Thinking about 4Xe

[ormandj]

4Xe’s spotty reliability. Roughly half of those on here LOVE their 4Xe; the other half doesn’t. That’s not an acceptable ratio to me. Especially because my local Jeep dealer is completely useless. I’d be totally screwed if I ended stuck having those sons of bitches work on my Jeep

Don’t use a forum full of anti-EV folks as a litmus test. All Jeeps have relatively poor reliability. A forum is always going to be full of people with problems, who comes to post about how great everything is?

Your second statement, however, has more meaning. One thing is true of the PHEV variants, if you do have an issue with the PHEV parts, you will be dealing with your local dealership, and they may still be struggling to deal with vehicles that have been out for years now. There’s no excuse for any dealer to not know how to do most work on PHEVs now with the relatively massive number sold, but some seem to be full of mechanics and managers who refuse to read their internal documentation.

Just don’t think avoiding the 4XE is going to avoid potential issues, the 3.6s haven’t had the best track record, and all the rest of the Jeep is a coin flip. You may very well end up at your beloved dealership either direction you end up going.

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[MATTYs]

Happy to hear you miss the wrangler so much that you're (already) considering one!

I'd suggest that if you go with a 4xe (the lease deals are really appealing!), refrain from "emotionally attaching" yourself too much to it/modding it too much until the warranty is over. Maybe think of it as the Jeep's trial period, if it behaves it gets to stay with you, if it doesn't it gets shipped back to FCA. So, make sure any mods are cheap and invisible, or are easily reversed.

You won't know if you got a lemon right away, and if you get one you should have plans to have alternate means of transportation - don't rely on Jeep providing a loaner/paying for a rental. I really hope you go for the 4xe, don't get a lemon and enjoy it for a long time!

And if you have to lemon-law it, do it swiftly and without mercy - don't be like me and let yourself be fooled by FCA and drag out the process for months.

what was your lemon law experience? Going through it now with my 4XE

 

[aldo98229]

Don’t use a forum full of anti-EV folks as a litmus test. All Jeeps have relatively poor reliability. A forum is always going to be full of people with problems, who comes to post about how great everything is?

Perhaps. But I’ve never seen a group as upset as those who have run into issues with their 4Xe.

You may very well end up at your beloved dealership either direction you end up going.

Which is why I ended getting rid of all my CDJR vehicles.

Even now, as I start looking at Jeeps once again, I stop as soon I remember that I don’t want to deal with those SOBs.

 

[Bill_BCNtoNY]

what was your lemon law experience? Going through it now with my 4XE

happy to chat - text/call me at 6468988949 if you want!

I wrote this summary of my experience when I was about to surrender it back to Stellantis, FWIW:

“I also wanted to avoid lawyers; in hindsight I think this sped it up a bit but I also believe (have no proof) the amount I was offered was less.

Not sure how standard this is, but I can talk to my experience:

(1) Once the criteria for the buyback were met (varies by state), I had to open a case by calling Jeep Cares.

(2) Someone from the “retention team” reached out via email and on the phone, and asked me to provide some documentation (fairly straightforward). Also, they tried to convince to keep the Jeep and some $$$ as compensation. They wanted me to renounce my right to a buyback before telling me the $$$ amount for a cash & keep though, which I refused.

(3) After 6 weeks of back in forth on that, all via email since I wanted it in writing as I saw the way this was going, my case manager finally transferred my case to the actual buyback team.

(4) The buyback team contacted me on via email and asked for the documentation, and within 2/3 weeks they sent me an offer to repurchase that was for the full amount of the Jeep minus the taxes, as required in my state’s regs (I think, am no lawyer).

(5) After me pressing rhat I wanted to know my options before making a decision, they told me as well how much $$$ they’d offer if I kept my Jeep. Amount didn’t make sense to me and I signed the buyback letter on 3/2 (about ~15 weeks since mid-November).

(6) waiting on next steps from them, as of today 3/4, and I’m slowly preparing my Jeep for the return.”

 

[ormandj]

Perhaps. But I’ve never seen a group as negative as those who have had issues with their 4Xe.

Better not go check out Bronco forums, then!

