Turtleback Expedition and JLU Towing Capacity?

[NCJL]

I hate to say this but it sounds like you may have been a tool used to correct outstanding fabrication and installation issues. Sounds like maybe the new owner began fixing these things over the last year since he bought. Optimistic?

I hope you are correct. This was the conversation between the owner and me. We kept in touch and communicated through phone conversation, email and texting. My last email to the owner (approximately 6 months ago) asking for an update on making improvements, was not replied too. The early communication with the owner and staff was apologetic and embarrassment. The later communication was turning into legal type talk saying the existing is ok and are looking into making our product better.

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[NCJL]

Sorry for being so nerdy. I will try and pull it back

Again, it sure sounds like they messed up your wiring in a variety of ways. My understanding is they lacked a schematic for builds - per TB every build was custom enough that they hadn't come up with wiring diagrams. Thankfully that has changed. I will be testing and exercising the electrical system to every extent when I pick up my trailer to ensure it functions properly.

I know so little about spacers but I can understand the concern there given. Me I'm just slumming it with their standard size wheels/tires.

I am very curious about this pad lock on the tire carrier. I had never thought about the tire carrier opening on the road. That's a scary prospect. Is this now a standard option? Does you're trailer have that pad lock?

One more, in a post you had previously mentioned the u-bolts stretching, iirc. I got pictures from TB on how those u-bolts are setup, wrapped around the frame and going through the bumper up to the tire carrier. While I can see the large lever arm with the weight of the tire, I must say it is a little surprising that you could get plastic deformation of the bolts. That's actually scary because if that's happening the bolts could fail. Did you every address this, and how did you determine it was stretching on the bolt and not just the nuts getting loose?

No apologies necessary. No disrespect meant. I’m pressed for time at the moment. I will follow up with your questions hopefully in the morning.

 

[NCJL]

Sorry for being so nerdy. I will try and pull it back

Again, it sure sounds like they messed up your wiring in a variety of ways. My understanding is they lacked a schematic for builds - per TB every build was custom enough that they hadn't come up with wiring diagrams. Thankfully that has changed. I will be testing and exercising the electrical system to every extent when I pick up my trailer to ensure it functions properly.

I know so little about spacers but I can understand the concern there given. Me I'm just slumming it with their standard size wheels/tires.

I am very curious about this pad lock on the tire carrier. I had never thought about the tire carrier opening on the road. That's a scary prospect. Is this now a standard option? Does you're trailer have that pad lock?

One more, in a post you had previously mentioned the u-bolts stretching, iirc. I got pictures from TB on how those u-bolts are setup, wrapped around the frame and going through the bumper up to the tire carrier. While I can see the large lever arm with the weight of the tire, I must say it is a little surprising that you could get plastic deformation of the bolts. That's actually scary because if that's happening the bolts could fail. Did you every address this, and how did you determine it was stretching on the bolt and not just the nuts getting loose?

I will start including pictures to help explain. I have resisted posting pictures to keep from getting involved. From the beginning I have tried to communicate with TB hoping the outcome would be a better safer product. Trying to get my money back would have cost money, stress and aggravation. A safer product would not have been the outcome. I own the trailer and I’m offering my experience of purchasing and the opportunity for anyone to visit my trailer to help with your purchase.

I truly hope TB as made many improvements over the last year. I have no knowledge of any improvements made since my purchase.

The first picture shows the take off parts used to mount and latch the tire swing TB installed. A wheel spacers is also included. This spacer is one of three installed by TB. One for the spare tire and one for each wheel attached to the suspension.
The wheel spacers have no DOT certification.
The hardware used is what would be commonly used for position type mounts not structural. The nuts used on the u bolts are the ny-lock type. Stainless is soft and will often stretch. Some grades of stainless are better than others. ARP for example makes structural type stainless bolts. The u-bolts are also wrapped around a 2x3 frame tube. This tube is hollow. It will compress. TB included no torque specifications for any bolt on the trailer, u-bolt, wheel spacers and so on. TB providing no specs when asked about torque values.
The second picture shows the battery charger installed by TB for the two batteries they installed. The wire shown is the smaller #4 wire they installed and the 2/0 wire I used to replace with per inverter manufacturer recommendation.
The third picture was taken within an hour of pick up from TB.

