Jeep Values - Massive Decline

[The Last Cowboy]

The Thar looks like an ugly JK knockoff. If they could sell here for $20 to start, they'd sell well though.

Too bad Suzuki is out of the US market, the current Jimny would probably sell great. It's smaller than a Wrangler, but if it topped out below where a base Wrangler starts, there would be a lot on the road. I doubt it would pass safety standards here though. Although, it does in the EU.

So, should Jeep offer something like this, and keep the options to a soft top?

I really like it, but clearly it would pass new vehicle safety requirements.

So, would Jeep really consider "cheapening" the brand by offering something like a Wrangler SE? Base as base can be, marine vinyl seats, vinyl floor, steel wheels, bare dash with just gauges. But put M210/220 axles on it. The only options would be soft top and half doors, a phone mount where the current radio is, with a removable Bluetooth speaker in the dash and in the rear, and AC.

As good as it as it may sound to many here, I doubt it. New buyers want every option they can get, and many stretch themselves to have that "next level". Throughout the car industry now, it's rare to find a "stripper" model. Everyone wants features. Also, to be fair, it's cheaper and easier to build vehicles with power windows and locks that it is to put the mechanical window regulators in. Many of the parts needed to support higher priced options are already in place, making adding them nearly plug and play in many instances. It costs them more money to leave options off in some cases. Also, no manufacturer right now is going to pass on the opportunity to monitor everything you are doing in your vehicle, via the infotainment system, then selling that info to marketers, insurance companies, etc.

So, the base Wrangler, as it stands, is probably the last of it's kind. When steel wheels get more expensive than overseas made cast aluminum, they will be gone too. All new vehicles must have front collision avoidance, a suite of airbags, backup cameras, and ABS/ESC. Every few years more safety equipment gets mandated. The current base Wrangler isn't so base anymore. Even AC is standard as of 2024.

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[Zandcwhite]

The Thar looks like an ugly JK knockoff. If they could sell here for $20 to start, they'd sell well though.

Too bad Suzuki is out of the US market, the current Jimny would probably sell great. It's smaller than a Wrangler, but if it topped out below where a base Wrangler starts, there would be a lot on the road. I doubt it would pass safety standards here though. Although, it does in the EU.

So, should Jeep offer something like this, and keep the options to a soft top?

I really like it, but clearly it would pass new vehicle safety requirements.

So, would Jeep really consider "cheapening" the brand by offering something like a Wrangler SE? Base as base can be, marine vinyl seats, vinyl floor, steel wheels, bare dash with just gauges. But put M210/220 axles on it. The only options would be soft top and half doors, a phone mount where the current radio is, with a removable Bluetooth speaker in the dash and in the rear, and AC.

As good as it as it may sound to many here, I doubt it. New buyers want every option they can get, and many stretch themselves to have that "next level". Throughout the car industry now, it's rare to find a "stripper" model. Everyone wants features. Also, to be fair, it's cheaper and easier to build vehicles with power windows and locks that it is to put the mechanical window regulators in. Many of the parts needed to support higher priced options are already in place, making adding them nearly plug and play in many instances. It costs them more money to leave options off in some cases. Also, no manufacturer right now is going to pass on the opportunity to monitor everything you are doing in your vehicle, via the infotainment system, then selling that info to marketers, insurance companies, etc.

So, the base Wrangler, as it stands, is probably the last of it's kind. When steel wheels get more expensive than overseas made cast aluminum, they will be gone too. All new vehicles must have front collision avoidance, a suite of airbags, backup cameras, and ABS/ESC. Every few years more safety equipment gets mandated. The current base Wrangler isn't so base anymore. Even AC is standard as of 2024.

And yet the base price is within a few grand of a Honda civic. People on this forum talk about even more stripped models selling even cheaper... but nobody even buys the base model. Most of the people who pander for less tech and creature comforts on here drive pretty loaded Jeeps and it's baffling to me. Pretending Jeeps are overpriced while you pay double the base price for your loaded Rubicon is weird. Pretending there's too many creature comforts while you check the boxes for seat heaters, adaptive cruise, and leather is border line insanity. We've bought 2 JLURs and a JT mojave in the last 6 years, all with leather, seat heaters, etc. Only the mojave doesn't have adaptive cruise... and I wish it did. They already offer a very cheap, pretty basic model...and nobody wants it. That $30k might look appealing when you pass the dealer on the freeway and get you in the door...and in my opinion that's all they exist for.

