TPMS question

[Yellow Cake Kid]

JL sensors are "auto-learning", I have bought 2 sets of take-offs...

One of the difficulties of increasing knowledge about these systems is the confusing nomenclature.

For example; The TPMS sensors that are placed in the wheels "sense" tire pressure. They do not auto learn, they simply transmit the collected information out to what ever is listening.

For example; The TPMS sensor module mounted on the underside of the bodywork "senses" the radio (a.k.a. wireless) data being sent by the "TPMS sensors" and then the system auto learns where each sensor is.

Further confusing the matter is the fact that legacy systems did include processes where "learning" inputs where performed by installers to specifically mate transmitters to receivers, and a current generation of generic products, mentioned previously, seem to be taught something by an external programmer, which simply sets the frequency and id code so that the sensor module may be recognize the item "automatically".

I have taken a few Schrader tech courses, and the syllabi are far more concerned with teaching installers how to not break sensors during install, and teaching sales persons how to advocate for the use of TPMS as a general concept, than explaining how the systems work in detail.

The details are mired in patent concerns and legal gotchas, that are the concern of the specific vehcile manufacturers and the IP holders they have partnered with. These parties don't seem to be publishing information that is available to the general public or even the vehicle dealer network.

While we, the end users, wait for these features to normalize, all we can do is seek clarity of the details we have available, which is why I point out that the wheel sensors don't auto learn, the system does.

Good luck!

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[Echo4papa]

One of the difficulties of increasing knowledge about these systems is the confusing nomenclature.

For example; The TPMS sensors that are placed in the wheels "sense" tire pressure. They do not auto learn, they simply transmit the collected information out to what ever is listening.

For example; The TPMS sensor module mounted on the underside of the bodywork "senses" the radio (a.k.a. wireless) data being sent by the "TPMS sensors" and then the system auto learns where each sensor is.

Further confusing the matter is the fact that legacy systems did include processes where "learning" inputs where performed by installers to specifically mate transmitters to receivers, and a current generation of generic products, mentioned previously, seem to be taught something by an external programmer, which simply sets the frequency and id code so that the sensor module may be recognize the item "automatically".

I have taken a few Schrader tech courses, and the syllabi are far more concerned with teaching installers how to not break sensors during install, and teaching sales persons how to advocate for the use of TPMS as a general concept, than explaining how the systems work in detail.

The details are mired in patent concerns and legal gotchas, that are the concern of the specific vehcile manufacturers and the IP holders they have partnered with. These parties don't seem to be publishing information that is available to the general public or even the vehicle dealer network.

While we, the end users, wait for these features to normalize, all we can do is seek clarity of the details we have available, which is why I point out that the wheel sensors don't auto learn, the system does.

Good luck!

So, it sounds like there are two different frequencies that stock sensors on Wranglers might use? Are the OEM sensors able to switch frequencies? Is is possible that switching sensors from one frequency to the other causes an issue?

The dealer was... less than helpful. They said they cleared the codes and the TPMS error went away and stayed off. I picked it up, TPMS error message still showed, but the warning light was off. Still no pressures showing and 5 minutes into my drive home the warning light was back on. I won't be going back to that particular dealership.

I'll drive around this weekend, deflate, inflate etc., and see if it clears things up.

 

[Echo4papa]

@Echo4papa there is indeed no “learning” to be done. A TPMS has a protocol that works or doesn’t work. If a TPMS works in any Wrangler 2018 it will work in any Wrangler from 2018-2022 so far. Only difference is the added feature of TFA added in newer years so you would need a different TPMS to still have that feature but the TPMS part would still work. Make sure no other TPMS are in the Jeep (I.e. take off wheels or TPMS in the Jeep). Make sure the tires are filled to the door placard and drive.
@CarbonSteel I can assure you those are one of two things; fake or refurbished but they are non genuine brand new TPMS. Doesn’t mean they won’t last. Many fakes and refurbished TPMS can work. For how long, it is a crap shoot.

@Goin2drt
Okay, so these still aren't coming on. Went for a longish drive on Sunday, today I aired down to 25 psi, drove 4 miles or so, filled back up to 36 and drove another 15 miles. Still nothing.

