"It's a Jeep thing" Tolerance

[Todkavonic]

Kinda proving my point again, bro.

What I was doing was giving real, first hand experience with our 2010 model. That's not trolling, nor am I on a Honda board telling them their cars suck. How many Jeeps have you owned again?

http://www.hondaproblems.com/trends/excessive-oil-consumption/

Cites a class action lawsuit claiming 1.6M Hondas burned oil excessively.

That, that right there, is one of those drops-the-mic moments.

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[bmac]

And since this has turned into a freak out on stats- CRV is being recalled for having gas mixing in the oil and causing fires.

https://www.autoblog.com/2018/10/05/2017-2018-honda-cr-v-engine-problem/

Where does it say it is causing fires?

I have been following this issue for some time and have yet to read reports of fires.

 

[JLClt]

Pfft, burning oil compared to JL multiple problems is nothing. And I'm sure Honda fixed it.
Shoot most VAGs are burning oil and it's a known quirk no one even complains anymore.
We're talking about uncontrollable behavior that's dangerous for drivers not burning oil.

Instead of consumers uniting and demanding higher quality we're divided with name calling and defensive posts.

I stopped by my Jeep dealer yesterday on the way to dinner and told my Sales Manager I'm switching to a lease. While I was there I looked at Sahara on the sales floor and wanted to see how the rear seats fold forward, just out of curiosity my wife had a question. So guess what, the salesman and I could not unlatch the rear seats to fold them. They were stuck. He tried everything, no go. He was so embarrassed and I just said I gotta go shaking my head. WTF is that , they can't even make seat release latches right? Jesus

 

[Lar]

Don't assume the dealer/ salesman actually know anything about what they are trying to sell... I suspect most of the folks frequenting these sites are much more knowledgeable than most of the sales people at the dealer about the product.
My sales person delivered my $55K Jeep and tried to explain the bags for the removable tops was for stowing items from the super market so they wouldn't roll around the back of the Jeep? The parts manager tried to convince me the all weather floor mats were supposed to have a large hole in them going to the carpet below?? And when I tried to explain it was not correct and show him what i had read on sites such as these he scoffed at me saying "sure and everything you read on the inter-net is true."

Yes the bottom line is the current JL is going through some issues at present but when you consider the amount of vehicles produced it really is a small number. More important is if the manufacture stands behind it and makes it right.
If your having cold feet cancel your order and make yourself happy and get another vehicle.

 

[Sean K.]

Pfft, burning oil compared to JL multiple problems is nothing.

Unless you're one of those people to whom $29K is not a lot of money...then, having an engine that will detonate prematurely, long before the useful planned lifespan of the supposedly "reliable" vehicle is up, IS a big deal.

Guess it just depends on one's perspective.

***EDIT*** Oh BTW, Accords from those years also had 11 safety recalls....that included STEERING FAILURES from an improperly torqued spindle; an electrical problem that could cause the engine to stall, resulting in a crash; the infamous Takata airbag problem (potentially killing occupants); tranny issues where broken pieces can get logged in the selector thereby allowing the vehicle to roll in park; etc. https://www.nhtsa.gov/vehicle/2010/HONDA/ACCORD/4%2520DR/FWD#recalls

That doesn't include the non-safety recall/TSBs for that gen Accord eating rear brakes in 25K miles, for example.

 

[RussJeep1]

To start you have to remember that Jeeps are designed to do way more then cars and even trucks. They are designed to be more rigorous in the trenches. With these designs come issues. Just take a BMW rock climbing and see how long it will last. The big problem comes years back when they tried to make them so much more comfortable to draw a different crowd of users! When you try to combine ruggedness with today’s comfort you tend to end up with issues. Some good and some bad!

And for the poster calling the op out for how he wrote the original post, maybe you read it wrong! The bad thing about posting and social media is one persons post may not read as it was written! They hear one thing you hear another. Much like different languages can have different meanings. You should try not to be so critical at everything that is posted. Maybe giving the poster the benefit of the doubt would lead to better conversations. Just saying.

I like what James had to say here, I just want it to be seen in a slightly different light. Considering the things a Wrangler can do that other makes and models can't, perhaps those that own such models are tolerating some things as well: if you care to see things through that viewing glass. From the enormous amount of items the aftermarket builds for the vehicle, to where, as James mentioned you can take it, a balanced review requires an examination of not only the rig's limitations but features.

