Front LCA torque - Jack stands

[limeade]

Does anyone use Blue LocTite on their LCA bolts/nuts? Never heard of anyone doing that, but whondered if it would help prevent thread loosening. Obviously, it would not prevent loosening / play caused by bushing wear, but I mean prevent loosening of the threads.

I prefer to use anti-seize on suspension bolts.

Sponsored

 

[kah.mun.rah]

This is the correct answer. There is no difference in the sprung weight of the vehicle whether it's on the tires or if the axles are supported by jack stands. I've done this multiple times and with many different vehicles. It works very well to gain a lot of clearance to torque the suspension bolts.

You don't want to put the jack stands under the frame rails though.

Actually wrong for two reasons. 1) Torquing a bolt while on jack stands increases the odds of the vehicle falling off the stands. 2) More than the weight, the more important thing is to torque the control arm bushings when they are at their natural drive angle. Unless you are using 4 stands at the same time to make it level, it could twist the bushings when level.

 

[WillysMeow]

Always torque suspension fasteners while entire weight of vehicle is on the wheels and level. Front and rear AXLES on jackstands is fine as long as level, be very careful not to pull/push on wrenches in such a way as to knock the Jeep off the stands. I've done this before and works fine if you're careful, however I do not make it a practice.

As stated front LCA bolts are 190ft/lbs at frame and axle (both ends).

I use a jack under the torque wrench to get the 190# with the limited clearance of Jeep on the wheels.

Interesting, good idea that I've never used, but when there's not much room to swing a wrench and get arms in proper position, reaching proper torque settings can be a pita.

 

[bd100]

Had some LCA skids. The kind which wrap around and the bolt goes through the skid then the LCA mount. Problem I had is they'd keep loosening and then squeak. Could be that I had course thread bolts instead of fine thread. Or maybe not enough torque, but 190 is hard enough to apply as it is. Or the fact that the skids resist compression and prevent full torque on the LCA bushings.

I wish they'd make these skids such that one side was a stack of washers through a larger hole, allowing the clamping force to bypass the skid while still holding up that side.

I tried blue thread lock on the shock skids. Seems to not help, in that they loosen up eventually anyhow. But don't quote me on that, all I know is the knock comes back after a while. Some day I'll take them off and drill out the hole on one side for a stack of washers to transfer the clamping force to the bushing. If this works well then I'll retry the front LCA skids as well.

 

[SoK66]

Actually wrong for two reasons. 1) Torquing a bolt while on jack stands increases the odds of the vehicle falling off the stands. 2) More than the weight, the more important thing is to torque the control arm bushings when they are at their natural drive angle. Unless you are using 4 stands at the same time to make it level, it could twist the bushings when level.

The axle will be at the correct angles if supported by jack stands.

 

[kah.mun.rah]

The axle will be at the correct angles if supported by jack stands.

Only if you are using 4.

 

[WillysMeow]

Only if you are using 4.

And level.

 

[Zandcwhite]

The bushings need to be near ride height, but it's not nearly as critical as some are making it out to be. Level would imply I can't torque them in the driveway because it has a slight slope. 25 years and more than a dozen Jeeps disagree. If it was as critical as implied, you'd need to retorque with varrying loads. Squatted in the back because you're loaded with camping gear? Better loosen and retorque. Front end sagged a half inch with the new winch install? Better retorque. Taking several large buddies on a hunting trip? Just sit in here for awhile while I retorque. Weight on the suspension is all that matters. Sure if you jack the front axle up 3' with the rear on the tires it could be off enough from ride height to matter, but if the front end is on stands and 6" higher than the rear, it's still close enough. Odds are that front axle is compressed an extra 1/4" in that scenario. Meaningless.

 

[jadmt]

The bushings need to be near ride height, but it's not nearly as critical as some are making it out to be. Level would imply I can't torque them in the driveway because it has a slight slope. 25 years and more than a dozen Jeeps disagree. If it was as critical as implied, you'd need to retorque with varrying loads. Squatted in the back because you're loaded with camping gear? Better loosen and retorque. Front end sagged a half inch with the new winch install? Better retorque. Taking several large buddies on a hunting trip? Just sit in here for awhile while I retorque. Weight on the suspension is all that matters. Sure if you jack the front axle up 3' with the rear on the tires it could be off enough from ride height to matter, but if the front end is on stands and 6" higher than the rear, it's still close enough. Odds are that front axle is compressed an extra 1/4" in that scenario. Meaningless.

amen..

 

[SoK66]

And level.

Nope, the rear wheel rotation still puts the supported fronts in the right plane. What matters is the vehicle weight support. Doesn’t matter if it’s on its tires or the axle is sitting on the stands.

 

[WillysMeow]

Nope, the rear wheel rotation still puts the supported fronts in the right plane. What matters is the vehicle weight support. Doesn’t matter if it’s on its tires or the axle is sitting on the stands.

Don't think you understood me, vehicle should be level (whether on stands , the ground or a lift) so as to provide proper load on all suspension components before tightening and torquing the bolts.

 

[SoK66]

Don't think you understood me, vehicle should be level (whether on stands , the ground or a lift) so as to provide proper load on all suspension components before tightening and torquing the bolts.

No, I understood you. However it is irrelevant if the jack stands are at reasonably close to ride level. What matters is the vehicle weight loading the axle.

As the vehicle goes down the road, as loads change constantly the bushings are always in a state of tension to one degree or other. In fact, if you did as you suggest th minute you sit in the vehicle you put a load on the bushings.

This is the same sort of argument we hear over centering the vehicle over the axles with track bars & brackets. The axles are constantly shifting slightly side to side as they articulate. Obsessively fussing over perfectly centering the axles under the frame is unnecessary. In fact Jeep staggers the axles in an unloaded state to compensate for driver, passenger and cargo loads.

 

[WillysMeow]

@SoK66 Ah ok, I prefer to be as close as possible, but a couple degrees off level is not going to be the end of everything.

 

[kah.mun.rah]

The bushings need to be near ride height, but it's not nearly as critical as some are making it out to be. Level would imply I can't torque them in the driveway because it has a slight slope. 25 years and more than a dozen Jeeps disagree. If it was as critical as implied, you'd need to retorque with varrying loads. Squatted in the back because you're loaded with camping gear? Better loosen and retorque. Front end sagged a half inch with the new winch install? Better retorque. Taking several large buddies on a hunting trip? Just sit in here for awhile while I retorque. Weight on the suspension is all that matters. Sure if you jack the front axle up 3' with the rear on the tires it could be off enough from ride height to matter, but if the front end is on stands and 6" higher than the rear, it's still close enough. Odds are that front axle is compressed an extra 1/4" in that scenario. Meaningless.

Torquing when the Jeep is level (or perpendicular to the ground) isn't a matter of being "critical", it's just best practice. Just like checking tire pressure when the tire is cold vs hot.

 

[grimmjeeper]

You want the Jeep to be mostly level. The jack stands should be close to the height off the ground as you get if it were on the tires. Though if you have the front and rear axles on jack stands that are all 4 set to the same height, you're good to go, no matter what that height is.

This assumes you're on level ground.

The thing is, it doesn't have to be exact. Just close. Most driveways have a little bit of slope to them which affects how level the Jeep really is. But as long as you're close to level with the weight on the axles, you're fine.

Sponsored