Fuel and oil refresh mode ?

[Studio31]

I am currently having the issue where the 4xe won't go into electric mode because of the FORM condition. For me it has been over a month and a half. I have brought it to a dealership and because the computer doesn't report that there are any errors, they say the vehicle is "Operating as Designed" and it's totally normal. Totally not normal for my 4xe to be getting 14 mpg when it is designed for over 40 mpg but they won't do anything. I have filled up many times and driven in ICE mode for well over the 20 minutes continuously which is the only recommendations they provide. Anyone have any other thoughts? I'm kind of stuck at this point.

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[mllcb42]

I am currently having the issue where the 4xe won't go into electric mode because of the FORM condition. For me it has been over a month and a half. I have brought it to a dealership and because the computer doesn't report that there are any errors, they say the vehicle is "Operating as Designed" and it's totally normal. Totally not normal for my 4xe to be getting 14 mpg when it is designed for over 40 mpg but they won't do anything. I have filled up many times and driven in ICE mode for well over the 20 minutes continuously which is the only recommendations they provide. Anyone have any other thoughts? I'm kind of stuck at this point.

Easy, quick solution: go get an oil change.

Less costly, more time required solution: You need to drive with the oil temp higher. The main issue here seems to be that the oil doesn't get hot enough in cold weather. Try to get it around 205 and then drive for 20ish minutes.

Third option: Drive to get it warm, oil temp over 185 or so. Then park and let it idle with the HVAC system turned off. Let it idle until it shuts itself off. 20-30 minutes. You're basically doing the same as above.

No guarantees that any of those will keep you out of FORM for a long period of time, particularly if it's cold and you do lots of short trips.


Also, the 4xe is not designed for or rated at over 40 mpg. It has a rating of 49 mpge, which is a different metric that only gives insight into how far it can go on an equivalent of 33.7 kwh of battery charge. ( 1 gallon of gas has an approximate equivalent energy storage of 33.7 kwh)

Do not think that mpg and mpge are the same thing or even conveying remotely the same piece of information.

 

[jahysea]

Another option is just reset the oil change interval. Obviously not ideal as: 1) with lots of hybrid driving you are relying on that for actual oil changes intervals and 2) the reason for heating the oil up is to burn fuel out of the oil that gets past the valves. If you just reset the vehicle assumes the oil is changed and turns FORM off.

I've read theory that you really don't need to get the oil quite that hot and Jeep over sensitized the vehicle here. If that's true and you are running the engine enough to burn the oil "clean" but the vehicle doesn't realize it then you could make your own mileage assumptions about oil change intervals and safely just reset every time FORM comes on.

I think there is more here, bad software and glitches. Mine has been in CHOC mode (even more irritating, see other threads, especially on 4xe forum) and recently went into FORM not long after I changed the oil. I went for a long drive, let it idle 30 mins and filled the tank and it didn't reset from FORM on it's own. So I reset the interval (again) and it went from 95% to 100% and turned FORM off. Jeep should have hardcoded it to not go into FORM if the oil life percentage is over some percentage and the fuel isn't particularly old.

I believe Jeep will eventually realize they have issues with both CHOC and FORM. They may not admit it publicly ever but they will eventually issue an RRT to fix the software. If they don't they are going to get in trouble like Volkswagen because they submitted all the stats and mileage paperwork based on a vehicle that actually ran on battery power a certain percentage of the time. More and more of us are now driving a vehicle that only gets a horsepower benefit from the hybrid drivetrain because the engine comes on every time we start the thing and stays on the whole time we operate it.

 

[mllcb42]

I've read theory that you really don't need to get the oil quite that hot and Jeep over sensitized the vehicle here. If that's true and you are running the engine enough to burn the oil "clean" but the vehicle doesn't realize it then you could make your own mileage assumptions about oil change intervals and safely just reset every time FORM comes on

I've seen the same theory discussed, but I'm yet to see any evidence to support it. What I have seen is people that have been stuck in form, after driving for a while at "normal" warm oil temperatures report a strong smell of gasoline in their oil, which would at least support the idea that they a) needed to be in FORM and b) the lower temps were not sufficient by themselves.

Now, going off of someone's nose isn't the most scientific test data. Would be far more telling to actually get some oil analysis performed to see how much fuel really is dissolved, but anecdotally, it seems to go against the theory that form is overly sensitive.

 

[MtgGuy99]

I got my 4XE yesterday, love it so far. However I’ve only put 20 miles on it or so, 30 miles on it in total and I was stuck in FORM all day today. I’m hoping it’s gone tomorrow. It seems really soon for this to be on already, doesn’t it? I also noticed my oil life is at 95%, seems like that’s quick too

 

[DocNau]

Having the same issue. I have had new oil, multiple new tanks of gas, two service appointments m, have run my car at >180 degrees for over 60 minutes and have a star case opened up. Today it started electric from my garage (~40 degrees). The minute that it hit 25 degrees on the senses temp it went to FORM.
The Jeep representatives have told me I bought a gas car, not electric. Yes , that’s a verbatim quote. Like I’m some sort of flipping moron. Totally dismissed the fact that the car is not operating as advertised.
inwould be interested in hearing people’s opinion on whether Jeep is advertising a product that they cannot deliver. This is sold as a PHEV that can run 26 miles pure electric. Not part of the year, but all the time. This is clearly not doing what they are selling. I think this is a set up for a lawsuit. You cannot get certified for a PHEV and get MPg certified and then not deliver to half the country for four months out of the year. It’s very reminiscent of the Volkswagen fiasco. I feel like this is something that needs more pressure from owners as well as the legal community. Ineeded this car for mostly the winter and as a daily driver during that time. Instead of a PHEV, I have a wrangler that’s taking a 600 pound battery around for no reason. Really disappointed.

