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Poor steering.........throwing in the towel

Turfman

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Chewy, if your selling your aftermarket parts give me a holler!
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HemiSphereCars

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After 6500 miles, non stop frustration and $1500 in aftermarket parts I have made the decision to throw in the towel and get rid of this thing. Bottom line is that it is not safe to drive, you can massage it around and drive super careful and get where you are going, but make no mistake if you have a situation where you have to react to some other dumb driver this thing is a death trap. Had a run in with a box truck yesterday on a mountain road that sealed the deal for me. He came around a sharp right hand corner in my lane. I was going up the mountain luckily and reacted by yanking the Jeep to the right, he also moved right and missed me by about 18". Problem is once the Jeep went right I tried to ease it back to the road, the passenger side tires were on the shoulder and well below the drivers side tires and there was not enough of a response. Forced to yank the wheel I was shocked that the Jeep rebounded dead left and carried me clear across the opposite driving lane. I managed to gather it up from there and did no damage but honestly after logging 100k miles in two JK's I can positively say that both of my JK's would have handled that situation with little more than some cursing from me. Bottom line is that after a Falcon Nexus 2.2, adjustable LCA's with caster set, a yeti track bar and a new steering box this thing still stinks. The box seemed better for about 200 miles, or until the weather warmed back up over 20 degrees and now it is as bad as the original box. There is a dead spot where the wheels do not react, once you get through that spot the wheels seem to react too quickly and when you are forced to make quick adjustments, like to avoid an idiot in your lane the Jeep is completely unpredictable. I have a line on a couple of 2018 JKUR's and will be dumping this thing at a bad loss as soon as possible. To all who have the poor handling Jeeps, beware and be careful, if you are forced to take evasive action on the road these things are worse than a handful.

Chewi
I test drove 2 JLU Rubicons in January of 2019 and knew about this issue so I tested the steering and both were fine. One even had a Mopar 2" lift and 37" tires, a dealer installation. Have you taken it in for the software steering update? Having 2 wheels lower on the low shoulder would have also contributed to the over-steer. Well if it's not safe after the update then time to bail. I have a JLU Rubicon on order and hope for the best. Good luck on your wheeling.
 
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Chewbacca2264

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I test drove 2 JLU Rubicons in January of 2019 and knew about this issue so I tested the steering and both were fine. One even had a Mopar 2" lift and 37" tires, a dealer installation. Have you taken it in for the software steering update? Having 2 wheels lower on the low shoulder would have also contributed to the over-steer. Well if it's not safe after the update then time to bail. I have a JLU Rubicon on order and hope for the best. Good luck on your wheeling.
The problem is that when the Jeep snapped out from under me the two wheels were no longer on the shoulder, there is a spot in the steering where minimal movement becomes a lot of movement. I already had the wheels back on the road when it got loose. Once you turn the wheel approximately 3 " the steering suddenly becomes quite firm and the wheels respond too well, that is the problem there is no response for the longest time then the response is too sudden. Anyway I looked at the rest of the Steer Smarts stuff and decided that there is no point is sinking more money in this Jeep. I will sell off what is left of my extra parts and move back to a JK. I simply do not trust this Jeep so there is no sense keeping it. To top things off two days ago in the storm I put it in reverse and was backing up my driveway to the garage and suddenly Jeep stalled and I had Christmas lights all over the dash! Man this thing can really light up, no idea what in the world happened, would not start so I waited went in the house went back out 30 min later and it fired right up no issue. Honestly, this POS can't get out of my driveway soon enough!
 
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Chewbacca2264

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One last point on this before I shut up for good. The Jeep is back in stock form except the stabilizer, dealer took the stock one told me they would reimburse me the cost and then never did. So the Falcon goes with the Jeep. In stock form this is no longer dangerous, annoying as hell but not dangerous. The fact that adding Rubicon shocks and slightly bigger tires made this thing drive so poorly is a testament to how "close to the line" Jeep made this thing. That and I would also say that for those who are keeping them, the tie rod and drag link just feel so...….light and cheap I guess is how I would put it. My thought is that you need both trackbars, tie rod and drag link at minimum to make these things drive the way we want with lifts and bigger tires. Plus for those of us who got Jeeps that are a bit over the line stock you will need to add $1500 to make it drive properly or just learn to fight it up and down the road. Either way these things are not what they were advertised as being. Just my $.02.
 

jeepthang

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There are really two issues- steering stabilizer and the programming of the electric power steering pump.

The stabilizer causes the steering oscillation. There is a TSB posted in this forum for the power steering issue that may cause stiff steering in cold temps.

I have had both resolved by my dealer and my Jeep drives better than new. It puts my Jk’s to shame.
What this gentlemen said ^. The electric power steering pump I believe is more of the culprit then people think. There are days my Jeep feels super tight and solid, and others times when it is loose and all over the place. I believe when it is tight, the pump is working as it suppose to be providing the proper psi eliminating a lot of the slop. On a separate, possibly unrelated note, I hear a pump come on at times under my jeep usually when pulling in and out of the parking garage at work. Not sure if this is the power pump or a vacuum pump for the evap system.

Chewy did you have them by chance apply the TSB addressing the pump pressure readings? This unfortunately did not apply to my vin# so they passed me off like yesterday's news.
 

