How about a JLU XL?!

aldo98229

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I would be. I think Jeep will always keep its icon. Or at least hope.
I agree. The 2-door Wrangler is iconic. But money talks. It will depend if there’s the internal courage to protect the 2-door Wrangler as the decisions to develop the all-new Wrangler are being made.





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Dash68

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I suspect it truly boils down to consumer demand/profit ... there used to be 2 door pickups from all manufactures. Now there are pretty much none, at least in the US. Why? I think it's safe to assume its because not enough people were buying them. Sort of like Ford no longer makes 4 door sedans. The market has shifted.

I personally love the 2 door look, but as someone else mentioned 2 door wranglers make up a small percentage of Wranglers sold, it's hard to imagine there is a huge demand for 2 door pickups ... even if they look great.
CAFE regulation is the reason manufacturer's stopped producing short wheelbase pickup trucks (small 2 door regular cab with a short bed) not that people no longer wanted them. It was easier for manufacturers to meet the government fuel mileage requirements by building larger vehicles since the larger the wheebase area had much less stringent requirements. Ask yourself why American made vehicles keep getting larger with minimal improvement in fuel mileage.
 

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The data is publicly available for anyone to see.

2-door vehicles are out; it’s all about 4-doors these days:
  • Sales of 2-door Wrangler are now 15% of total sales, and shrinking.
  • All the growth in pickup sales have come from 4-door versions.
    • Tacoma, Frontier, Colorado sales are, at best, 80% 4-door/20% 2-door. Sales of full-size pickups follow a similar pattern. I still haven’t seen a 2-door Ram 1500 DT (the new one). Ranger and Gladiator didn’t even bother with a 2-door version.
  • Things are more extreme with cars. For those few models that offer(ed) a 4-door and a 2-door, like Honda Civic and Accord, sales ratio was 90% 4-door/10% 2-door. Honda killed the Accord 2-door a couple years back.
  • To add insult to injury, sports coupe brands like Lamborghini and Ferrari are adding 4-door SUVs as a means to stay relevant on the market
  • Fiat just pulled the plug on 124 Spider due to low global sales.
Good luck finding a product planner willing to make the business case to add a 2-door version of anything.

Sahara 2-door is already gone. At this rate, I wouldn't be surprised if the 2-door Wrangler completely disappears when JM comes out.
Look up CAFE regulations and you will learn the reason for the demise of small wheelbase vehicles in the U.S. it has nothing to do with what the consumer prefers.
 

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The blue concept that I posted earlier in this thread began life as a 2 dr JL and was completely modified to become what it is in those pictures. There’s a video floating around that has live footage of the vehicle as well as interviews with the team that built it. The concept was INCREDIBLY expensive.
I am very aware of the Mopar J6 concept vehicle and I and many others I know desperately want to buy one. It could be one of FCA's most versatile vehicles appealing to many demographics and could be used for all sorts of task.
 

aldo98229

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Look up CAFE regulations and you will learn the reason for the demise of small wheelbase vehicles in the U.S. it has nothing to do with what the consumer prefers.
It has EVERYTHING to do with consumer preferences. Just look at the sales data. CAFE does not force 85% of us to buy a 4-door over a 2-door Wrangler. Practicality, utility, and overall value do.
 

Dash68

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It has EVERYTHING to do with consumer preferences. Just look at the sales data. CAFE does not force 85% of us to buy a 4-door over a 2-door Wrangler. Practicality, utility, and overall value do.
Why did you buy your 2018 Fiat 124 Spider Abarth? Did you compare it with other vehicles that are not in its class if you researched it before you bought it?
 

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Any business that wants to succeed will prioritize what their market wants/needs. Regulations can't be avoided, but a manufacturer can choose to not jump through the hoops over a product that only caters to a small percentage of the marketplace.

Over the last couple decades, there's been an ever growing trend towards vehicles more capable than the average sedan/coupe. I speak of the average Joe family-minded commuter here. This high percentage of the driving public puts more value to ease of getting children and carseats in and out of the back and roominess for adults.

This trend is what killed the 2 door blazer, 2 door bronco, etc. Also, pickups used to only be driven by those who made a living with them. Back in the day, standard cabs with 8' beds were the norm. Nowadays, average joe in his quest to have capability when needed and to look rugged all the time has resulted in the quad cab/short bed combo being the main focus and reason why they dominate dealer lots.

I believe the iconic roots of the wrangler are the sole reason why 2 doors are still offered. True, many here and even more out in the world still prefer them and wouldn't have it any other way, but those numbers are steadily dropping and the manufacturers are keeping tabs on them. Even the bigger players in the aftermarket are becoming more and more reluctant to reach out too far for the 2 doors.

Point of the babble is that the consumer demand is what drives the direction that the manufacturer goes towards.
 

aldo98229

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Why did you buy your 2018 Fiat 124 Spider Abarth? Did you compare it with other vehicles that are not in its class if you researched it before you bought it?
That’s precisely my point. I bought a Fiat Spider, among other things, because I already owned a 4-door vehicle that took care of all my practicality and utility I need. The Spider is a fun “toy” more than anything else.

CAFE had nothing to do with me choosing a 4-door Wrangler or a 2-door roadster. The only place where CAFE factored in, was in my expectation that my JL would get 20 MPG, which it doesn’t.
 

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That’s precisely my point. I bought a Fiat Spider, among other things, because I already owned a 4-door vehicle that took care of all my practicality and utility I need. The Spider is a fun “toy” more than anything else.

