Officially done.

[ReimundKrohn]

A few of you should go back and read some old posts. I have probably built more high end Jeeps and drag cars than most of the people on here combined. I have literally cut Jl’s in half and rebuilt them from the ground up. Not to mention 4000+ HP twin turbo drag week cars from a pile of tube and carbon fiber. I didn’t just throw parts at the thing. I have been in this thing as far as measuring the exact over center adjustments on the gear box, most of the smart asses don’t even have a clue what an over center adjustment is let alone how to measure it. I have been on the phone with engineers form Stellentis for hours discussing this thing, they have sent me multiple gear boxes to try out. Anyone else have a direct contact with the steering and suspension engineers from Stellantis? I had three of the latest design gear boxes sitting in my shop to test before they were available. I picked which one I wanted and sent the others back.

….So…. We are to understand that Jeep / Stellantis Engineers have been sending you free (R&D) parts to fix a problem you encountered after modding your Jeep from factory specifications because…. you’re a really smart guy with an impressive resume who can’t fix the problems his mods have caused to his Jeep?

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[Jeep&dogs]

….So…. We are to understand that Jeep / Stellantis Engineers have been sending you free (R&D) parts to fix a problem you encountered after modding your Jeep from factory specifications because…. you’re a really smart guy with an impressive resume who can’t fix the problems his mods have caused to his Jeep?

I am actually a certified FCA tech, problem was there when the Jeep was basically stock. The mods didn’t cause the issue. Did you even know who Stellantis was or did you have to Google it?

 

[Petey]

A few of you should go back and read some old posts. I have probably built more high end Jeeps and drag cars than most of the people on here combined. I have literally cut Jl’s in half and rebuilt them from the ground up. Not to mention 4000+ HP twin turbo drag week cars from a pile of tube and carbon fiber. I didn’t just throw parts at the thing. I have been in this thing as far as measuring the exact over center adjustments on the gear box, most of the smart asses don’t even have a clue what an over center adjustment is let alone how to measure it. I have been on the phone with engineers form Stellentis for hours discussing this thing, they have sent me multiple gear boxes to try out. Anyone else have a direct contact with the steering and suspension engineers from Stellantis? I had three of the latest design gear boxes sitting in my shop to test before they were available. I picked which one I wanted and sent the others back.

"sitting in my shop to test before they were available. I picked which one I wanted and sent the others back."

This made my right eye twitch uncontrollably and thats the one that never twitches.

 

[LLANERO]

Do you think it’s more common on jeeps with Frankenstein suspension systems where different manufacturers may have slightly different tolerances that cause wear on each? combine that with larger tires? Just trying to figure out the common denominator.

I've had two JKs and now a JL.
Only times I've experienced DW was on my 08 JKUR with 37s and a 5.5" RK lift, and it always was due to unbalanced tires.
The worst one was when offroading on the Everglades. After leaving the trail, all wheels were packed with mud.
When the mud was wet it acted as dynamic balancing and everything was fine. Then we stopped for lunch and the mud dried. When we left, as soon as I went over 15 mph, the jeep started shaking as it was going to fall appart and I couldn't control the direction it was going to. Only way to stop this was hitting the brakes.
I thought I would have to leave the jeep in a shop and drive home with one of the other jeeps.
I called one on my friends and told him what was going on, he laughed and told he to stop at the gas station and hose the mud off of the wheels.
Did that and voila! DW was gone.
After that I experienced DW a few more times. All I had to do to get it fixed was to rebalance the tires.
Then I had a JK with an AEV lift and 35s and never experienced DW.
I currently own a JLU with a Frankenstein 5" lift, 37s, and no DW so far

 

[19 JLUR Bright Whit3]

Yet a Certified FCA mechanic with R&D parts designed by Stellantis (I had to Google it. SMH) Engineers cant figure DW out. LOL ? ?

 

[TaiMc]

Learn to deal with it, quick jerk of the steering wheel to the right and at the same time jam the brakes and release cured mine every single time. You get used to it, you learn what sections of roads and at what speeds it is going to occur and you be ready. Be quick and forceful and you’ll counteract that dribbling front axle. Then, you find the root cause and fix it…..

