Heel/Toe Solutions?

CriticalMass

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We can have a discussion ALL day about *want* and *need*.

Nowhere in my explanation did I ever say I *NEED* to heel/toe. The whole thing was to justify why I do it and why I think it's a good idea. I WANT to have control of my vehicle. I WANT to be consistent in my shifting techniques. I WANT to continue practicing my skillz. I've developed muscle memory on the road so I can be better on the track, and on the track so I can be better on the road. So I WANT to modify my controls to facilitate all these things. I have a clutch pedal and a shift knob. It *may* be less advantageous to do this in a Jeep, but why should I stop doing it just because it's not necessary? Like I said, it's become a habit, I'm attuned to it, I'm more comfortable doing it than not, etc.

I understand how you may think that heel/toe causes more wear on the clutch/tranny. This argument goes both ways because if not done correctly, yes, more damage and more wear. But if it is done correctly then there's no real issue. I'm good enough at this where I believe it will cause less wear when I rev-match downshift as opposed to shifting and feathering the clutch out to get into gear.

And you don't get to tell anyone what kind of emergencies can and can't happen, because you don't know that, I don't know that, the next guy doesn't know that. Again, the point is to be in a position so that YOU ARE PREPARED for whatever the hell might happen. You may not have control over what external factors happen to you, but you have every bit of control over how prepared you are and how you can respond to it.

And to your other jibber jabber, didn't bother reading it all through because now you're just being an asshole.

My question to you is, who pissed in your cheerios this morning?
Sorry, bro. I didn't mean to get your panties in a wad. My sincerest apologies. I guess I am carrying over some hostility from dealing with my family. Around my house, I am called the Dream Destroyer because every time I hear some stupid childish fantasy I have to destroy that dream with some harsh reality. Like when one of my daughters asked if she could have a unicorn for her birthday and I'm all like: unicorns aren't real, sweetie. Or when my other daughter asked if she could be a doctor when she grew up and I was like: no, sweetie, you are a girl and girls can't be doctors; now go make me a chicken pot pie. Stuff like that. So when I heard your childish fantasy, I kinda got triggered and lashed out and for that I am sorry.

Let me explain the trigger. In your earlier post you mentioned racing. Now, I don't know you but I am assuming you meant Miata racing because I am getting a really heavy Miata vibe off you. Now imagine if I went to one of your Miata racing forums (which you are probably a moderator for) and bragged about how I have some mad skillz with rock crawling that I learned driving a Jeep and I was wondering what wheels and tires I could slap on my super sexy Miata to facilitate some extreme rock climbing as I don't want my superior-than-everybody-in the-world's rock climbing skillz to get rusty. I would imagine you, or one of your "racing" friends, might take issue with my naivete and attempt to school me in a more practical and time tested way to drive my chosen "racecar" in more of a racecar fashion. You might tell me how the Miata isn't built for that type of driving and how it might be dangerous to try to do something it isn't really built to do. Right tool for the right job or some such pearl of wisdom. Do you understand now? Good. Accept my apology and move on, sweetie. We don't hold grudges here.

Now, on to your current post. We have already established you aren't going to heel/toe into a corner because, like my daughter's pet unicorn, that is an idiotic and childish fantasy. Probably the last thing you want to do in a top heavy brick is to power on while exiting a corner but I guess dreamers gonna dream. So we are left with your second and more cringe-worthy Fast and Furious fantasy: preparing yourself to avoid being rear ended when you are coming to a stop by out accelerating the person about to hit you then defying physics by stopping before you rear end the person in front of you. Is that the scenario you fantasize about while sitting at Waffle House NOT WITH YOUR BACK TO THE FRONT DOOR because you want to be ready for every situation that might pop off but completely forgetting that scene in the Godfather where Michael came out of the bathroom with a gun and snuck in behind the guy? What is far more likely to happen as you ham-handedly prepare yourself by staying in power and torque as you come to a stop is you will overcorrect due to hysterical paranoia and crash into the people around you. If you really want to drive safely and avoid accidents by being prepared, maybe you can try driving like an adult??