CAFE had nothing to do with me choosing a 4-door Wrangler or a 2-door roadster. The only place where CAFE factored in, was in my expectation that my JL would get 20 MPG, which it doesn’t.
That is exactly my point as well. You are comparing sales of a 2 dr suv versus a 4 dr suv and applying the data to the mid sized pickup class. To me its like comparing the wrangler market to the sports car market. Its doesn't sound logical to me that all vehicles one day in the future will be 4 door suv's or crew cab short bed pickups as some are speculating. I to have other vehicles that take care of my particular needs and I will never have use again for a so-called "practical" crew cab short bed pickup truck as it fell short on excelling at any useful task besides being a replacement for the family sedan or suv. I love my JKUR as it has been very reliable and useful for my needs. The J6 would be my next fun "toy" version of your Spider so to say that a manufacturer wouldn't produce a mid sized 2 dr pickup because sales data shows that no one buys vehicles with 2 doors anymore dismisses the enthusiast buyer. I don't know how many units of the J6 FCA could sell a year if they offered it, but I do see the potential for it to appeal to other markets besides the off road enthusiast market. FCA has a huge opportunity to easily broaden its product offering based on the JL & JT platforms. Decades ago auto manufactures offered many configurations of models and managed to make money doing so. With modern design, manufacturing, and production methods it should be relatively simple and cost effective for FCA to offer a JLU XL as well as a J6 and even a J6 XC (extended cab).
 

aldo98229

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That is exactly my point as well. You are comparing sales of a 2 dr suv versus a 4 dr suv and applying the data to the mid sized pickup class. To me its like comparing the wrangler market to the sports car market. Its doesn't sound logical to me that all vehicles one day in the future will be 4 door suv's or crew cab short bed pickups as some are speculating. I to have other vehicles that take care of my particular needs and I will never have use again for a so-called "practical" crew cab short bed pickup truck as it fell short on excelling at any useful task besides being a replacement for the family sedan or suv. I love my JKUR as it has been very reliable and useful for my needs. The J6 would be my next fun "toy" version of your Spider so to say that a manufacturer wouldn't produce a mid sized 2 dr pickup because sales data shows that no one buys vehicles with 2 doors anymore dismisses the enthusiast buyer. I don't know how many units of the J6 FCA could sell a year if they offered it, but I do see the potential for it to appeal to other markets besides the off road enthusiast market. FCA has a huge opportunity to easily broaden its product offering based on the JL & JT platforms. Decades ago auto manufactures offered many configurations of models and managed to make money doing so. With modern design, manufacturing, and production methods it should be relatively simple and cost effective for FCA to offer a JLU XL as well as a J6 and even a J6 XC (extended cab).
Gawd. The Spider was such a sales success that FCA killed it after three model years.

Consumers were more open to buying 2-door vehicles in the past. Fiat sold a boatload of the original 1966-1987 Spider; the personal coupe was a trendy segment during the 1970s. Pickups were 2-doors; even SUVs had 2-doors. But those days are gone. Pickups now have 4 doors. Explorer and Cherokee are now 4-door only. Charger now has 4 doors. Wrangler has grown 2 doors. Blazer is now a 4-door. Bronco is coming back as a 4-door. Even Mustang is growing 2 doors.

There’s no appetite to push for a 2-door vehicle, in any shape or form, inside FCA or any other automaker. Unless it is a 2-door vehicle that already exists, with a well-established sales record, it is a career-limiting move.
 
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Dash68

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Gawd. The Spider was such a sales success that FCA killed it after three model years.

Consumers were more open to buying 2-door vehicles in the past. Fiat sold a boatload of the original 1966-1987 Spider; the personal coupe was a trendy segment during the 1970s. Pickups were 2-doors; even SUVs had 2-doors. But those days are gone. Pickups now have 4 doors. Explorer and Cherokee are now 4-door only. Charger now has 4 doors. Wrangler has grown 2 doors. Blazer is now a 4-door. Bronco is coming back as a 4-door. Even Mustang is growing 2 doors.

There’s no appetite to push for a 2-door vehicle, in any shape or form, inside FCA or any other automaker. Unless it is a 2-door vehicle that already exists, with a well-established sales record, it is a career-limiting move.
The Fiat dealer near me has a new 2019 sitting in there showroom now, they say I can buy the one in the showroom order a 2020 model.

Have you heard anything about the new Bronco being available in a 2 door?
 

aldo98229

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The Fiat dealer near me has a new 2019 sitting in there showroom now, they say I can buy the one in the showroom order a 2020 model.

Have you heard anything about the new Bronco being available in a 2 door?
Your dealer is off.

The plan was to cancel Spider everywhere and allow the car to continue in N.A. into 2020. But FCA ended its agreement with Mazda a few weeks ago. No 2020 were built, and none will be. All you can buy is whatever is left sitting in dealer lots. Last time I checked, there were only 40 Abarths with manual transmission left in the entire US, a similar number of automatics, and as many Classicas and Lussos.

I’ve heard so many things about Bronco my head is spinning. Every spy photo I have seen so far has been of a 4-door.
 
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Dash68

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Your dealer is off.

The plan was to cancel Spider everywhere and allow the car to continue in N.A. into 2020. But FCA ended its agreement with Mazda a few weeks ago. No 2020 were built, and none will be. All you can buy is whatever is left sitting in dealer lots. Last time I checked, there were only 40 Abarths with manual transmission left in the entire US, a similar number of automatics, and as many Classicas and Lussos.

I’ve heard so many things about Bronco my head is spinning. Every spy photo I have seen so far has been of a 4-door.
You are correct. They have three 2019 Spiders, all 6 speed automatics. Salesman doesn't know much about them and he still thinks he can order me a 2020. I checked another source and your discontinued in the U.S. info is confirmed. To bad 'cause it is a really nice little sports car.

Check out Bronco6G for spy shots of a camo 2 door bronco being tested off-road.
 

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