These are the original tpms sensors in stock 392 wheels that came off with around 100 miles on them and sat for about 3 weeks before I picked them up and swapped them over. No other wheels/tpms sensors are near my Jeep.

Other than giving it a few more days and driving around, do you have any suggestions?

Original part# from my 4xe was 68510382AA, so is it the 29093 I want to order if these dont start working soon?

 

[Rhinebeck01]

@Goin2drt
Okay, so these still aren't coming on. Went for a longish drive on Sunday, today I aired down to 25 psi, drove 4 miles or so, filled back up to 36 and drove another 15 miles. Still nothing.

These are the original tpms sensors in stock 392 wheels that came off with around 100 miles on them and sat for about 3 weeks before I picked them up and swapped them over. No other wheels/tpms sensors are near my Jeep.

Other than giving it a few more days and driving around, do you have any suggestions?

Original part# from my 4xe was 68510382AA, so is it the 29093 I want to order if these dont start working soon?

@Echo4papa

Did you try with the spare off. Does your JL's door placard say inflate to 36 ?

 

[Goin2drt]

@Goin2drt
Okay, so these still aren't coming on. Went for a longish drive on Sunday, today I aired down to 25 psi, drove 4 miles or so, filled back up to 36 and drove another 15 miles. Still nothing.

These are the original tpms sensors in stock 392 wheels that came off with around 100 miles on them and sat for about 3 weeks before I picked them up and swapped them over. No other wheels/tpms sensors are near my Jeep.

Other than giving it a few more days and driving around, do you have any suggestions?

Original part# from my 4xe was 68510382AA, so is it the 29093 I want to order if these dont start working soon?

Yes that part number is for a 29093.
Do what @rhinebeck says. Take off the spare. Reason is it could be ”awake” and confusing the system. Then make sure the tires are at door placard.

Sadly I am not real confident in your dealer so are we sure 100% that they actually took the TPMS from the 392 stock wheels and put them in yours? I guess I am not sure the juggling of the TPMS and what the dealer was actually doing. Bottom line if you have stock OEM TPMS from a 392 and they were installed properly and put on your 4xe they the relearn should happen. One thing I know for sure is new OE sensors from any new Wrangler will work in your 4xe if they were actually installed properly in the wheel. DM me with your cell if you want and I can help you tomorrow trouble shoot this better.

 

[Echo4papa]

@Echo4papa

Did you try with the spare off. Does your JL's door placard say inflate to 36 ?

Yes, it says 36... no, I didnt try with the spare off as it came with the same set off the 392? I guess I can pull it off and go for a drive tomorrow.

 

[Echo4papa]

Hmmm... he said 12 psi, i only deflated down to 25. I can try that again tomorrow too.

 

[Rhinebeck01]

@Echo4papa

@Goin2drt, has told me this in the past...

Along with removing the spare as he mentioned ....

IF you have one or more sensors not reading on a say a JL/JLU, you deflate all tires to 12# below the recommended tire pressure, driver's side door sticker that tells you recommended tire psi.

Now, after they are all deflated you drive say a half mile. Now, you inflate to +- 1# psi, of the recommended psi on the driver's side door sticker and go for a mile drive.. This scenario/routine is suppose to wake up the sensors, so to speak and get them reading...

.

 

[Echo4papa]

Yes that part number is for a 29093.
Do what @rhinebeck says. Take off the spare. Reason is it could be ”awake” and confusing the system. Then make sure the tires are at door placard.

Sadly I am not real confident in your dealer so are we sure 100% that they actually took the TPMS from the 392 stock wheels and put them in yours? I guess I am not sure the juggling of the TPMS and what the dealer was actually doing. Bottom line if you have stock OEM TPMS from a 392 and they were installed properly and put on your 4xe they the relearn should happen. One thing I know for sure is new OE sensors from any new Wrangler will work in your 4xe if they were actually installed properly in the wheel. DM me with your cell if you want and I can help you tomorrow trouble shoot this better.