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californiajeeping

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What this gentlemen said ^. The electric power steering pump I believe is more of the culprit then people think. There are days my Jeep feels super tight and solid, and others times when it is loose and all over the place. I believe when it is tight, the pump is working as it suppose to be providing the proper psi eliminating a lot of the slop. On a separate, possibly unrelated note, I hear a pump come on at times under my jeep usually when pulling in and out of the parking garage at work. Not sure if this is the power pump or a vacuum pump for the evap system.
To continue on your steering pump theory, I'm trying to find someone with good steering - no dead spot, if they see the same thing as this video shows, where the steering shaft has play like this before the pitman arm moves. If yes, then the steering pump is picking up the slack on those JLs without the dead spot, and the steering pump is at fault on those with the dead spot. I'm thinking the steering pump doesn't provide as much pressure when the Jeep isn't in motion, it then increases the pressure accordingly.

 
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Maybe you don't understand the legal process. Anyone can sue for any reason and non-disclosure of a serious safety issue would get any attorney interested. It isn't communism it is the democratic system that allows it. Communist countries wouldn't allow a suit like this. Perhaps if you had made it past 5th grade you would know the difference. I had a case where a couple on a motorcycle made an illegal u-turn on a highway and got smashed by a car. Our investigation showed they were at fault and the car driver was not issued a citation. County Attorney determined they were at fault and did not file charges against the driver. But the motorcycle people kept sueing the driver and we had to keep going to testify of what happened. So the legal system here works that way.
And I will never be selected to serve on a jury because I was a LEO. Perhaps I even gave you ticket or arrested you. With your attitude that may have happened.
"Thus endeth the lesson."
Thanks for your service and this civics demonstration.
 

Markham

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But is there a recall in all these steering components? They are mostly TSBs. A recall would cost the company so much more money!
 

signals34

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Wow, that's crazy. I have 8500mi on my 2018 JLUR and the steering has been solid. Hands down the best feeling steering I've ever experienced in any of my vehicles. Trips me out when I hear that some people feel their steering is less than perfection. I'm wondering if there really is a problem or if people just don't like the way it feels for some reason...
yeah, i have a 2019 rubicon...no issues at all, i mean it doesn't handle like my miata, but i think this is what some people expect....it handles like a jeep, a truck, a suv...its going to have a delay reaction when you cut the wheel, there is a lot of weight there.....my jeep handles excellent, no pulling, no wandering...and i test drove 3 other jeeps at different dealers before i bought....they were all perfect driving jeeps....
 

Andrew05LJR

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yeah, i have a 2019 rubicon...no issues at all, i mean it doesn't handle like my miata, but i think this is what some people expect....it handles like a jeep, a truck, a suv...its going to have a delay reaction when you cut the wheel, there is a lot of weight there.....my jeep handles excellent, no pulling, no wandering...and i test drove 3 other jeeps at different dealers before i bought....they were all perfect driving jeeps....
False. Absolutely false. I’ve had numerous Jeeps and trucks, lifted stock etc. The Jeep should react to your input without a delay. You will get sidewall flex in turns but it should turn immediately.
 

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Jeepsterfreak

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To continue on your steering pump theory, I'm trying to find someone with good steering - no dead spot, if they see the same thing as this video shows, where the steering shaft has play like this before the pitman arm moves. If yes, then the steering pump is picking up the slack on those JLs without the dead spot, and the steering pump is at fault on those with the dead spot. I'm thinking the steering pump doesn't provide as much pressure when the Jeep isn't in motion, it then increases the pressure accordingly.

There is quite a bit of engineering design that goes into something as simple as a power steering box. All the tolerances have to be within spec to work properly.

With that being said, the power steering fluid is only there to assist the piston movement. I wouldn’t think it could remove any slop between the input shaft and pitman arm movement but it can definitely impact the “feel” of the steering overall.

If FCA is using a completely new chinese supplier for the JL steering gear box vs the JK, that could explain a lot. Not only does the steering gearbox need to be engineered properly, it also needs to be manufactured within design and material specifications.

Here’s an excellent video that explains how a power steering gearbox works for those interested.

 

offset_98

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What this gentlemen said ^. The electric power steering pump I believe is more of the culprit then people think. There are days my Jeep feels super tight and solid, and others times when it is loose and all over the place. I believe when it is tight, the pump is working as it suppose to be providing the proper psi eliminating a lot of the slop. On a separate, possibly unrelated note, I hear a pump come on at times under my jeep usually when pulling in and out of the parking garage at work. Not sure if this is the power pump or a vacuum pump for the evap system.

Chewy did you have them by chance apply the TSB addressing the pump pressure readings? This unfortunately did not apply to my vin# so they passed me off like yesterday's news.
This right here. There are days where mine is spot on and little corrections are perfect and others where I can toss the the wheel left and right a few inches and still maintain my line ahead. It's odd but I've gotten used to it.
 

wrangster

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I had a VW Jetta with electric P.S. pump and it had issues, but only after 70K miles. So far my JLUS is holding up ok no steering issues just over 6K miles. I do know they have a new track bar that will be installed on JLs if built on or before May 2018. My JL was built in Sept. maybe with that new track bar?
 

signals34

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False. Absolutely false. I’ve had numerous Jeeps and trucks, lifted stock etc. The Jeep should react to your input without a delay. You will get sidewall flex in turns but it should turn immediately.
yes, it does react without delay, i meant the handling of it...some people are used to a car, it's not going to handle like a car....
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