Just out of curiosity, with how bad your local dealership is, is going to a different dealership not an option? I’ve got 6 or 7 within 30 minutes, and half of them are fairly decent as far as dealerships go. Are there any others within an hour?

 

[aldo98229]

Better not go check out Bronco forums, then!

Just out of curiosity, with how bad your local dealership is, is going to a different dealership not an option? I’ve got 6 or 7 within 30 minutes, and half of them are fairly decent as far as dealerships go. Are there any others within an hour?

Mine is the northernmost dealership in the state. The Canada border is 20 miles north of here, so there are no more US dealers in that direction. To the east are the Cascade Mountains, which are mostly uninhabited; to the west is the Pacific Ocean. So my only options are 60-120 miles south towards Seattle and Tacoma.

I haven’t dealt with every single dealer down there, but the few experiences I’ve had ranged from mediocre to poor.

I’ve been the happy owner of CDJR vehicles for 35+ years, but I just can’t find a decent dealer any more. It is a pretty sad state of affairs.

 

[Jebiruph]

Yeah. That's what I am leaning towards.

There is a 2022 Willys Sport 6-speed, soft top, with 2,700 miles at a dealer near me. I am waiting for the weather to abate so I can go check it out.

That will have an active recall on the clutch. If I was looking for a used Wrangler with a manual transmission, I would be looking for a JK due to the clutch implementation, transmission gearing, axles and gearing, no auto stop/start and the power adder friendlier lower compression 3.6.

Edit to add better steering and throttle feel.

 

[wranglerbro]

Aldo, nice to see you hanging around here still! Mini Cooper’s are super fun to drive, but so are Jeeps and the places they can take you (as you well know).

As one of the early adopters of this 4xe platform, I’ve learned a lot. Mostly good, some bad. The bad: I had to have a battery replaced because a tech screwed up applying a software update and bricked it in 2022. Those are growing pains of new tech, but they fixed it promptly and I got a brand new battery. No harm no foul.

The good: it hasn’t let me down once off-road, especially at high elevation. It’s still a Jeep and has taken me/my family to places that have created incredible memories. The torque is amazing, even with 37s, running trails in silence is so cool, and around town, I rarely have to fill up. I’m grateful Jeep provides so many engine options today that can uniquely fit the needs of its customers.

FWIW: I’m much less worried today than when I bought it. I still get to wrench my Jeep, but the battery tech/system is something I will never touch. Thankfully Jeep warrantied the battery and associated equipment for 10 years.

With 4xe’s becoming the predominant Jeep platform and my dealership’s service department having more certified 4xe tech’s than ever, I’m not too concerned. But that is dealership dependent and clearly not all are equal. Chatting with the Service Manager this week (had the ECH replaced), my dealership incentivizes their tech’s to get certified in hybrids and advised that those who choose not to will be getting left behind sooner rather than later.

 

[aldo98229]

Chatting with the Service Manager this week (had the ECH replaced), my dealership incentivizes their tech’s to get certified in hybrids and advised that those who choose not to will be getting left behind sooner rather than later.

Yup. They will go on to Ford dealerships to work on Broncos... ?

Thanks for the post. That’s encouraging to hear.

 

[dcm80401]

I'm also considering a 4xe.
Meeting with an associate at my preferred dealer. I asked for an associate well versed in the 4xe, definitely skeptical.

What would be your top 5 questions to ask to test their knowledge?

The question I am going to ask my dealership is if I can I park my 4xe in their lot until this recall issue is resolved. I have place no safe or secure to park it to meet thier recall.

 

[jeep1]

Mine is the northernmost dealership in the state. The Canada border is 20 miles north of here, so there are no more CDJR US dealers in that direction. To the east are the Cascade Mountains, which are mostly uninhabited; to the west is the Pacific Ocean. So my only options are 60-120 miles south towards Seattle and Tacoma.

I haven’t dealt with every single dealer down there, but the few experiences I’ve had ranged from mediocre to poor.

I’ve been the happy owner of CDJR vehicles for 35+ years, but I just can’t find a decent dealer any more. It is a pretty sad state of affairs.

