FRAM Ultra @20K Miles

[The Last Cowboy]

What is the risk? I done this with multiple Ultra filters on different vehicles and have had zero issues. I am always puzzled by the thoughts around using a filter for its rated FCI.

I get that you are trying to maximize the advertised maximum life cycle, but 20k miles is a long time, unless you are logging easy highway miles at 5k plus miles a month. For $10, two minutes and 1/4 qt of make up oil you're on your way.

Just kinda hard to wrap my hear around with all the other maintenance you're doing, along with dumping synthetic at just 5k miles. I do 7,500 mile full synthetic oil/filer changes.

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[OllieChristopher]

As long as you are aware of the risks involved by not changing filter then all is good. You are tripling the chance of destroying your motor by waiting 20K to change a filter. We had a employee who did this back in the 90's. $50,000 Volvo engine threw a rod all because of the filter clogging and bypass failing.

I personally would not risk it. Not my vehicle though. BTW, that filter is is really really dark and looks like it was about to crumple.

 

[CarbonSteel]

I get that you are trying to maximize the advertised maximum life cycle, but 20k miles is a long time, unless you are logging easy highway miles at 5k plus miles a month. For $10, two minutes and 1/4 qt of make up oil you're on your way.

Just kinda hard to wrap my hear around with all the other maintenance you're doing, along with dumping synthetic at just 5k miles. I do 7,500 mile full synthetic oil/filer changes.

Ever test the oil to see how healthy it is? I have, countless times. Rotella Gas Truck is not a long drain oil. I am basing my maintenance on data and facts, not emotions (not saying you are) and am confident in what I am doing.

 

[Retrograde]

Fram Ulra is probably the best oil filter on the market right now. ...

Huh... I'm so old I remember when Fram filters were so bad that if you used one in your new vehicle it voided the warranty. When did that change?

 

[CarbonSteel]

As long as you are aware of the risks involved by not changing filter then all is good. You are tripling the chance of destroying your motor by waiting 20K to change a filter. We had a employee who did this back in the 90's. $50,000 Volvo engine threw a rod all because of the filter clogging and bypass failing.

I personally would not risk it. Not my vehicle though. BTW, that filter is is really really dark and looks like it was about to crumple.

LOL...you would have difficulty pulling it apart with pliers. It in no way is about to crumple--the media is mesh backed.

I am basing my decisions on data, would love to see the math behind "tripling the chance of destroying your motor".

 

[CarbonSteel]

Huh... I'm so old that I remember that Fram filters were so bad that if you used one in your new vehicle it voided the warranty. When did that change?

Years ago--the FRAM Ultra is the best filter on the market today.

 

[OllieChristopher]

Ever test the oil to see how healthy it is?

Quit doing that in the 90's after a blown up engine and oil analyses was sent out. Blackstone oil analysis showed no anomaly's or anything out of the ordinary. Oil sample came back normal and yet engine threw a rod and crank bearings were all toasted.

Blackstone lab tests are only good as a very rough base guideline in determining oil health not engine health. The tests are more costly than the oil change so what is the purpose? Just to prove a point?

As anyone knows the only real way to determine how much wear and potential damage is to tear the motor down.

I am basing my decisions on data, would love to see the math behind "tripling the chance of destroying your motor".

Your data is very flawed. It's similar to a wing suit flier who relies on the odds and so called accurate "wind data" to fly canyons. Well we all know how that ends.

My math is basic common sense of changing a filter every 5,000 miles. If I left it in for 20,000 miles I'm tripling the chance of something going wrong. Even fleet big rigs that go 20K between oil changes replace the filter every 5K or so (at least my companies did).

I have seen first hand what lack of maintenance does inside of motors. This for an extra 5 minutes of labor and 10.00 filter?

Meaning no disrespect to you, but you are taking very unnecessary risks to save just a few bucks. Again it's your vehicle so do as you wish.

 

[OllieChristopher]

Why? $30 more for oil filters keep you from eating? Buying diapers for kids? Paying house payment? Seriously WHY?

I think it's to prove a point that the engine still runs. I want to see these intervals after the engine has 300,000 miles on it. I doubt it will last that long with this kind of abuse.

 

[CarbonSteel]

Quit doing that in the 90's after a blown up engine and oil analyses was sent out. Blackstone oil analysis showed no anomaly's or anything out of the ordinary. Oil sample came back normal and yet engine threw a rod and crank bearings were all toasted.

Blackstone lab tests are only good as a very rough base guideline in determining oil health not engine health. The tests are more costly than the oil change so what is the purpose? Just to prove a point?

As anyone knows the only real way to determine how much wear and potential damage is to tear the motor down.



Your data is very flawed. It's similar to a wing suit flier who relies on the odds and so called accurate "wind data" to fly canyons. Well we all know how that ends.

My math is basic common sense of changing a filter every 5,000 miles. If I left it in for 20,000 miles I'm tripling the chance of something going wrong. Even fleet big rigs that go 20K between oil changes replace the filter every 5K or so (at least my companies did).

I have seen first hand what lack of maintenance does inside of motors. This for an extra 5 minutes of labor and 10.00 filter?

Meaning no disrespect to you, but you are taking very unnecessary risks to save just a few bucks. Again it's your vehicle so do as you wish.

Really? How is it flawed? Be specific.

I have UOAs giving me the exact health of the oil. I have an oil filter that is guaranteed for 20K miles which means there is a safety factor built into it.