 

[CptFloridaMan]

Shit I think Stellantis is doing a flat -20% under MSRP rebate at the moment for gladiators. If you were ever interested in snagging one I'd say now is the time. Most are seeing 13-15k in rebates + dealer discounts.

Local dealer has one for 23k off msrp for a jt gladiator. So I do agree that now is absolutely the time to buy.

Not gonna lie that sorta tickled my fancy, but I’ve got too much into my sport to make sense to get rid of it.

 

[Zandcwhite]

Local dealer has one for 23k off msrp for a jt gladiator. So I do agree that now is absolutely the time to buy.

Not gonna lie that sorta tickled my fancy, but I’ve got too much into my sport to make sense to get rid of it.

You know what looks better than 1 Jeep in the driveway? 2 of them.

 

[Aggretsuko]

I would willingly pay more for a Wrangler just not to be seen in this heap of , they sell their Roxor in the US for $25K and it is not even road worthy, don't even think the Roxor is weather proof.




These seem to sell for $45K on Carvana



Carvana have these at $24K - $29K

Are Carvana prices fake, to the level of $10K+ overpriced?

The way I look at the value of my vehicle is what I would have to pay for it, plus another $5K because I know what I have, if I have problems then $0K, major problems then minus whatever dollar value to bring it to spec.

Trying to offload a vehicle on trade means the dealership will most likely low ball, if you seem desperate to off load it, it's barrel time.

Buying Wranglers over the years, if I don't get my money worth driving it off that lot, I'm not buying, I have to be 110% happy with my purchase, it also takes me months hunting for a Wrangler, colour, lack of options and massive discounts, and I'm willing to give up some discount for colour.

Yes! The Escape is selling for over 20k in my market. I have seen them at 23k with miles for days. The jeeps are right at that level too. I always saw Jeeps reselling for more in the past. Before the pandemic I was only offered 7k for my Escape, not worth buns. Lol. How things changed. I’m not getting rid of my Jeep anytime soon, but I do check the market out of curiosity to see where the value is regardless of what vehicle I have at the time. It’s a bit disheartening to see Jeeps value decline from what it used to be.

 

[Whaler27]

I would willingly pay more for a Wrangler just not to be seen in this heap of , they sell their Roxor in the US for $25K and it is not even road worthy, don't even think the Roxor is weather proof.




These seem to sell for $45K on Carvana



Carvana have these at $24K - $29K

Are Carvana prices fake, to the level of $10K+ overpriced?

The way I look at the value of my vehicle is what I would have to pay for it, plus another $5K because I know what I have, if I have problems then $0K, major problems then minus whatever dollar value to bring it to spec.

Trying to offload a vehicle on trade means the dealership will most likely low ball, if you seem desperate to off load it, it's barrel time.

Buying Wranglers over the years, if I don't get my money worth driving it off that lot, I'm not buying, I have to be 110% happy with my purchase, it also takes me months hunting for a Wrangler, colour, lack of options and massive discounts, and I'm willing to give up some discount for colour.

I don’t want a Mahindra anything, even though their tractors are reportedly reasonably durable. My point was, if these can be sold for a profit in India for $12,000, maybe the de-glitzed Jeep Safari Wrangler I was referring to (posted by Last Cowboy above) could be sold for $20,000.

I owned four successive CJs before the transition to Wranglers. I miss them all, so I have continue to shop for an old CJ in good shape. They are very, very hard to find, and when I find one that’s close to stock with a decent body and little or no rust damage, they are well north of $30,000. I’d buy a simple jeep for $25,000 in a blink, but Zach’s point is well taken. Given the poor sales of the base level jeep, I‘m probably the exception to the rule. My preferences have also evolved. My Wrangler is a hard-top, but I haven’t had the top on it in almost three years. My imagined use and my actual use have diverged with age. These days I enjoy poking along mountain trails on sunny days. I should probably sell my jeep and try to buy back my 2006 TJ.