It's a hell of a hike for you but the Jeep dealer in Enumclaw gets a lot of love from the guys I use to wheel with. If I had stayed in the Seattle region, we would have bought our next Jeep from them.

I feel your pain... I have a 2020 JLRU 6speed sitting unloved waiting for the clutch recall so I can finally get it imported into Canada (we moved last summer). Bellingham would be the obvious (close) choice to get the work done but I don't trust any of the Rairdon dealerships either.

Autonation in Bellevue is just as bad.... never ending turn over of their mechanics and service advisors, when I had it, my Gladiator sat in the lot for two weeks because they couldn't' figure out the problem and just didn't bother to keep trying...

The CDJR dealer in Renton wasn't awful the few times we went there...

 

[aldo98229]

It's a hell of a hike for you but the Jeep dealer in Enumclaw gets a lot of love from the guys I use to wheel with. If I had stayed in the Seattle region, we would have bought our next Jeep from them.

I feel your pain... I have a 2020 JLRU 6speed sitting unloved waiting for the clutch recall so I can finally get it imported into Canada (we moved last summer). Bellingham would be the obvious (close) choice to get the work done but I don't trust any of the Rairdon dealerships either.

Autonation in Bellevue is just as bad.... never ending turn over of their mechanics and service advisors, when I had it, my Gladiator sat in the lot for two weeks because they couldn't' figure out the problem and just didn't bother to keep trying...

The CDJR dealer in Renton wasn't awful the few times we went there...

Don’t bother with Langley CDJR or Willowbrook CDJR in BC, either. My dad and my brother went there for years. I got to hear the horror stories.

Abbortsford CDJR was family owned and operated. They used to offer good service. I don’t know if that is still the case.

 

[jeep1]

Don’t bother with Langley CDJR or Willowbrook CDJR in BC, either. My dad and my brother went there for years. I got to hear the horror stories.

Abbortsford CDJR was family owned and operated. They used to offer good service. I don’t know if that is still the case.

Good to know.

My daughter had a bad experience with Abbotsford... she bought a used JKUR from them that had leaking front axle seals. The dealership agreed to fix it and replaced the axle shafts. A couple days later she found out they had put (somehow....). non-rubicon shafts into the rubicon. Took some yelling but at least they made good and fixed it properly.

The local dealership in Chilliwack seems decent. The parts and service guys seemed competent when I talked to them but we shall see..... We went in to ask about doing the Clutch recall here. They seemed open to the idea but they hadn't even receive any notices about parts/process being available in Canada for any of the model years yet. US first, Canada afterwards ... Going to be annoyed when a full year goes by before Jeep fixes the 2020s....

 

[RubiX4xe]

If you want to test mashing the throttle make sure you put it in 4H-Auto before doing that... 2H has some nanny control where the computer hyper optimizes for slow as F driving.

Make sure the engine is on and then mash away. Massive smiles will come. Even more if in 4wd auto.

 

[RubiX4xe]

4xe gets "49mpge" (worst unit of measure ever, but I digress) which translates to roughly 1.5 mi/kWh. That's a pretty horrible efficiency for an EV, but Wrangler is a heavy shoebox. So it's not surprising.

Anyhow, If you've got relatively cheap electricity available, let's say 12¢/kWh then your fuel cost per mile is gonna be 8¢ per mile, when tooling around town on electric.

If you're paying $3.80 per gallon for gas, then your cost per mile while operating on Dino Juice is 19¢ per mile.

Not to mention the fun of tooling around quietly while keeping it in full electric mode.

So IF you can plug it in at your house, and your non-peak electricity rate is cheap, and you can discipline yourself to keep the factory Sahara tires/wheels which are reasonably low rolling resistance

THEN you can reasonably expect to take advantage of low lease prices and be tooling around in a new Jeep for reasonably affordable money.

Repeat after me: "Must. Not. Put. On. Big. Tires."

Granted they're only 33s, but being on stock Rubicons is not a problem at all. Still saving decent amount of money with electric miles over gas driven ones, and that's despite it being a brick on wheels. Plus the fewer emissions... Plus the fact that I can race my wife in her 5.7L and win.

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