Automatic vs. Manual Sales Split

[azwjowner]

I also have owned a number of motorcycles and mt vehicles. I actually think the ideal manual would be a dog box sequential like a motorcycle (and many racing vehicles). Sadly I think the chance to get acceptance for that has long passed.

Motor trend tested the gladiator 3.6 auto and manual and found the manual faster, and autos still have greater losses due to moving fluid around and the torque converter. I would bet I do a decent job keeping the jeep where it needs to be efficient. In fact, that's one issue with autos. I can run low rpm and high throttle (where it's most efficient) since I don't have to worry about signaling a downshift.

I've never had a manual that I wasn't able to beat epa rated mpg. I currently get 21 average on 33s (mixed driving).

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[PatrickR]

This is what we all need:

? That thing is awesome!

 

[STW]

Notice how a lot of AT owners just want to bash the decision to buy an MT. I drove the MT and AT and bought the MT, I can't quantify why but I liked it better. Not every decision requires in-depth analysis, sometimes folks just go with what they "like better".

we must be reading different threads.

I hear people bashing the specific MT used in the JL for whatever problems it seems to have, but I don't hear anyone bashing people for preferring to drive a manual transmission.

I certainly don't hear anyone bashing manual transmissions in general or the people who drive them. Maybe I missed a post of some knucklehead?

We do frequently see people claim on these threads that anyone who chooses the AT is not capable of driving an MT, and other feeble insults. I've been assuming those comments come from people who can't form a coherent argument.

Certainly there have been many great manual transmissions in Jeeps over the years. Plus, the automatic transmissions used in Jeeps used to suck in various ways that the current ZF 8sp does not, so back then that was also a reason to choose the manual--it was usually a superior component then.

Driving the JL with it's current manual, whatever it's faults/risks, makes sense to me if only for keeping faith with the MT Jeep tradition. I just wasn't willing to miss out on a great AT just for that reason.

 

[jbcrane]

For whatever reason, I find myself eating ice cream cones often in my manuals. No problems. Just have to limit it to 2 scoops to prevent detachment of ice cream from cone during shifts and then between shifts watch that the melt-off doesn't drip onto one's hand.

You mean the rapid, unplanned dismount of ice cream from cone.

 

[FRV]

Oh I think this is mostly all in good fun, at least for me. I have made a few snarky comments but in jest. I don't care what anyone drives. Drive what you like and like what you drive...even if I don't understand how any man could choose an AT for a Jeep....

Come on...I'm kidding!

 

[wibornz]

LOL I would concur with your assessment.

However I learned to drive on a Ford 9 N 1959 tractor? I’ve been driving manuals all my life. Offroad, Europe, Asia, Latin America, Hawaii, and more I can make a manual short wheelbase jeep dance, and I’ve lead more runs in Moab on 7+ trails than most people have got going to work.

That said, I’ve seen more automatic transmissions fail in Moab, and other trails around the world than I ever have seen standard transmissions and clutches fail.

So you are not like most manual drivers.

 

[wibornz]

Right. Any grandmother can drive an auto when the going gets tough.

And why is that?

 

[wibornz]

What I think is funny is when someone thinks driving a manual is something special and claim that most people are not capable of driving a manual. Like it is some secret reserved skill that only a few can master. When in reality anyone can learn how to drive one in about five minutes in a parking lot with a decent teacher.
The kids today can’t drive a manual rant. Like some kid that can run a game controller with twenty buttons doing complex combinations while texting and talking on a headset can’t master a clutch and a shifter.

 

[BuyHold]

My 2 door Wrangler is not only manual, but it is also a soft top, which is even more rare in my part of the US (Northeast).

Please tell me you also drive with the windshield down.

 

[azwjowner]

What I think is funny is when someone thinks driving a manual is something special and claim that most people are not capable of driving a manual. Like it is some secret reserved skill that only a few can master. When in reality anyone can learn how to drive one in about five minutes in a parking lot with a decent teacher.
The kids today can’t drive a manual rant. Like some kid that can run a game controller with twenty buttons doing complex combinations while texting and talking on a headset can’t master a clutch and a shifter.

This is all true, but life is filled with instances where the skill in question isn't actually that hard to master but the distinction lies in those who have the motivation to learn versus those who don't. The capability is in having the mental attitude, not the actual capability for the skill.

 

[Omarius]

This is my exceedingly rare pile with the manual transmission. While I do think burning your jeep down or turning the flywheel into a grenade is really owner's fault, I do think there are plenty of things horribly wrong with the manual transmission...let's see:

1. Geared way too long on the non-rubicon trims. I have not used 6th gear in the last year of ownership.

2. Rev hang. When you go from full throttle to no throttle at high rpms, the ecu will maintain full throttle long after your foot has left the go pedal. This basically makes for inadvertent power shifting (which will likely lead to accelerated clutch wear).