 

[TheRaven]

And yet the base price is within a few grand of a Honda civic. People on this forum talk about even more stripped models selling even cheaper... but nobody even buys the base model. Most of the people who pander for less tech and creature comforts on here drive pretty loaded Jeeps and it's baffling to me. Pretending Jeeps are overpriced while you pay double the base price for your loaded Rubicon is weird. Pretending there's too many creature comforts while you check the boxes for seat heaters, adaptive cruise, and leather is border line insanity. We've bought 2 JLURs and a JT mojave in the last 6 years, all with leather, seat heaters, etc. Only the mojave doesn't have adaptive cruise... and I wish it did. They already offer a very cheap, pretty basic model...and nobody wants it. That $30k might look appealing when you pass the dealer on the freeway and get you in the door...and in my opinion that's all they exist for.

Yes that's exactly what they exist for. Every automaker does it - the base model, that in most cases you can't even get, starts at a very attractive price. But then buyers go to the dealer with that price in mind and find that the cheapest one on the lot is $20k more expensive. With GM, for example, one cannot even order a true base model - several have tried but none have actually received a vehicle..."production delays" and "unavailable packages" lead to order cancellation every time.

As for the subject of the thread - I got my 2021 back in fall of 2020, before the stupid price increases, and it's still holding value very well. However, if you look at the same equipment level in MY2022, you get a very clear picture of what's going on - the 2022 is worth about $2k more now than my 2021 is, which really is about right...however that 2022 stickered for $6k more. There's your problem. By the end of 2023, my same equipment level stickered for $11k more than it did in 2021...but resale value is only going to be like $5k higher than my 2021. And mine's a Sport-based trim. Rubicons are going to be way worse. Combine that reality with the shock of resale value at the 1 year mark (never look at the resale value of a 1 year old vehicle, it's going to be frightening every time) and you're going to see some downright scary valuations.

 

[Timmyjoe]

I think this "Jeep Values, Massive Decline" applies much more to folks who bought a Wrangler after Covid hit, and probably models that were loaded up. We got our 2-Door Sport S in 2019 and its value has only declined about $8000 from the price we paid in August of 2019.

Now at the height of Covid, when dealers were desperate for units to sell, they were offering about $6000 more than we paid, if we'd sell it to them, but those prices were smoke and mirrors.

Best,
-Tim

 

[BXFXJeep]

Yes that's exactly what they exist for. Every automaker does it - the base model, that in most cases you can't even get, starts at a very attractive price. But then buyers go to the dealer with that price in mind and find that the cheapest one on the lot is $20k more expensive. With GM, for example, one cannot even order a true base model - several have tried but none have actually received a vehicle..."production delays" and "unavailable packages" lead to order cancellation every time.

As for the subject of the thread - I got my 2021 back in fall of 2020, before the stupid price increases, and it's still holding value very well. However, if you look at the same equipment level in MY2022, you get a very clear picture of what's going on - the 2022 is worth about $2k more now than my 2021 is, which really is about right...however that 2022 stickered for $6k more. There's your problem. By the end of 2023, my same equipment level stickered for $11k more than it did in 2021...but resale value is only going to be like $5k higher than my 2021. And mine's a Sport-based trim. Rubicons are going to be way worse. Combine that reality with the shock of resale value at the 1 year mark (never look at the resale value of a 1 year old vehicle, it's going to be frightening every time) and you're going to see some downright scary valuations.

It also seems the manufacturers go out of their way to tack on hideous and useless parts on the base model.

 

[Jeep Wick]

The Thar looks like an ugly JK knockoff. If they could sell here for $20 to start, they'd sell well though.

Too bad Suzuki is out of the US market, the current Jimny would probably sell great. It's smaller than a Wrangler, but if it topped out below where a base Wrangler starts, there would be a lot on the road. I doubt it would pass safety standards here though. Although, it does in the EU.

So, should Jeep offer something like this, and keep the options to a soft top?

