short run of large wire doesn’t get hot enough to melt at the max fault current of our batteries. Just my uneducated opinion based off everything from manufacturers recommended installations, to what ram has been doing for decades, to 20+ years as a commercial electrician (large scale ups systems don’t have fusible links either, and they often operate at 40 times the voltage and 3-5 times the available fault current as our single 12v batteries), to several years of electrical systems design, but what do I know?

 

[HungryHound]

Power wagons aren’t OEM? Vehicle manufacturers don’t make winches, calling the actual developers and manufacturers of winches foolish, uneducated, ignorant, and wrong is foolish at best. A 12v lead acid battery doesn’t have the available fault current to melt 2 gauge wire which is why you can weld with a set of jumper cables and a battery. Resistance causes heat, a short run of large wire doesn’t get hot enough to melt at the max fault current of our batteries. Just my uneducated opinion based off everything from manufacturers recommended installations, to what ram has been doing for decades, to 20+ years as a commercial electrician (large scale ups systems don’t have fusible links either, and they often operate at 40 times the voltage and 3-5 times the available fault current as our single 12v batteries), to several years of electrical systems design, but what do I know?

Last I checked an industrial electrical engineer trumps a commercial electrician. The UPS that I've installed had a crowbar circuit to trip out and automatically reset. I take pride in the fact that I never injured or killed a person and actually saved my company millions in lost production time and list product by completely revamping the electrical systems in multiple facilities. One example: the commercial electricians that built the plant put 3,000 amp fuses on an incoming 3,000 amp service. Only problem was the downstream busway was only rated at 1,500 amps. As a result, the company spent hundred of thousands of $$ replacing blown bus sections whenever there was a minor fault. Hey, I'm a relaxed, fun-loving guy when it comes to Jeepin', but I'm very conscious of safety and life protection. Maybe we need to go wheeling sometime and discuss this over a few beers afterwards instead of having a pissing match on this forum.

 

[Zandcwhite]

Last I checked an industrial electrical engineer trumps a commercial electrician. The UPS that I've installed had a crowbar circuit to trip out and automatically reset. I take pride in the fact that I never injured or killed a person and actually saved my company millions in lost production time and list product by completely revamping the electrical systems in multiple facilities. One example: the commercial electricians that built the plant put 3,000 amp fuses on an incoming 3,000 amp service. Only problem was the downstream busway was only rated at 1,500 amps. As a result, the company spent hundred of thousands of $$ replacing blown bus sections whenever there was a minor fault. Hey, I'm a relaxed, fun-loving guy when it comes to Jeepin', but I'm very conscious of safety and life protection. Maybe we need to go wheeling sometime and discuss this over a few beers afterwards instead of having a pissing match on this forum.

That explains it, the engineers always know everything. Real world experience, an entire industry, every winch manufacturer ever, none of them could possibly know better than what your books on theory have told you. As I stated from the beginning, run a fuse if you want, but don't pretend that's the only way. The ocp on most ups systems is in the inverter, leaving the leads from the batteries 100% unprotected in my experience. It was never a pissing match on my end, I never claimed mine was the only way or that I knew better than anyone else. You do it your way, I'll do it mine. Both will work.

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