LOL!!! This is me with my shimmy! I know which bumps I can’t avoid (bc they are across all lanes down Shepherd!) and I adjust my speed and play with my steering wheel until it comes out of it (about 4-7secs). I actually have tried multiple methods going over the same bumps and the troubleshooting has made me feel comfortable with it, as the wobble decreases each time.

I developed my shimmy after I got my lift and tires, but I expected id have some movement. Hoping to get a stabilizer soon, but will also ask them to check all front suspension just in case. I’m over 62k miles now and these components need to be checked/serviced anyway (especially on the city streets I drive!

 

[TaiMc]

Well I wasn’t really coming on here to announce my departure. I really don’t even come on here much anymore because the forum has really turned into a place where most of the people really don’t have any idea what they are talking about. Several years back when the Jl first came out and the forum was started I was actually pretty heavily active along with a few others. Unfortunately only a handful of the people still even bother to come on here that really know what they are talking about.

That handful that do know what I have done to the Jeep and everything that was done to correct it over the last few years and have also been involved in many conversations on what to try to fix it. Those are the people I was actually explaining I have officially had enough of this thing, not the majority of what this forum has turned into.

YIKES. ?

well…hope you figure it out and report back so we can all be informed!

were any of these issues replicated when the Jeep was bone stock?

When did you first start noticing any issue with it? It sounds like you’ve replaced so many components and items…if you could think back to when you started having problems, maybe that could narrow down the culprit?

- did the jeep have issues from the jump (pre-mod)?
- did you replace multiple items at once or each part individually?
- did your issues occur immediately after the installation or did they take a while to show up?

I would be asking myself all of these questions. I’m sure you have already….just might be a good idea to revisit this thought process, bc your frustration is fueling your anger and just maybe there is something that you’ve overlooked?

Wish you well! ??????

 

[TaiMc]

….problem was there when the Jeep was basically stock….

Basically stock?

What was done to it that made the jeep not be 100% stock? Maybe that created the issue from the jump? ?

 

[RAMSTEEL]

I am actually a certified FCA tech, problem was there when the Jeep was basically stock. The mods didn’t cause the issue. Did you even know who Stellantis was or did you have to Google it?

Wow, so I read back through your posts. I'd sell that beast in a heartbeat. Good on you for trying everything and from the sounds of it you have the resources to tackle anything. Not sure you tried it but I would switch tire/wheel combos (if you haven't already) just to see. Somewhere in your posts, you mention harmonic balance and there's probably some truth to that. I've had three identical 2020/2021 Rubicons, same motor, same lifts, same everything except the last one I went to 37" tires (just because, no real reason) and the ATS Fox stabilizer up front. Holy cow that jeep tracked and handled better than the other two by a mile. The first two always felt squirrely and I definitely got a wobble in some situations. The last one was a completely different Jeep with tires and the ATS stabilizer. Best of luck, you certainly deserve to vent.

 

[LLANERO]

Well I wasn’t really coming on here to announce my departure. I really don’t even come on here much anymore because the forum has really turned into a place where most of the people really don’t have any idea what they are talking about. Several years back when the Jl first came out and the forum was started I was actually pretty heavily active along with a few others. Unfortunately only a handful of the people still even bother to come on here that really know what they are talking about.

That handful that do know what I have done to the Jeep and everything that was done to correct it over the last few years and have also been involved in many conversations on what to try to fix it. Those are the people I was actually explaining I have officially had enough of this thing, not the majority of what this forum has turned into.

Well it actually looks like you are the one who don't have any idea what you are talking about.
I may not have your impresive car industry resume nor engineer friends, but I have heavily modded my three Jeeps, having installed mosr of them myself, and have never experienced the issues you have. LOL

 

[Jeep&dogs]

Since there are quite a few people on here that have way more knowledge about the Jl steering issues than I do maybe a few can answer some questions I have been pondering over the years?

Just exactly how many revisions were there to the Jl steering gear box since the Jl came out and other than the obvious switch from aluminum to cast iron what exactly did each revision consist of?