So, i didnt get these from the dealer. They haven't done anything except, 8n their own words, try to program them. They told me that the tpms sensors arent the right part number and vin'ed to the 392.

Also, the guy was kind of an idiot as I asked them to tighten the ball joints and instead they tell me I need new hubs and didnt even look at the castle nuts, just did what the decision tree said based on the clicking when you turn at low speeds. So i have zero faith in them.

The wheels came straight off a 392 from a woman near Hollywood FL, sat at her friends shop for 3 weeks until I picked them up. She ordered new wheels and tires as a package online that came with new sensors. Its possible he swapped them, but I dont see why he would bother.

 

[Yellow Cake Kid]

It is unlikely that a tire that is not spinning can fool an accelerometer into thinking it is spinning.

 

[Goin2drt]

It is unlikely that a tire that is not spinning can fool an accelerometer into thinking it is spinning.

Happens all the time.

 

[Echo4papa]

ok... I was trying to type on my tablet so I thought I'd sit at the computer and write it all out:

I bought these wheels from a woman in Hollywood (FL). According to her, they came right off her 392 and her friend put on her new tires/wheels at his shop. They then sat there for 3 weeks while she tried to sell them, until I picked them up.

I'm pretty sure I got a reading off of them when I first swapped them over as my original tires were sitting at 34 psi. When I put the new wheels on, I aired them all up to 36. They showed up as the two in the rear at 36 and the two front at 37. Everything seemed good. Drove around minimally for a couple of days.

I've had the clicking from the front end when moving slow and turning and I wanted the dealer to check out the ball joints to tighten up the castle nuts. On the way to the dealer, my TPMS sensors cut out, warning light came on and it's stayed that way ever since (see pictures from previous post).

Dealer said they were vin'ed to a 392 and they couldn't program them, and that I needed to buy a new set for them to install @500 for the new sensors plus labor. I tried not to laugh at him and left.

I've also been told that the TPMS sensors were changed to a new part number in late may/early June and that I need the older model (which seemed odd). It tracks with what you said somewhere else about the initial TPMS units with the 29117 being discontinued and replaced with the 29093's but either should work.

Today, I aired down to 25 psi, drove around a bit (about 5 miles), aired back up to 36 (what it says on the door placard) and drove some more but it didn't clear up. Sounds like I should have aired down lower and pulled the spare off the mount too, which I can do tomorrow as another test.

Also, I suppose it's possible that the original owner I got the tires from got TPMS sensors in her new tires that didn't support TFA, and her buddy swapped them out for her original sensors if she had that feature on her 392, but even then, the sensors in the wheels should still work, just not allow me to use that feature, right? Unless that happened, the sensors in my wheels should be as they were from the factory as it's still the original wheel/tire combo that was original to the 392.

 

[Yellow Cake Kid]

It is more likely that internet wisdom mis-diagnosis occurs far more frequently than the acceleration sensors, which is the term I should have used previously, in the TPMS sensors misbehave.

In the absence of surety that the TPMS sensors are the correct part, and the claim by the tire shop service rep, which seems to be supported when trying to locate the yet to be listed official part number on the official MOPAR repair parts websites, that the part for this specific Jeep somehow differs from previously available parts, makes it highly likely, on a diagnostic flow chart, that investigating what parts are actually in these tires, and learning what parts are supposed to be on this Jeep, would be far more effective than considering the likelihood that the spare tire is being confused for one that is spinning at highway speeds.

Good luck!

 

[runningshoes]

I'm glad this came up as I have a weird issue with two sensors - had the tires rotated recently and all ok, getting readings and noticed a couple of weeks later that one tire (front driver) was lower than the other three so I added some air and went on my way. A few days later I noticed it was at the same pressure as before but my rear passenger had gone up. Long story short, my front driver and rear passenger tire pressure readings are reversed on the display. I didn't think this could happen either so it took me about 30 minutes with the compressor to validate (remove from one, watch the display, add to the other, repeat, etc.).

 

[Yellow Cake Kid]

Are your ABS sensors nice and clean? Is there a Tazer involved?

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