Dual Battery Questions

[word302]

Everything I'm reading on line says you can't just jump it like a regular battery which would mean you probably can't charge it like a regular battery, plus how can you charge the Aux battery? They both need to be charged.

Both batteries are connected at the main battery terminals. By connecting to the main battery, you are in reality connected to both batteries.

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[Hgrace]

Why do people make this such voodoo. Auxiliary batteries and start stop systems have been around for a decade. All the Aux does is keep constant power to sensing electronics and such.

 

[Dkretden]

Page 432 of the online 2019 owners manual discusses that a JL with 2 batteries can be jumped in the normal way (albeit waiting for a few minutes with cables attached to get a charge into wrangle battery). The manual also says to NOT try to jump the small battery. Finally, the manual does say that a portable booster pack CAN be used to jump the wrangler (whether it works or not is another matter).......

 

[allieboy]

Why do people make this such voodoo. Auxiliary batteries and start stop systems have been around for a decade. All the Aux does is keep constant power to sensing electronics and such.

Try to use portable power to jump it

Page 432 of the online 2019 owners manual discusses that a JL with 2 batteries can be jumped in the normal way (albeit waiting for a few minutes with cables attached to get a charge into wrangle battery). The manual also says to NOT try to jump the small battery. Finally, the manual does say that a portable booster pack CAN be used to jump the wrangler (whether it works or not is another matter).......

Portable boost gets dicey when aux is dead

 

[Hgrace]

Try to use portable power to jump it

Portable boost gets dicey when aux is dead

No problem I carry a Schumacher jump box. Not a toy. I've started my 2500 HD silverado and my F53 V10 and my 2006 Charger and my Saturn Vue hybrid. No problem. Those VHS size batteries are useful. My son has use his several times. He says he needs to leave it on for 5 to 10 minutes before trying to start.
Any jump requires a period of time to balance the flow and warm up the less acid before starting. E even my 200 amp cart based shop starter.
Again it's just a battery like any other and the 3.6 is nothing to crank like my V8s and V10. Chrysler also has a distinctive character in their starters as the are wound for less than 12v operation. I've had Mopars for 50 plus years. They still sound the same.

 

[allieboy]

No problem I carry a Schumacher jump box. Not a toy. I've started my 2500 HD silverado and my F53 V10 and my 2006 Charger and my Saturn Vue hybrid. No problem. Those VHS size batteries are useful. My son has use his several times. He says he needs to leave it on for 5 to 10 minutes before trying to start.
Any jump requires a period of time to balance the flow and warm up the less acid before starting. E even my 200 amp cart based shop starter.
Again it's just a battery like any other and the 3.6 is nothing to crank like my V8s and V10. Chrysler also has a distinctive character in their starters as the are wound for less than 12v operation. I've had Mopars for 50 plus years. They still sound the same.

Awesome. Let us know if it worked.

 

[Rhinebeck01]

@Hgrace

You think you got it figured out ... you are minimizing this issue.

I'd like to be standing nearby when you try to jump start that stock, JL with your Schumacher".

A few months ago, I had a totally dead JL. No power at all. FCA sent a guy out, with a quality 12v Jump pack. He had only had it a few days. I was his first customer that morning so he had a fresh overnight charge on the jump pack. He told me this jump pack of his (his employer's) was one of the best you could get. Capable of jumping "big rigs" he said.....

Long story short, the jump pack could not do the job. Jump pack on for more then about 8 min. and then tried to start the JL. Nothing!

The guy began to tell me that the JL must have other issues. I asked him to humor me and use his jumper cables. He said he would and went to the truck and got his cables. Said "they are brand new, I never have used them. He hooked his flat bed truck up to my JL with them, we waited about 5-10 minutes and the JL , started right up. The guy just looked at me and said...... ahhh.. ok.

In closing, a jump pack may do the deed, but no one here has reported one doing so this far.

.

 

[Jebiruph]

No problem I carry a Schumacher jump box. Not a toy. I've started my 2500 HD silverado and my F53 V10 and my 2006 Charger and my Saturn Vue hybrid. No problem. Those VHS size batteries are useful. My son has use his several times. He says he needs to leave it on for 5 to 10 minutes before trying to start.
Any jump requires a period of time to balance the flow and warm up the less acid before starting. E even my 200 amp cart based shop starter.
Again it's just a battery like any other and the 3.6 is nothing to crank like my V8s and V10. Chrysler also has a distinctive character in their starters as the are wound for less than 12v operation. I've had Mopars for 50 plus years. They still sound the same.

