This Comes As No Surprise

[CT_LFC]

I don’t believe even most dealer ships gouged. Supply chain issues made cars scarce and the dealerships had to still pay rent and mortgage payments. Therefore they jacked up prices on the few vehicles they could sell. Also with plenty of available credit and/or cash, consumers will buy whatever, no matter the price. People also received free Covid money and because credit cards are maxed and Covid money is gone, the economy is slowing, businesses are STARTING to feel the squeeze. Someone on this thread mentioned that nobody was in Discovery Bay Labor Day weekend, which was an anomaly. I was at Lake Powell and it was identical. People are cutting back on luxury items, soon it will be groceries.

those crazy “market adjustments” were definitely gouging, imo, but yes, a lot people are struggling.

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[gato]

Man its refreshing around here to see people that dont rush right to union bad this is going to make prices go up.

Yes. I'm not particularly in favor of unions due to some of the crazy work rules, though I support everyone's right to choose to belong to one and negotiate the best contracts they can. But I wanted to point out what people forget - Automakers are always bragging to the Wall St analysts how they brought down the total number of hours to assemble a vehicles to ~20hrs (e.g. Toyota and other high volume lines) to ~30 hrs (more premium or more specialty vehicles). So that means ~1,200 - $2,000 is the final assembly labor content of a vehicle. Even doubling that would not come close to justifying the price increases we have seen from Stelantis/FCA.

By contrast, raw materials contribute something like 47% of the cost of a vehicle.

Now, to be fair there are other hours spent to manufacture a vehicle other than final assembly (building engine, transmission, logistics, transportation, etc) - not all of those hours are UAW hours. But the total for a vehicle with everything in is in the range of 50-60 hrs. Even if those were all UAW hours it would only be like $3,000-$5,000 total. Or ~5% of the MSRP of a Wrangler.

 

[sixspeed]

Bronco sales are down more. This is from July so a little lagging but not much.

https://www.autoblog.com/article/2023-auto-sales-and-2024-preview-ford-bronco-vs-jeep-wrangler/

The numbers don't account for the fact that if the Bronco didn't exist, Jeep sales would be higher. So Jeep's troubles also result from competition that it didn't have for a long time.

 

[autotragic]

The numbers don't account for the fact that if the Bronco didn't exist, Jeep sales would be higher. So Jeep's troubles also result from competition that it didn't have for a long time.

With the release of the Bronco sport and the Bronco it's obvious that Ford wanted a piece of jeeps pie and I'd say they got it.

The arrogance of the Jeep community at large is pretty ridiculous I think. Bronco is absolutely the right vehicle for most people over a Wrangler for how they use the vehicle day to day. Ford had internal discussions on solid front axle versus IFS and at the end of the day I believe they made the right call. The IFS is good enough and it's definitely better for how most people actually use the vehicle.

Did they make the right call for me personally no, otherwise I'd be driving a Bronco instead of a Wrangler but it was the right call for most people and the sales numbers prove it.

 

[Blues Fan 30]

ZERO reason for the 392 to be as expensive as it is. Your could buy a Wrangler, and a Charger with the 392 engine for the same prices as a Wrangler 392 - makes no sense.

Biggest problem with the Wrangler is that they don't offer enough variety in engines, colors, interior options.

Engines: Still stuck on the Pentastar as the workhorse of the line, taking away the diesel, V8 with extremely high price. Solution: Offer the 6.2 or 5.7 liter Hemi as an option at a decent price.

Colors: Stop doing so many mid-year changes; bring back popular colors (why is there no yellow in the current lineup?), and don't have options where the color can't be put on a hardtop.

Options: Stop wasting time pushing packages like the High Tide and allow more interior customization. Why force anyone who wants a Rubicon to have red trim and that UGLY red dash?

Bottom line, they need to listen to customers, and they haven't been.

Totally agree with many of your points here. One big reason I opted against a rubi was the red interior and lack of color matched fenders. The biggest reason against the 392 (no offense to anyone who bought one) is that it's stupidly priced for people with stupid money. My dad asked why I didn't get one and I told him if I was going to spend that money I would have just kept my 2017 camaro ss convertible for the power and still got the jeep. I would have paid 6-8k more for a 5.7 setup though all day every day. My biggest gripe with the sahara was lack of gearing choices though. Now I'm stuck having to shell out thousands to correct what should have been a factory option at a small upcharge or just deal with a subpar setup.

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