 

[SuperNerdEE]

I will start including pictures to help explain. I have resisted posting pictures to keep from getting involved. From the beginning I have tried to communicate with TB hoping the outcome would be a better safer product. Trying to get my money back would have cost money, stress and aggravation. A safer product would not have been the outcome. I own the trailer and I’m offering my experience of purchasing and the opportunity for anyone to visit my trailer to help with your purchase.

I truly hope TB as made many improvements over the last year. I have no knowledge of any improvements made since my purchase.

The first picture shows the take off parts used to mount and latch the tire swing TB installed. A wheel spacers is also included. This spacer is one of three installed by TB. One for the spare tire and one for each wheel attached to the suspension.
The wheel spacers have no DOT certification.
The hardware used is what would be commonly used for position type mounts not structural. The nuts used on the u bolts are the ny-lock type. Stainless is soft and will often stretch. Some grades of stainless are better than others. ARP for example makes structural type stainless bolts. The u-bolts are also wrapped around a 2x3 frame tube. This tube is hollow. It will compress. TB included no torque specifications for any bolt on the trailer, u-bolt, wheel spacers and so on. TB providing no specs when asked about torque values.
The second picture shows the battery charger installed by TB for the two batteries they installed. The wire shown is the smaller #4 wire they installed and the 2/0 wire I used to replace with per inverter manufacturer recommendation.
The third picture was taken within an hour of pick up from TB.

Thank you for taking the time to share information. You said stainless can stretch and I get that, especially a possibility here with the lever arm. Did you end up making any changes to the tire carrier yourself? Did the 2x3 square tubing compress on you? Different U-bolts or anything? Or is it something you just have had to live with?

Additionally, and this may be a hard question to answer, but do you use your trailer and find it meets your needs now? I fully understand how frustrating something can be when multiple things are done incorrectly / not up to par. That can really color something bad regardless if it has any other good qualities. But if you still have your trailer, are there things you like about it?

 

[NCJL]

Thank you for taking the time to share information. You said stainless can stretch and I get that, especially a possibility here with the lever arm. Did you end up making any changes to the tire carrier yourself? Did the 2x3 square tubing compress on you? Different U-bolts or anything? Or is it something you just have had to live with?

Additionally, and this may be a hard question to answer, but do you use your trailer and find it meets your needs now? I fully understand how frustrating something can be when multiple things are done incorrectly / not up to par. That can really color something bad regardless if it has any other good qualities. But if you still have your trailer, are there things you like about it?

I completely modified the tire carrier. I modified to create a more stable mounting plate form to the frame, a solid latching system that would not bounce around or vibrate and to have a higher weight carrying capacity.

The frame did compress and flex at the u bolt locations on the spindle side. The tire carrier frame did flex. The TB system with #125 would drop about an inch on the latch side. This was do to flex in the tire carrier frame and mounting points from frame to frame.

My modified tire carrier is about #250 including frame and gear. The most weight I ever had the TB system was about #140. The TB recommend weight is #125.
Pictures of my modification. The propane tanks shown is also a modification. I like having both tanks match for changing out when empty.

 

[NCJL]

Forgot to include a pic of the undercarriage frame modification for the tire carrier. The pic is only of one side. I did the same to both sides of the trailer.
This pic also shows my modification for the waste water drain and water tank drain. I like to be able to control we’re the water goes.

 

[SuperNerdEE]

I completely modified the tire carrier. I modified to create a more stable mounting plate form to the frame, a solid latching system that would not bounce around or vibrate and to have a higher weight carrying capacity.

The frame did compress and flex at the u bolt locations on the spindle side. The tire carrier frame did flex. The TB system with #125 would drop about an inch on the latch side. This was do to flex in the tire carrier frame and mounting points from frame to frame.

My modified tire carrier is about #250 including frame and gear. The most weight I ever had the TB system was about #140. The TB recommend weight is #125.
Pictures of my modification. The propane tanks shown is also a modification. I like having both tanks match for changing out when empty.