3. Anti-lug software. The engine is unluggable, i.e. if you request 100 percent throttle at 1500 rpm, you will only get some prescribed amount of throttle that will prevent the engine from lugging. I wouldn't be surprised if you truly didn't get 100 percent throttle until you were north of 4k rpm. While this might be seen as a "feature" by some, it really exacerbates the gutless feel of the 3.6, and pretty sure it's not optimized since we're dealing with FCA engineers here.

4. No Drivetrain feel whatsoever. No feel from the clutch, no feel from the cable operated shifter, no feel from the overly isolated engine, no sound from the exhaust.

Not surprising that people would choose the Automatic, it definitely makes more sense for the average person. Not to say that it's perfect, definitely not the ZF tuned by BMW that's for sure.

Honestly, I don't like a single drivetrain combo on the Jeep, except for the 392 , which I would have bought if it didn't come as a station wagon. The ideal setup would be a 2 door 5.7 hemi, tremec 6 speed that is not cable operated. We can dream I suppose.

 

[2nd 392]

This is my exceedingly rare pile with the manual transmission. While I do think burning your jeep down or turning the flywheel into a grenade is really owner's fault, I do think there are plenty of things horribly wrong with the manual transmission...let's see:

1. Geared way too long on the non-rubicon trims. I have not used 6th gear in the last year of ownership.

2. Rev hang. When you go from full throttle to no throttle at high rpms, the ecu will maintain full throttle long after your foot has left the go pedal. This basically makes for inadvertent power shifting (which will likely lead to accelerated clutch wear).

3. Anti-lug software. The engine is unluggable, i.e. if you request 100 percent throttle at 1500 rpm, you will only get some prescribed amount of throttle that will prevent the engine from lugging. I wouldn't be surprised if you truly didn't get 100 percent throttle until you were north of 4k rpm. While this might be seen as a "feature" by some, it really exacerbates the gutless feel of the 3.6, and pretty sure it's not optimized since we're dealing with FCA engineers here.

4. No Drivetrain feel whatsoever. No feel from the clutch, no feel from the cable operated shifter, no feel from the overly isolated engine, no sound from the exhaust.

Not surprising that people would choose the Automatic, it definitely makes more sense for the average person. Not to say that it's perfect, definitely not the ZF tuned by BMW that's for sure.

Honestly, I don't like a single drivetrain combo on the Jeep, except for the 392 , which I would have bought if it didn't come as a station wagon. The ideal setup would be a 2 door 5.7 hemi, tremec 6 speed that is not cable operated. We can dream I suppose.

This guy likes it as much as we do ………..Proper torque management = ?

but I gotta give you an A-, correct 5.7 in the last sentence with 392 and your grade will improve to an A. ?

 

[Mudduck]

This is all true, but life is filled with instances where the skill in question isn't actually that hard to master but the distinction lies in those who have the motivation to learn versus those who don't. The capability is in having the mental attitude, not the actual capability for the skill.

Most people just drive what they want to drive. Has nothing to do with motivation to learn stick shift or ability to drive stick shift. I think the sales numbers of Auto VS Stick are a direct reflection of that. If the demand was there, the so would the Manuals be.

its a silly argument altogether. I have an ice maker, you don't. you fill up ice trays, I push a button. We both get ice either way. I just spend less time dicking around to do it.

 

[ViperJon]

This is all true, but life is filled with instances where the skill in question isn't actually that hard to master but the distinction lies in those who have the motivation to learn versus those who don't. The capability is in having the mental attitude, not the actual capability for the skill.

Perhaps but this is certainly not one of them it's idiotic. Where is the motivation to learn a so called "skill" that 99.9% of people will never EVER use. Are you a whiz at playing Xbox games like Fortnite as well as a 12 year old can? No? .....you slacker...no motivation?? You can't do something most preteens can do easily. I'll bet those damn kids don't know how to use an abacus either.

 

[wibornz]

This is all true, but life is filled with instances where the skill in question isn't actually that hard to master but the distinction lies in those who have the motivation to learn versus those who don't. The capability is in having the mental attitude, not the actual capability for the skill.

More like the lack of opportunities. There just is not that many manual transmission vehicles around for them learn on. Every kid that has the opportunity to learn how to ride a motorcycle learns out to operate a manual transmission. You can find kids all over the US that are out racing motorcycles and ATVs with zero issues. Heck every farm kid is able to drive a manual transmission tractor at a young age.

All the elitist mentality that people throw because they drive a manual is just hilarious.

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