@JLClt I don't think you were trolling because such actions go to a mindset where statements are made to deliberately frustrate others, while your intent seemed to be information gathering. That doesn't mean that I don't get why others took it that way. You made some assumptions about poor quality it seems based upon this bboard's comments, without (or so it seemed) considering that quality is a relative scale in the auto making business.

Also well stated above, bboards, no fault of their own (I've learned so much here) are not random sample polling. Complainers, brand loyalists and info gatherers are its 3 main constituents. And I don't mean to suggest complainers have no basis for their gripes. Just that when you combine a place (here) where complainers and loyalist reside, opportunities for conflict can easily arise.

I'm biased. I love my Wrangler JL, and have had little problems. But that said, most vehicles are not ones you ride in for the journey and destination, just the latter. The Wrangler satisfies both things in a large percentage of its owners, and nevertheless it isn't the right vehicle for many decent people.

 

[Shooting or Jeeping]

Pfft, burning oil compared to JL multiple problems is nothing. And I'm sure Honda fixed it.
Shoot most VAGs are burning oil and it's a known quirk no one even complains anymore.
We're talking about uncontrollable behavior that's dangerous for drivers not burning oil.

Instead of consumers uniting and demanding higher quality we're divided with name calling and defensive posts.

I stopped by my Jeep dealer yesterday on the way to dinner and told my Sales Manager I'm switching to a lease. While I was there I looked at Sahara on the sales floor and wanted to see how the rear seats fold forward, just out of curiosity my wife had a question. So guess what, the salesman and I could not unlatch the rear seats to fold them. They were stuck. He tried everything, no go. He was so embarrassed and I just said I gotta go shaking my head. WTF is that , they can't even make seat release latches right? Jesus

So don’t buy it? I guess I’m not getting your rant here. You’ve basically ripped apart any logic and state that we should all unite and rage against the beast that is Jeep Wrangler JL. Sorry, man. I like mine. I’m not at all locked into one car for life. I can and have bought plenty others over my 25 years of driving. My mantra is that if it has more than one part- it has a chance to fail. I weigh that against my needs and, well, here we are.

You seem to be completely against the JL and want the car fairy to bless this vehicle with zero issues for life so that you can feel good about it. A vehicle who often sees the side of a mountain or topless on a beach. A vehicle that has ties back 75+ years.

My advice- learn to turn a wrench and have some fun with your issues. I don’t assume everyone will fix my problems for me. I self learned auto repair and modification because it gave me a sense of pride. Maybe that’s your missing link? If you want a perfect vehicle to remain perfectly stock for life- this isn’t the vehicle for you.

 

[bmac]

I like what James had to say here, I just want it to be seen in a slightly different light. Considering the things a Wrangler can do that other makes and models can't, perhaps those that own such models are tolerating some things as well: if you care to see things through that viewing glass.

That would make sense if the problems occurred after taking the Wrangler out wheeling. The reality is that the vast majority of these problems exist when new. Quality control is the issue and not the rugged design.

I get that people love their Jeeps but I tend to agree with the OP that folks tend to give FCA a pass for some real lack of quality control. Other brands and models have issues as well but it sure seems that FCA has more than their fair share. If Jeep owners were a bit less forgiving it may push them to improve quality.

The Jeep Wrangler has no competition. This has allowed FCA to aggressively raise prices and let owners deal with the final quality control check.

I hope the upcoming Ford Bronco is a winner. Jeep could use some real competition to push them a bit.

 

[Biscuit]

So guess what, the salesman and I could not unlatch the rear seats to fold them.

So guess what? That just proves that you and the salesman are equally incompetent.

Now, please put your trolling fat ass in your Beemer and make like you're a tree.

 

[RussJeep1]

That would make sense if the problems occurred after taking the Wrangler out wheeling. The reality is that the vast majority of these problems exist when new. Quality control is the issue and not the rugged design.

I get that people love their Jeeps but I tend to agree with the OP that folks tend to give FCA a pass for some real lack of quality control. Other brands and models have issues as well but it sure seems that FCA has more than their fair share. If Jeep owners were a bit less forgiving it may push them to improve quality.

The Jeep Wrangler has no competition. This has allowed FCA to aggressively raise prices and let owners deal with the final quality control check.

