Ethanol Test Kit--Results!

[SouthCo]

Dan, definitely an interesting thread. Thanks for the info...

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[DanW]

Soooo explain like I'm 5:
Ethanol-free = (possibly) better MPG and overall performance but more $ ?

Higher octane = more $ and better MPG but not ethanol free?

Or am I completely missing the mark here

That's pretty much it, but high octane premium isn't usually more expensive than ethanol free. Around me, ethanol free is usually 91 octane, so you get both benefits, but without necessarily the extra dose of detergents.

Confused yet? Lol

 

[NewJLU2019]

Soooo explain like I'm 5:
Ethanol-free = (possibly) better MPG and overall performance but more $ ?

Higher octane = more $ and better MPG but not ethanol free?

Or am I completely missing the mark here

This Thread was yesterdays topic for me. Higbyz has not reset his MPG since he bought his jeep. He uses Non-Ethanol Gas there and lives in a rural area and has gotten 29 MPG. Some others chimed in that's couldn't be right. I was looking for Ethanol-free gas down here in Texas. Read a thread that Shell V-Power here is ethanol-free at 93 Octane. I only paid 10 cents more per Gallon than Kroger 93 Octane that is 10% Ethanol. I just want to see what happens MPG here.

 

[blnewt]

I've gotten as high as 29 mpg w/ my stock 245/75 AS tires on 87 Ethanol gas, in fact on our long drive home after picking up our JL in Vegas we got just about that much on avg going 70-75 on the hwy. With our other set of larger Patagonias & heavier wheels we're in the 24-25 range, but still damn good for the performance & fun factor the JL provides.

Nice to know these motors handle Ethanol without too much penalty, and if Dans' findings are more common than not, maybe Ethanol content is indeed significantly less than 10% in many fuels currently.

 

[DanW]

Good topic. This was a thread yesterday. Please check out Shell V-Power. I filled up yesterday cause I read that V-Power might not have Ethanol in it. I couldn't confirm that at that pump. This was after a 16-mile trip to work this AM. Halfway city and halfway 75 MPH Freeway.

I'll put V-Power on the list to test when I get a chance. I'm curious about it, too.

 

[higbyz]

Soooo explain like I'm 5:
Ethanol-free = (possibly) better MPG and overall performance but more $ ?

Higher octane = more $ and better MPG but not ethanol free?

Or am I completely missing the mark here

My experience is you need high octane ,ethanol free to max out on power and mpg"s. $ 3.09 a gallon here.Thats cheap in this part of the country and ,for me, well worth it. I love the way all my vehicles run on this stuff! I find that 91 0ctane ethanol free gets better mileage than 93 0ctane with ethanol, and its 10 cents cheaper. I just love a good deal ! Thanks for your research Dan.

 

[higbyz]

I've gotten as high as 29 mpg w/ my stock 245/75 AS tires on 87 Ethanol gas, in fact on our long drive home after picking up our JL in Vegas we got just about that much on avg going 70-75 on the hwy. With our other set of larger Patagonias & heavier wheels we're in the 24-25 range, but still damn good for the performance & fun factor the JL provides.

Nice to know these motors handle Ethanol without too much penalty, and if Dans' findings are more common than not, maybe Ethanol content is indeed significantly less than 10% in many fuels currently.

Yeah , I havent touched the average mpg reset button since we took delivery of our jeep and it hovers between 27.8 and 29 mpg's. I expect a big change this winter when I put different tread on and temps drop into the single digits . I really should just chase bonefish in the Keys and get the f#@k out of here

 

[stil2low]

I haven’t got much comparison with the JL since we’ve only been across wheeling a handful of times and the JL being so much better on fuel than the JK haven’t had to fill up as much lol

Anyways, I live in a boarder town up here in northern Ontario and wheel lots in Michigan. We still have non ethanol fuel in most of our pumps on our side (no price difference between e10 and no ethanol) and with the JK I’d see about a 3-4 mpg drop between our non ethanol fuel and the e10 that’s in the pumps state side.

Good to know that shell seems to be the lower ethanol count, have to try for their pumps more often across

 

[jdubya421]

Good topic. This was a thread yesterday. Please check out Shell V-Power. I filled up yesterday cause I read that V-Power might not have Ethanol in it. I couldn't confirm that at that pump. This was after a 16-mile trip to work this AM. Halfway city and halfway 75 MPH Freeway.

I've been using sheetz gas in my JL, which is considered like trash gas, and I average 24mpg on my trips to work which are half highway half street.

 

[Visible15]

That's pretty much it, but high octane premium isn't usually more expensive than ethanol free. Around me, ethanol free is usually 91 octane, so you get both benefits, but without necessarily the extra dose of detergents.

Confused yet? Lol

Not as much anymore, I suppose the key is just to check the pumps and see which one is ethanol free, and if I see 91 octane with ethanol free then I’ve hit the jackpot

 

[DanW]

I haven’t got much comparison with the JL since we’ve only been across wheeling a handful of times and the JL being so much better on fuel than the JK haven’t had to fill up as much lol

Anyways, I live in a boarder town up here in northern Ontario and wheel lots in Michigan. We still have non ethanol fuel in most of our pumps on our side (no price difference between e10 and no ethanol) and with the JK I’d see about a 3-4 mpg drop between our non ethanol fuel and the e10 that’s in the pumps state side.