I really like it, but clearly it would pass new vehicle safety requirements.

So, would Jeep really consider "cheapening" the brand by offering something like a Wrangler SE? Base as base can be, marine vinyl seats, vinyl floor, steel wheels, bare dash with just gauges. But put M210/220 axles on it. The only options would be soft top and half doors, a phone mount where the current radio is, with a removable Bluetooth speaker in the dash and in the rear, and AC.

As good as it as it may sound to many here, I doubt it. New buyers want every option they can get, and many stretch themselves to have that "next level". Throughout the car industry now, it's rare to find a "stripper" model. Everyone wants features. Also, to be fair, it's cheaper and easier to build vehicles with power windows and locks that it is to put the mechanical window regulators in. Many of the parts needed to support higher priced options are already in place, making adding them nearly plug and play in many instances. It costs them more money to leave options off in some cases. Also, no manufacturer right now is going to pass on the opportunity to monitor everything you are doing in your vehicle, via the infotainment system, then selling that info to marketers, insurance companies, etc.

So, the base Wrangler, as it stands, is probably the last of it's kind. When steel wheels get more expensive than overseas made cast aluminum, they will be gone too. All new vehicles must have front collision avoidance, a suite of airbags, backup cameras, and ABS/ESC. Every few years more safety equipment gets mandated. The current base Wrangler isn't so base anymore. Even AC is standard as of 2024.

There is a large population that wants a simplified vehicle. Less expensive, less complicated, more reliable. If they build it, they would sell as many as they could make. Assuming it was priced correctly.

 

[Punkn89]

I feel for the younger generation looking to buy their first wrangler. I bought my first one senior year of high school after working at a movie theater. I believe it was about $3500 used with under 80k miles. Everyone wanted a ride.

Even with the current discounts and incentives, it's just not possible for the average young adult without taking on debt that they will chase for awhile. It is very hard to find a bare bones wrangler that is affordable. It seems as if there was a wider age market for one back in the day, but now, not so much. There may have been a thread asking what age group you fall into and I think most (on the forum at least) were over 50.

Found it - https://www.jlwranglerforums.com/forum/threads/what-age-group-are-you-in.123349/

 

[Zandcwhite]

I feel for the younger generation looking to buy their first wrangler. I bought my first one senior year of high school after working at a movie theater. I believe it was about $3500 used with under 80k miles. Everyone wanted a ride.

Even with the current discounts and incentives, it's just not possible for the average young adult without taking on debt that they will chase for awhile. It is very hard to find a bare bones wrangler that is affordable. It seems as if there was a wider age market for one back in the day, but now, not so much. There may have been a thread asking what age group you fall into and I think most (on the forum at least) were over 50.

Found it - https://www.jlwranglerforums.com/forum/threads/what-age-group-are-you-in.123349/

I mean this is the JL forum. Not many kids, and especially not the ones that worked and paid for them themselves drove cars less than 7 years old when I was in high school? Adjusted for inflation alone $3500 in 1990 is $8500 today. You can still find a decent used JK for not a lot more than that.

 

[Punkn89]

I mean this is the JL forum. Not many kids, and especially not the ones that worked and paid for them themselves drove cars less than 7 years old when I was in high school? Adjusted for inflation alone $3500 in 1990 is $8500 today. You can still find a decent used JK for not a lot more than that.

I just checked my area and most JK's (over 10 years old or more) are still over $10k with 150K+ miles. I wouldn't say it's the same, even when you do count for adjusted inflation.

 

[Zandcwhite]

I just checked my area and most JK's (over 10 years old or more) are still over $10k with 150K+ miles. I wouldn't say it's the same, even when you do count for adjusted inflation.

It's not exactly the same, but I don't think its as far off as people assume. Minimum wage in our area is now $20/hr, what were you making at the movie theater when you bought that $3500 Jeep?

 

[Punkn89]

It's not exactly the same, but I don't think its as far off as people assume. Minimum wage in our area is now $20/hr, what were you making at the movie theater when you bought that $3500 Jeep?

I believe it was $6.50 (2007). Min wage in MD is $15 now I believe.

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