I hope the upcoming Ford Bronco is a winner. Jeep could use some real competition to push them a bit.

You make fair points: some I agree with, some not as much.

Said tongue and cheek in response to your (I paraphrase) 'it would be one thing if these problems occurred on the trail after ownership,' point, that's fair, but for most other vehicles there would be no issue that these problems would occur if you took them out on the trail...if you catch my drift that the Wrangler has issues and features.

I agree with you, some Wrangler owners might look the other way on issues its maker is responsible for that wouldn't be tolerated in other models. Is it because the Wrangler is in a market of its own, is it because we Wrangler bunch have always been the "tolerate a little, fix a little yourself" type of owners, albeit the latter becoming harder with more sophisticated designs? Is it because we love the rig and are biased? Perhaps to all of these factors.

I personally think that the quality control, while it can and should be improved, shouldn't by any means be FCA's goal alone, apart from other automakers as well.

I agree with you that competition would be a great thing. Quality would have to rise while prices go down. But even an enormously successful competitor to the Wrangler won't have its after market overnight.

If I've learned one thing being here on the bboard it's that this is as an enormously good place to learn and share, but it is not, never will be, and shouldn't be expected to become a representative sample of the degree of the rig's problems out there--quite overstated IMHO--because that's one of its 3 core groups, nor a place where no pro Wrangler bias exists because it does, also one of its 3 core groups, nor a place where the same question is asked only once, because learners (all of us to one degree or another) are its last core group.

 

[JLClt]

I'm still getting one. I'm not trying to talk myself or others out getting one.
It's Bimmer not Beemer by the way

I love how JL Wrangler looks and drives. The initial attraction was actually the fact that it's one of the last few fun vehicles that's available with manual transmission. And I'm willing to put up with some minor annoyances as long as it's something like a dribbling rear window washer or back up camera malfunctioning once in a while.
I just hope I won't experience any of the major malfunctions that I've read about on this forum

 

[BlackRook]

I'm still getting one. I'm not trying to talk myself or others out getting one.
It's Bimmer not Beemer by the way

I love how JL Wrangler looks and drives. The initial attraction was actually the fact that it's one of the last few fun vehicles that's available with manual transmission. And I'm willing to put up with some minor annoyances as long as it's something like a dribbling rear window washer or back up camera malfunctioning once in a while.
I just hope I won't experience any of the major malfunctions that I've read about on this forum

Leasing is a great solution to your concerns, good idea on your part. At the end of the lease, you can decide to move away from Jeep altogether, buy a new one (after a there's been a few years to work out issues), or buy your lease if you fall in love.

That said, you gotta see the other side of the name calling argument. I'm with @RussJeep1, I know you're not a troll. But your user name could easily be misinterpreted as "JL Cult," and the tone of your responsive with knee-jerk love of foreign makers makes you seem like you're here to pick a fight.

 

[JLClt]

Leasing is a great solution to your concerns, good idea on your part. At the end of the lease, you can decide to move away from Jeep altogether, buy a new one (after a there's been a few years to work out issues), or buy your lease if you fall in love.

That said, you gotta see the other side of the name calling argument. I'm with @RussJeep1, I know you're not a troll. But your user name could easily be misinterpreted as "JL Cult," and the tone of your responsive with knee-jerk love of foreign makers makes you seem like you're here to pick a fight.

Thanks for your kind words.
I do prefer imports overall I won't lie. However I've always admired Wranglers from the far, even Willis in WW2 movies.
JLClt is JL Charlotte where I live

 

[Majestic]

“It’s a Jeep thing” should only apply to the fact it’s gonna be louder, a little rougher, not so great gas mileage, and other inevitable consequences to the Jeep’s unique design. It does not mean you should give it pass for just poor build quality. It’s not supposed to leak, and have jacked up welds and steering.
It’s a first year model after a big redesign, so by nature the first year buyers are gonna beta test it for Jeep.

 

[Ac91]

Im just gonna laugh at this post i have a 2018 Tundra and everyone associates Toyota with reliability and quality vehicles well im here to tell you my tundra with 5-600 miles on it had to have the top end of the motor opened up for the infamous cam tower leak. No first year vehicle has been trouble free this is nothing new my 2018 JL so far has been trouble free with 4k miles

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