 

[Rollcast]

Our 4xe has about 2500 miles (1400 electric, 1100 ICE). I got FORM'd three days ago. Temps were in the 50s, and I had put about 10 gal of gas in it on the day before so I was a little surprised it happened.

Today, I had to drive about 30 miles from home so I started out in E-save and tried keeping the temp up by using a lower gear and drafting behind other vehicles. I never got above 197 and FORM persisted.

In the end, it took about 30-35 minutes of idling with the oil temp >205 before it cleared itself. At least, I think it cleared itself. I drove about 30 miles tonight by using up electric first (about 20 miles or so) and no FORM. The message is gone and electric works.

 

[Newmanium]

I also have the same issue, been in FORM for past two months. Just sent it to the dealer.. if I have to worry about how long it idles at high oil temp, I’ll get rid of the car. Whole point was mostly electric with engine for longer drives, if I have to start babying this thing, no bueno.

 

[SpaceCase]

Ran my Jeep for over 30 minutes with oil temps over 210 and still could not get FORM to clear. Had FORM kick in with 95% oil life, again at 90%, and now at 85% and can't get this one to go away.

 

[sentience]

Yep. Same issue. Fuel and oil mode stuck on despite oil change, full refuel from gas warning light, and traveling more than 30 minutes (drive from Baltimore to DC, ~40 miles) Also, weather here is mild (40-60F this week).

This really should be a manually overridable option. Like others have said - this really defeats The point of purchasing a plug-in hybrid.

Hey @JeepCares, could you kindly pass that feedback back to the 4xe engineers? I’m sure this is going to be a more common issue as more electrified plug-in models come online.

 

[mllcb42]

Fuel and oil mode stuck on despite oil change, full refuel from gas warning light, and traveling more than 30 minutes (drive from Baltimore to DC, ~40 miles) Also, weather here is mild (40-60F this week).

If yours is stuck on after an oil change (and the oil monitor was reset... I've seen people do oil changes without resetting this, which is what actually resets things in the computer) along with the others, then you've got more going on that just the normal FORM algorithm limiting your use.

This really should be a manually overridable option

The problem there is that FORM exists for a good reason and you'd have people overriding it anytime it was an inconvenience, even when totally justified and necessary.

 

[sentience]

If yours is stuck on after an oil change (and the oil monitor was reset... I've seen people do oil changes without resetting this, which is what actually resets things in the computer) along with the others, then you've got more going on that just the normal FORM algorithm limiting your use.



The problem there is that FORM exists for a good reason and you'd have people overriding it anytime it was an inconvenience, even when totally justified and necessary.

This is silly. Traction control exists for a good reason. There is also a clear and obvious override for it.

 

[BXFXJeep]

not exactly sure what is going on with the FORM thing

But I am in Toronto and only when the temp dips to below -10c, it may tend to run in Hybrid and do not allow the Electric only option.

Also the few times it will run in Electric only around -10c or lower the battery depletes pretty quickly, so you are getting about 1/2 the range, which isn't really worth it to just deplete the battery, it's best to let it just run in hybrid.

After about 3 months with my 4xe, and much fiddling, I just let it do it's thing, mainly because I do not have a home charger, and forcing it to run in Electric only on cold days, just means the battery is depleting too quickly and there isn't much savings at that point vs gas and the aggravation of charging.

Talk to Tesla people also, they are not too happy with their lost of range in the deep freeze.

However I am quite happy with the way the 4xe works, and I really only have to deal with deep freeze issues about 30 days of the year.

Remember, the 4xe is a PHEV, not a BEV, so we should not be expecting to run on pure electric when it does not make sense.

 

[mllcb42]

This is silly. Traction control exists for a good reason. There is also a clear and obvious override for it.

You really think that people wouldn't go "screw it, I want it to run how I want" and just press the button every time?

Look at the amount of people in these discussions that find out resetting the oil monitor kicks you out of FORM that do it over and over again, despite being told repeatedly that it's risking their engines. They literally have a method for manually overriding and choose to do so, even with the knowledge that it's risking severe engine damage.

 

[Newmanium]

Dealer said no codes, they have no clue. I’ll try the leaving it at red line for an hour in the driveway and see if that cleans it out

I don’t have an issue with it requiring the engine when it’s below freezing, but today it’s 65 and still not working.

Growing pains with the electric adoption, I’m sure they’ll eventually fix but would be nice if they retrofit an update for existing owners. Should be a mode you can enable to refresh oil in the driveway.

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