Just curious, what's the compression ratio of your V8's and V10. It's 11.3:1 in the Wrangler 3.6. I suspect compression ratio has more impact on starting than rotating mass. It would be interesting to know how much energy is needed to start different engines.

What model is your Schumacher? I need to get something, may as well get something good.

 

[allieboy]

Just curious, what's the compression ratio of your V8's and V10. It's 11.3:1 in the Wrangler 3.6. I suspect compression ratio has more impact on starting than rotating mass. It would be interesting to know how much energy is needed to start different engines.

What model is your Schumacher? I need to get something, may as well get something good.

Clore Automotive makes some good ones

 

[viper88]

I have had good experiences with both CTEK and NOCO intelligent battery maintainers.

 

[allieboy]

Just curious, what's the compression ratio of your V8's and V10. It's 11.3:1 in the Wrangler 3.6. I suspect compression ratio has more impact on starting than rotating mass. It would be interesting to know how much energy is needed to start different engines.

What model is your Schumacher? I need to get something, may as well get something good.

What guage wire do you use for your jumper with 30 amp fuse? Thanks.

 

[Rahneld]

Mr. Bob: I'm not the expert on this. This is Mr. @Jebiruph's post that I copied:

https://www.jlwranglerforums.com/forum/threads/3-6l-ess-aux-battery-bypass.17293/#post-423590

This is what I bought (rather than made):

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000CZ2Z92/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o00__o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

and that the wire on my purchase, as per the description, was #6 in size.

Mr @Jebiruph used (like me) a 30 amp fuse and his wire may be (allowed to be) thinner (less $) than that in my purchase.

I am in the process of permanently installing this, BUT, with an on and off (30 amp or greater) switch set to the off position except if needed.

I took the steps I did because I don't want, if faced with a dead ESS battery, to remember what terminals to hook this up to (N1<->N2), and have to plug in a fuse that the dark may find it hard for me to find and install, that **might** melt on me the second I put it in. My switch, if I turn it on, allows me to distance myself from the fuse.

Edit: see Mr. @Rhinebeck01's reason for an impermanent install below

If my direction is overkill for you then allow me to suggest that you at least buy wing nuts for N1 and N2 so you don't have to carry and work with a socket wrench to effect this when needed and you can remember that it's these 2 terminals that the device attaches to. I saw someone on the forum post a picture of the correct metric size nuts but can't find it.

Does anyone know the thread size/threads per mm of the N1 and N2 for wing nuts?

(Cudos @Jebiruph )

===
P.S. edit: https://www.amazon.com/Bussmann-MAX...Fuse&qid=1550165113&s=gateway&sr=8-1-fkmrnull


~~~~~

 

[Rhinebeck01]

snip:

Does anyone know the thread size/threads per mm of the N1 and N2 for wing nuts?

~~~~~

@Rahneld

For the N1 and N2 - the nut size is M6-1.0

 

[Rhinebeck01]

@Rahneld

In regard to adding a switch to the jumper. Why would you do this. Not necessary and just opens you up to other issues. Forget the switch, idea.. IF you must, just install the jumper and leave the fuse out. Takes a second to insert the fuse when you want to bring the jumper into play.

Reality is ..... I would not even leave the jumper attached all the time. You will truly regret this if you have an issue or not and the dealership service department sees the jumper.

With that said, you better sure as heck, remove the jumper if you have an FCA provided flat tow truck transport your JL to the dealer. You better not have it installed when you go to the dealer for oil changes, etc..

Smart move on your part would be just to keep the jumper, the fuse and the necessary M6-1.0, nuts for NB1 and N2 in the JL.

Having a wing nut on the ESS neutral would be no big deal... if dealer asks about the wing nut .....say "that is all I had that fit and I lost the stock nut.

Dealership will cry foul if they see a jumper attached. You just are asking for trouble telling them about it or letting them see it installed.

Hopefully, a rare day in hell when you will actually need/use the jumper so why, why leave it attached there? Not me...

Yes, you are prudent having such a jumper and the knowledge on how to bring it into play.

.

 

[Rahneld]

Thank you. That's good advice..I'll do it your way. : - )

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