Question for Experienced Off-Roaders on Options

[Shark01]

And you would have supremely fancy seats and dash to go with it.

Why not, that interior looks great….

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[dcmdon]

Why not, that interior looks great….

You misunderstood me. My point was that if you take a high altitude and make a competent off roader out of it,, you still have the awesome fancy seats and dash. that is a GOOD thing. I love those quilted seats.

 

[GATORB8]

Assuming you are asking me, I have never owned a Jeep, anything I have done on other cars have been all about performance, handling, brakes, etc so really not comparable.

Yes, I'd say for most of us, the Jeep mod bug is comparable to our former/current sports cars on steroids.

If you've corner balanced coilovers, installed brembos, and cams in the past, I'd get your wallet ready. Oddly, staying flat in a corner on the track, and being able to drop a tire 12" from ride height compute similarly.

 

[Shark01]

Yes, I'd say for most of us, the Jeep mod bug is comparable to our former/current sports cars on steroids.

If you've corner balanced coilovers, installed brembos, and cams in the past, I'd get your wallet ready.

Rut-Roh, I may be in the wrong place…..I already spend $10k a year maintaining and upgrading the two cars I cherish now. Just a few weeks ago I spent $1,000 on 8 Titanium bolts for a 2WD conversion.

 

[Karnak]

I'll only add something about the rock rails vs stock side rails/steps that people may not have stated if they already did (I didn't read the whole tread) then disregard.

If your only doing off-road as a casual basis and your rig will see the road more than anything, I would stick with the OEM side rails/step rails because they provide more coverage from the road grime and other stuff (rocks, sand, etc) your front tires may want to kick up towards your painted sahara fenders vs the rubicon rock rails which provide a sturdier style but lack coverage because they tuck in more and as such, you could get more chips or knicks in your rear fender bottom area etc. and besides, if you have a wife or family, they will love the stock side steps a lot more especially if you lift it...

 

[tk1700]

I would skip the AWD. Many reasons already mentioned here, but my main reason is the CV joints on the front axles instead of U joints. Lots of people will disagree with me, but I haven't had good luck with them in the past.

Front camera, no.

LSD, absolutely yes.

Rock sliders, yes if you like the factory ones and price. There are dozens of after market ones to choose from if you don't get the factory ones.

FYI, I own a 2019 Sport with Altitude package which includes LSD and a 2021 Rubicon.

 

[stumblinhorse]

I completely agree about the long term reliability of an open differential.
If you plan to drive your jeep 100k miles and don't want to repair stuff - avoid the LSD.

All Jeeps have brake lock differential ... and it takes a few seconds for the computer to figure out and use it. The LSD reacts faster (almost instantly) to slippage because it is an analog hydraulic system. The LSD and BLD work together very well. It's not either or.
I've seen this demonstrated very well in multiple videos. LSD is really good for rain, mud, sand ... which are the kind of bad traction events we have in Houston.

Yes the Brake lock computer controlled system does a good job stopping the tire that is spinning. It's pretty amazing. But since the open dif by definition applies equal torque to both wheels - you lose some of your torque to the wheel that is being braked. I would expect more wear on the brake system. The computer has to brake the wheel that is spinning and hold it still, so the differential can then send torque over to the other wheel. The LSD is going to be able to put more torque on the non slipping wheel. And the LSD will react faster switching the torque back and forth. Which is why it is so good on snow, and mud, and sand.

Since the Rubicon has lockers ... there is really no need to have a limited slip. If you know you are going to have traction issues - and here in Houston it's pretty obvious - engage the locker.

Question, is it mechanically possible to have both a locker and a LSD on your axle? (I'll let someone else with more knowledge chime in). If you can't have both - that would also explain why the Rubi doesn't have the LSD.

Technical explanation of LSD vs Open
Living With Limited Slip Differentials (motortrend.com)

5 Benefits of a Limited Slip Differential (How It Works and Its Cons) (oards.com)

Good discussion on LSD
(5) Jeep & Limited Slip Differential Types | Jeep Wrangler Forum

BEACH SAND TEST OF TRACTION CONTROLS | Tacoma World
- note I think A-Trac is the word Toyota used for the same system Jeep calls BLD.

All great info. Without hi-jacking the thread. LSD is not a miracle thing. It needs friction to transfer power. 1 wheel in the air then no friction and then no power transfer and now stuck. BLD helps that out a lot. Applies resistance to the spinning wheel so it can transfer power to the other. So on dry pavement doing a burnout LSD is awesome. Both tires spinning with usually equal friction. On wet or icy not so great. You will turn sideways when one tire has more traction then the other. BLD will correct some of that but you will have to correct and turn into the slide.

Btw never lock on road. 2 things happen. Damage to the axle if too much traction…. and handling characteristics are drastically changed and you might go straight when you thought you could turn.