Good to know that shell seems to be the lower ethanol count, have to try for their pumps more often across

It would be worth checking. Your area almost surely gets gas from a different refinery, and possibly the Michigan area does, as well. In our area, all the gas comes from the same refinery and distributor, so the base gas is probably the same with ethanol percentage. I'm going to try and get enough samples to see if this holds true, but even if it doesn't, it could still be variation in batches. Where the brands will differ is in their additive packages. Shell, for example, has a proprietary additive pack that is only found in their gasoline. Others will use pre-packaged additive packs provided by the distributor. Some (back to an old topic) are standard for meeting Top Tier specs, some are the EPA minimum, and others, like Mobil, can also have their own proprietary packs added. I'm hypothesizing that the ethanol content stays the same in each batch of gas, no matter the brand. We shall see soon, though. I'm going to try and test Sunoco regular next, and then others as the weeks go by. I'll eventually get around to Mobil, BP, Phillips 66 and Countrymark. I may try a non Top-Tier brand at some point out of curiosity. That'll likely be Speedway and later, Kroger or Walmart (Murphy). Stay tuned! I'll try and do one this weekend!

 

[stil2low]

It would be worth checking. Your area almost surely gets gas from a different refinery, and possibly the Michigan area does, as well. In our area, all the gas comes from the same refinery and distributor, so the base gas is probably the same with ethanol percentage. I'm going to try and get enough samples to see if this holds true, but even if it doesn't, it could still be variation in batches. Where the brands will differ is in their additive packages. Shell, for example, has a proprietary additive pack that is only found in their gasoline. Others will use pre-packaged additive packs provided by the distributor. Some (back to an old topic) are standard for meeting Top Tier specs, some are the EPA minimum, and others, like Mobil, can also have their own proprietary packs added. I'm hypothesizing that the ethanol content stays the same in each batch of gas, no matter the brand. We shall see soon, though. I'm going to try and test Sunoco regular next, and then others as the weeks go by. I'll eventually get around to Mobil, BP, Phillips 66 and Countrymark. I may try a non Top-Tier brand at some point out of curiosity. That'll likely be Speedway and later, Kroger or Walmart (Murphy). Stay tuned! I'll try and do one this weekend!

I know some of our fuel from the tank farm goes across but From my understanding from a tanker in one of our Jeep groups that it is all the same base fuel in the tank farm and the additives and ethanol is added into the trucks at time of fill/transport. He was saying that the ethanol doesn’t have enough shelf life to be mixed in the big tanks so that will probably play a big factor on the percent you will see as to how much was added to the truck upon filling

 

[BullMoose1776]

I saw a few notes about this above, but it's worth noting, gasoline is a fungible commodity. Truly, the gas you buy at Kroger is literally the same has you buy at Shell (unless one or the other has Additives). It all comes from the same tank at the Terminal.

Premium is a "better" product as it has a higher octane level and, is absolutely, a different product from regular gas.

Mid-grade is blended at the pump, between the regular and premium.

Ethanol is splash-blended at the terminal into the transport vehicle taking the fuel to the gas station.

I suspect the overall load of fuel from OP's sample is a 90/10 gasoline to ethanol ratio, but the sample size is so small, it would be nearly impossible to replicate unless the transport had literally just dropped the load into the storage tank.

Also noted above, gasoline has a higher BTU than ethanol (literally, gasoline is a more efficient fuel). Since the fuel market is a TRUE market, you will see gasoline as a more costly fuel on a volume for volume basis.

As such, you will pay more per gallon for gasoline than per gallon for ethanol, and you will get better fuel economy (higher MPG) from gasoline than ethanol.

Not trying to be a "Mister Know-It-All"...just worked in the Energy business for many years and have first hand knowledge I wanted to share.

 

[higbyz]

Not as much anymore, I suppose the key is just to check the pumps and see which one is ethanol free, and if I see 91 octane with ethanol free then I’ve hit the jackpot

Bingo!

 

[DanW]

Ok, so we've now tested Sunoco regular 87 octane, and there is something interesting right off the bat. The ethanol mixed with the water and made a bunch of bubbles, only about half of which have popped. After 5 minutes of settling, it looked like about 9% ethanol, but the bubbles were still there, so it won't end up that high. I'm letting it set and they seem to slowly be popping. SInce I took this pic, it is looking like 7 or 8 percent ethanol. I'm going to bet that it will settle down to about 6%, which will be about where Shell tested.

I'm curious about the bubbles. The SHell gas didn't do that at all. There must be something in the additive pack with Sunoco fuel that caused this. Once this sample settles, I'll do it again, just to make sure there weren't any contaminants in the syringe I used to put gas and water into the test tube.

Here is the pic after about 5 minutes of settling. Curiously, some of the bubbles appear to be adhering to the lower sides of the tube.

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