Nice work. Thanks for the info.

 

[SuperNerdEE]

Thought I'd share some info. Apparently there is a safety pin on the carrier. I don't know if this is new or not but it sounds like it could be based on the discussion in this thread. A lock can be put through it. From TB:

 

[SuperNerdEE]

Thought I'd share some info. Apparently there is a safety pin on the carrier. I don't know if this is new or not but it sounds like it could be based on the discussion in this thread. A lock can be put through it. From TB:

You know, this whole time I thought those U-bolts were on the side here the tire carrier hinges, which is why I mentioned previously that I could see the lever arm being an issue. Having not seen a TB trailer yet in person makes it hard to always have my bearings.

But now that I see this picture and know that the U-bolts are what hold this bracket in place, I must say am a bit puzzled as to why those would even be an issue or what on earth would cause them to stretch. (The two U-bolts are what hold this bracket on that has the "ATTENTION" sticker.) This bracket is simply the place the tire carrier latches to. Perhaps overtightening the bolts could be a problem, IDK. But I don't understand what the problem here could be. It shouldn't really experience much force. Maybe as the tire carrier bounces up and down?

 

[NCJL]

You know, this whole time I thought those U-bolts were on the side here the tire carrier hinges, which is why I mentioned previously that I could see the lever arm being an issue. Having not seen a TB trailer yet in person makes it hard to always have my bearings.

But now that I see this picture and know that the U-bolts are what hold this bracket in place, I must say am a bit puzzled as to why those would even be an issue or what on earth would cause them to stretch. (The two U-bolts are what hold this bracket on that has the "ATTENTION" sticker.) This bracket is simply the place the tire carrier latches to. Perhaps overtightening the bolts could be a problem, IDK. But I don't understand what the problem here could be. It shouldn't really experience much force. Maybe as the tire carrier bounces up and down?

TB uses u bolts on the latch side and spindle side. The spindle side is the important side.
The TB latch does not clamp down the tire carrier to the trailer frame. The tire carrier is allowed to rattle, bounce and vibrate.

A tire carrier should never be allowed to bounce around. Allowing this adds stress to everything the tire carrier touch’s and everything on a tire carrier.

The hitch pin lock shown in the picture will only limit the movement. It is also only made out stainless 10 gauge or 1/8.

 

[NCJL]

Thought I'd share some info. Apparently there is a safety pin on the carrier. I don't know if this is new or not but it sounds like it could be based on the discussion in this thread. A lock can be put through it. From TB:

That looks like what was originally installed on my trailer. TB showed this to me as an improvement due to a tire swing opening on the highway. Scary

 

[OffroadCalling77]

That looks like what was originally installed on my trailer. TB showed this to me as an improvement due to a tire swing opening on the highway. Scary

Would it be better if it was welded and bolted?

 

[NCJL]

Would it be better if it was welded and bolted?

Tire carrier modification list.

Welded.

 

[NCJL]

To clarify the tire carrier modification

I welded everything.
I added the lower 2x2 steel on the tire carrier frame.
Added a 3/8 plate at the hub mount with a new position latch. I now have 6 positions to lock the tire carrier in the open position for pantry use. The TB setup has 2 maybe 3 positions. The new position latch does not move. The TB latch only takes a slight amount of pressure and it will bend.
Upgraded from 5 lug hub to 6 lug hub.
Added 1/4 aluminum plate to the frame to help with sagging. Also opens options for the accessorie mounts. 2 NATO fuel cans, high lift jack, trailer jacks, Front Runner table mount and fire ring.
Reinforced trailer frame bottom and top in the corners where the spindle and latch are located. This replaced the u bolts, added additional support to the area directly behind tire.
Move the tire carrier back one inch for the propane tank modification.


Fully loaded the improved tire carrier does not bounce, rattle, vibrate. No sagging when opening and closing.

This modification did add weight to the trailer.

 

[NCJL]

Too further clarify. I personally do not weld. The welding is the only item I did not do with my own hands. I did all layout, fabricating, grinding, forming….
All fabrication was done in my 100 year old single car garage.

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