 

[entropy]

Agree with @AZJeepGuy you don’t need any of them if you are going to order. People seem to think LSD is a magical thing that makes everything work in bad weather. My rubicons never have had LSD. People will say that is because they have lockers…. Well I don’t use lockers driving around on the road in the rain, which is what you are talking about For Houston. And part time 4WD will suit you fine anywhere off road you are going to go. Everywhere open diff with BLD(standard on all wranglers) works great. I never get LSD on anything and don’t ever want it. Save your money for other upgrades.

You get a rear dana44 with the LSD. that's where the value is at. It is like a $500 upgrade only.

But now that I say that. Does the HA come with front and rear d44 anyway? I think I read that somewhere.

 

[entropy]

One thing to consider is that a Sport that has been modified to match what the Rubicon has will not have the same re-sell value as a stock Rubicon that already has those components from the factory. At the end of the day though, Sport, Sahara, or Rubicon, I have never bought a Jeep with the plan to sell it in the future anyway.

Matching the Rubicon is generally gonna come up to be more expensive too anyway. Unless you found a great deal on a sport.

It doesn't make sense to build a sport to match a Rubi. The sport makes sense when building "A poor man's Rubicon" or an off-road beast.

 

[Shibadog]

The Sport also makes sense if you just want a basic jeep. A stock wrangler sport is more capable than most other 4WD vehicles. It is perfect as is for many things that no other vehicle can do:
- dune buggy on the sand
- dealing with high water, mud, washed out roads from a flood or hurricane
- getting up the dirt road to a cabin or deer stand
- cruising with the top down and just enjoying the weather (on pavement and off)
- driving with the doors off because it's cool
- landscape and wildlife photography - it can get you places a car can't go, and in Sunrider mode you can stand up and have a 360 field of view to grab the shot.
- dealing with snow and ice, especially snow and ice and hills.
- and it's a perfectly acceptable daily driver and decent highway SUV.

The only other vehicle that can do these things is the new Bronco w/ soft top.

If you want creature comforts (and who doesn't if you can afford them) go up in trim levels to a Sport S, Sahara, or High Altitude.

- if you want to run with the doors off all the time buy leather seats and replace the carpet with armorlite.

Yup-fully agree

 

[entropy]

The Sport also makes sense if you just want a basic jeep. A stock wrangler sport is more capable than most other 4WD vehicles. It is perfect as is for many things that no other vehicle can do:
- dune buggy on the sand
- dealing with high water, mud, washed out roads from a flood or hurricane
- getting up the dirt road to a cabin or deer stand
- cruising with the top down and just enjoying the weather (on pavement and off)
- driving with the doors off because it's cool
- landscape and wildlife photography - it can get you places a car can't go, and in Sunrider mode you can stand up and have a 360 field of view to grab the shot.
- dealing with snow and ice, especially snow and ice and hills.
- and it's a perfectly acceptable daily driver and decent highway SUV.

The only other vehicle that can do these things is the new Bronco w/ soft top.

If you want creature comforts (and who doesn't if you can afford them) go up in trim levels to a Sport S, Sahara, or High Altitude.

- if you want to run with the doors off all the time buy leather seats and replace the carpet with armorlite.

Of course. A stock sport on 32 A/Ts or 33s can do what most people are doing with lifted Rubicons.

 

[SteadyC]

Skip the LSD, it’s a problematic system in these newer Dana 44s. There’s a very long thread in this forum, search for Dana 44 knock. last I read the thread, there was no permanent fix from jeep, replacing bad parts with bad parts. I had the knocking noise, but I opted to replace the oem carrier with anlocker in my sport, as opposed to either a whole new axle or new carrier from jeep. Plus, the clutch packs are a wear item and need to be replaced, they are a system that needs maintenance. https://www.jlwranglerforums.com/forum/threads/knock-in-rear-with-dana-44.16921/page-106

skip the rails, and get way better aftermarket ones if you decide you want them later.

if you aren’t going to offroad, not sure I see value in the camera.

i live in CO, there’s only buying AWDs or 4WDs. While you live in Houston, maybe you’ll vacation somewhere you will utilize AWD. Or, maybe the kids will, be driving this jeep, or if you end up handing down the jeep down to kids, or family, they might utilize it.

 

[txj2go]

You can do a good amount of trails with the stock Sahara wheels and tires, but if you think you want better tires as mentioned the easiest thing to do is to look for like new Rubicon takeoffs.

 

[Viking Jeeper]

That’s an old maids’ tale Rubicon owner love to spread.

There’s ZERO evidence that Rubicons hold value better than other Wranglers. All Wranglers hold their value equally well once you take into account that you paid a lot more upfront for a Rubicon.

Ever heard of an LJ Rubicon?

 

[NewJLU2019]

Get what you want. It's your Jeep.

I have both the Sahara and Rubicon. I enjoy both. Have to admit the Rubi is favorite. If they were animals a Sahara would be a deer. Rubicon a Wolverine that never backs down from SH_T.

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