I fail to see how my data is flawed. Enlighten me.

 

[CarbonSteel]

I think it's to prove a point that the engine still runs. I want to see these intervals after the engine has 300,000 miles on it. I doubt it will last that long with this kind of abuse.

Oh please. What abuse? The oil is being changed every 5K miles which is less than what most of you are doing. The oil filter is in perfect shape as designed, what abuse are we talking about?

 

[The Last Cowboy]

Ever test the oil to see how healthy it is? I have, countless times. Rotella Gas Truck is not a long drain oil. I am basing my maintenance on data and facts, not emotions (not saying you are) and am confident in what I am doing.

Yeah, I used to actually have a problem with going to BITOG too much, now I just lurk and see how the engines I have do with the oil and filters I like, via other peoples UOAs. Right now I'm a Pennzoil Platinum and Fram Ultra guy. I was using only Wix filters for years, but the Ultra won me over. Switched from Mobil1 to PP about 12 years ago. Zero, I mean Zero issues in any engine I have ran it in.

I used to work with a guy who sold Amsoil. He was big on it. He got quite a few guys in on it and they were all bragging about how much better their vehicles ran and how much better the protection was. The guy who was selling it proudly proclaimed that he was going to run it to 25k miles, as advertised. He had a Dodge Ram 1500 with a Magnum 318, a fairly simple and reliable engine. He almost made to 25k, spun a bearing and threw a rod at 23k and some change. He tore his engine down and said that it looked like crap inside. No more Amsoil talk from him.

 

[OllieChristopher]

Really? How is it flawed? Be specific.

I have UOAs giving me the exact health of the oil. I have an oil filter that is guaranteed for 20K miles which means there is a safety factor built into it.

I fail to see how my data is flawed. Enlighten me.

Oh please. What abuse? The oil is being changed every 5K miles which is less than what most of you are doing. The oil filter is in perfect shape as designed, what abuse are we talking about?

FWIW, I change my oil and filters every 3,000 miles. I have two 20+ year old Lexus's, a 16 year old GMC truck and had various other trucks and cars with over 300,000 miles on the odometer. Dozens of small 25kw to 150kw generators with 20,000+ hrs doing the every 200 hour oil and filter change. Every one of them with same engine nothing more than water pumps and timing belts (Lexus's) replaced.

No science, data or anything other than my own analytical experience. Take it for what it's worth.

It's cool man. No matter what proof or what anyone says your mind is made up. So carry on and enjoy your 20K cheap filter changes. All I can do is share my experience just as you share yours.

 

[CarbonSteel]

FWIW, I change my oil and filters every 3,000 miles. I have two 20+ year old Lexus's, a 16 year old GMC truck and had various other trucks and cars with over 300,000 miles on the odometer. Dozens of small 25kw to 150kw generators with 20,000+ hrs doing the every 200 hour oil and filter change. Every one of them with same engine nothing more than water pumps and timing belts (Lexus's) replaced.

No science, data or anything other than my own analytical experience. Take it for what it's worth.

It's cool man. No matter what proof or what anyone says your mind is made up. So carry on and enjoy your 20K cheap filter changes. All I can do is share my experience just as you share yours.

I respect your thoughts and routines, but no one has offered up proof of anything other than disbelief and anecdotal experience from 30 years ago--a lot has changed since then not the least of which is oil and filter quality.

At a time when most OEMs are touting 10K oil changes with some recommending filter changes every other oil change, my 5K oil changes with 20K oil filter changes should be of no consequence, in fact in accordance with some OEM recommendations, I am more than in line.

The FRAM Ultra is a seriously overbuilt filter with synthetic media that filters better than cellulose ever will and is fully supported by mesh backing.

 

[Dyolfknip74]

Meh...that is not a concern for me. The FRAM Ultra has backed media so the chances of rupturing are next to nil and if it did and caused an issue FRAM has a warranty and the Magnuson–Moss Warranty Act would be in full play here as well.

I would be concerned about using a cellulose filter like a Mopar for longer than 1 OC because it could rupture, the same for AC Delco. There are only two filters on the market (that I have seen) which have backed media and that is the FRAM Ultra and the Purolator Boss.

@DanW - tore a FRAM Ultra apart a while back:

https://www.jlwranglerforums.com/fo...s-to-wring-its-filters-out.49733/post-1218917

I have no poker in the fire regarding the subject but it's funny, people will quote the Magnuson–Moss Warranty Act like they can just utter the words at the dealership and all will be well.

Everyone knows what it covers and how its supposed to work, unfortunately, if the dealer wants to shitcan a particular warranty, they will. Then the honus is on the customer to prove them wrong, notwithstanding what the act says. If a service manager or dealership digs their heels in, you're bent over and just expected to take it.

 

[roaniecowpony]

This is devolving rapidly into a BITOG discussion. But, we all have our ways and habits. I don't necessarily need the best filter or best oil on the market. Just one that's good. I don't keep my vehicles 300,000 miles nor would want one with 300,000 miles on it. IMO, the vehicle would most likely be a POS by then, regardless of the engine condition. In a world where any brand name oil with the vehicle mfrs spec is met and the filter is either OEM or better, I'm more concerned with radiator fluid changes.

And for the record, I don't believe filtration in an engine gets better and better as the filter gets more and more contaminated. The bypass just opens sooner. That means NO filtration. That old filter argument is and was BS ages ago.

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