Where there internal parts changed on each revision?
Did the tolerance change on any of the parts?
What about the acceptable range of tolerance?

There were also several revisions for the factory track bars.

Why did they change each time and why did they make that change?
Was it wall thickness of the tube?
How much was the hardness increased in the bushings?
Were there any other changes made to the track bar?

How many software revisions were there released for the steering issues?
Do you know what parameters were changed?
Were the changes made throughout the entire RPM range?
Were there any changes made to the output of the pump?
What is the operating pressure of the system during cruising RPM when the steering angle reads 0?
How does the computer know the angle of the steering?

The factory steering damper also has had several revisions to solve the problem.

What exactly did they change?


Was the JL frame designed for the weight of the aluminum gear box?
Has there been any revisions in the frame since the switch to the cast iron box?
Are the MOAB frames any different than the other frames?
If so do any of the changes include changes to the area where the gearbox is mounted?
Why the switch to cast knuckles on the MOAB?


These are all things I have wondered why they would have been changing since it’s so easy to correct, I mean it has to be ball joints or track bar is worn, why make so many changes? Heck for a case of beer and a few steaks on the grill could just swing these things by and most could be fixed in a few hours right?

 

[LLANERO]

Since there are quite a few people on here that have way more knowledge about the Jl steering issues than I do maybe a few can answer some questions I have been pondering over the years?

Just exactly how many revisions were there to the Jl steering gear box since the Jl came out and other than the obvious switch from aluminum to cast iron what exactly did each revision consist of?

Where there internal parts changed on each revision?
Did the tolerance change on any of the parts?
What about the acceptable range of tolerance?

There were also several revisions for the factory track bars.

Why did they change each time and why did they make that change?
Was it wall thickness of the tube?
How much was the hardness increased in the bushings?
Were there any other changes made to the track bar?

How many software revisions were there released for the steering issues?
Do you know what parameters were changed?
Were the changes made throughout the entire RPM range?
Were there any changes made to the output of the pump?
What is the operating pressure of the system during cruising RPM when the steering angle reads 0?
How does the computer know the angle of the steering?

The factory steering damper also has had several revisions to solve the problem.

What exactly did they change?


Was the JL frame designed for the weight of the aluminum gear box?
Has there been any revisions in the frame since the switch to the cast iron box?
Are the MOAB frames any different than the other frames?
If so do any of the changes include changes to the area where the gearbox is mounted?
Why the switch to cast knuckles on the MOAB?


These are all things I have wondered why they would have been changing since it’s so easy to correct, I mean it has to be ball joints or track bar is worn, why make so many changes? Heck for a case of beer and a few steaks on the grill could just swing these things by and most could be fixed in a few hours right?

I'm sure you have the answers to.all those questions and I don"t have the answer to not even one of them, but I have only one question for you:

How has all that nerdy knowledge helped you fix the issue your Jeep has and mine, with me being so ignorant, doesn't? LOL

 

[TX_Ovrlnd]

The obvious answer is IFS!

 

[Jeep&dogs]

I'm sure you have the answers to.all those questions and I don"t have the answer to not even one of them, but I have only one question for you:

How has all that nerdy knowledge helped you fix the issue your Jeep has and mine, with me being so ignorant, doesn't? LOL

Has zero to do with if you know the answer to the questions and more to do with the fact there are way more things involved in the issue the Jeep has or doesn’t have than just if you have installed the right part or even installed the part correctly. The Jeeps have had steering issues form day one and the JL has been the worst. Jeep knows it or they wouldn’t STILL be making changes to the Jeep. If you listen to half the people on this page all you need to do is pull the stabilizer off, tighten the ball joints, throw some caster in it, do a steering test, and replace or tighten anything that moves. Simple, yet Jeep has made all of these changes to attempt to fix the problem.

 

[Carlton]

Get what makes you happy. The frustration isn't worth it. I switched from a JK that refused to change gears and struggled all the time to a Grand Cherokee once due to the annoyance of it never being corrected. Eventually came back. However, the Bronco looks awesome. Give it a go.

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