Hey, if you want to slap a Hoonigan sticker on your Jeep and pretend heel/toe shifting is something that requires skill, be my guest. Just don't justify that decision with platitudes. Own that shit, bro. Say: "I want to heel/toe at every stoplight because I think it is fun; I don't care that it makes me look like a dbag and serves no practical purpose" instead of compounding your shame by throwing around some pathetic, nonsensical excuses as to why you think it is necessary. Maybe people will respect you for your honesty.

Anyway. To answer your question. Someone did piss in my cheerios this morning. Don't worry, it wasn't you. It was some guy in a John Deere forum asking where he could get some pedal extenders so he can heel/toe his row crop tractor.
 
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LeoTheDragon

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350Z and 370Z actually. Full disclosure I read about two sentences you wrote and the word Miata popped up a few times as I scrolled past your wall of text and just thought I'd clarify for you. Miatas are fun little cars though, not enough oomph for me. S2000 are much better, it's got that VTEC yo!

Don't have time nor care to read anything else you vomited out so have a good one. I hope you find Jesus or someone to help you out with your issues.
 
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LeoTheDragon

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Also, no, lol I do not mean double clutching. Heel toe has nothing to do with double clutching. Heel toe is using your toe to hold the break as you swing your heel to blip the throttle so you can match the revs and downshift without upsetting the balance of the vehicle and to always remain in gear, both of which has benefits when done correctly.

Apparently many people here attribute this to ricer boiz who are trying show off mad shifting skillz. To me it's an advanced method to maintain more control of your vehicle regardless of where you're driving it. No real point in arguing this point anymore, at least not on my part. I've got my hands and mouth full.






Of steak.
20181212_204228.jpg






And then after I'm going to hop in my Jeep and do some heel toeing. Cuz 'merica!
 

LoganDzwon

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The funny thing I didn’t even realized it did it; but this thread had me thinking about it so I noticed when I did. I actually subconsciously heal-tow and double clutch on down shifts. I did it twice in the 1.5 mile trip from work home today. It was all very automatic, but basically went;

(1) Left foot on clutch partially depressing clutch while Right foot comes off pedal while lightly pressing shifter toward nutural.
* the shifter starts slipping out of gear the moment the engine torque speed matched the momentum
(2) the second the shifter started slipping left off-clutch compeltely. right foot on brake, side/heel taps the throttle to rev the engine
(3) as soon as the engine hits the right rev, right foot depresses clutch fully shifter pushed into lower gear
(4) left foot fully off clutch in sync with heel fully off throttle

The transmission never stops rotating, the clutch is activated only when the revs match the speed the vechile is going, so there is no wheel hop.

I do rev match my upshifts, but it’s more like;
(1) left foot covers clutch, right lets off throttle
(2) left depress clutch while I shift strait to next gear
(3) left foot comes off clutch while right foot depressed throttle.

The synchros handle matching he tranny to the drive shaft.



Also, funny enough, I actually learned my shifting in a NB MX5. (Aka a Miata.) Lightweight with an unforgiving short wheel base, rwd with just the right enough of power be fast, but only if you shift just right to both keep it in the engine in the power band, not let the tranny fall out of sync, and keep it smooth enough to not upsetting the drive train into a slide killing all of your momentum.
 

Chocolate Thunder

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I feel a sense of unwarranted pride in how right I was about the reaction to the original poster’s query about aftermarket parts and modifications to better accommodate heel toe shifting a Jeep Wrangler. And of course Critical Mass’s magnum opus is one of the greatest feats of literature of our times. I’m thrilled to have been here to experience this.

I clicked this thread with a heart full of eager anticipation thinking of the potential of where it would - and should - inevitably lead. It does not disappoint. This is why the internet exists gentlemen.
 

Guy N Cognito

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Speaking as someone who has put in a lot of track time:

Lol.
 

Shenanigans

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Manual transmission, seriously dude, it’s almost 2019.......


Joking aside, I used all three pedals quite frequently in my trail rigs. When you need to come to a stop or adjust your line at a severe incline, you’re gonna need all three.

As far as heel toe on the streets, like for everyday driving, I’ll keep my 14 years of road racing experience to myself.
 

Firemadz

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Hahaha, problem solver. But then I'd be trading all the exercise I get in my left leg and more importantly my happiness. :(
Just swap your seat for an exercise ball and get a core workout while you drive.
 

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