Thinking about 4Xe

[RubiX4xe]

There is cold, and then there is cold.

I think the major problem with the 4xe and cold, and FORM, is people not selecting the drive mode they want to drive in, and keeping it in Hybrid causing too many unnecessary engine starts to occur. The way I drive the 4xe is I drive within the limits of the electric motor, which can power you to upwards of 60mph, some people said they go 70mph on electric, I never had any interest to test that, if I know I'll go beyond the range I'll choose to run the gas probably for the entire trip.

There really is absolutely no reason to leave the Wrangler 4xe in Hybrid, if the vast majority of your trips are being done in electric, and your driving isn't erratic.

I live in Toronto("cold"), and never had the FORM issue that a few people are describing, probably because I leave it in electric vs Hybrid, Hybrid seems to be recommended choice by forum experts, they claim because the computer is smart enough, and it knows best, and it's the most efficient etc.

The vast majority of my driving in "cold" Toronto is

For 2023 I did, 7,439 miles, 6,355 is electric, the non electric is mainly because of trips exceeding the electric range. 2022 was double the miles, with a similar ratio, I just never thought to log it.

A few times in the winter when it's -12c or colder you are locked out of electric, but at those temps you are better off driving with the gas motor to heat up the cabin in any case, for me the battery drain too quickly when used to heat the cabin. If I had a charger I would probably use the battery for heat.

When dealing with extreme cold that may be a different story, but extreme cold and EVs don't mix for the most part, some EVs do extreme cold better than others.

The driving experience is consistent if you choose how you want to drive, having the computer think how your experience should be, will give results you may not like.

PHEVs like Ford and Mitsubishi have more of an efficiency and range bias, vs the 4xe which is more about performance resulting in the 470 torque, and lower range.

Just for everyone else reading this thread, you are maybe the only person I have ever read say that hybrid is a bad choice for modes. The only difference between the three modes is how much bias exists between electric and gas. There is no full electric or full gas mode. In general, with hybrid, the engine will turn on when you need: for example, under heavy acceleration, going up steep hills at a prolonged rate, or when you get on freeway speeds. I literally live in the hills of Bay Area and the gas engine rarely comes on going around town. It's not a problem. If I drive in hybrid around flat towns in the Bay Area, you have to drive like a maniac to get the engine to come on.

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[BXFXJeep]

Not exactly sure what you're talking about. Leaving it in hybrid causes problems? Huh? It's the best overall mode. Mixed in gas when you need it, etc.

That's the problem, in EV mode you never need the gas mixed in, hybrid causes the gas motor to start up when it's not really needed, but the throttle input caused it to come on, and that contributes to the FORM problems, short engine runs.

I can go upwards of 60 mph in EV, some people say they go 70mph, at those speeds I fire up the gas engine so I never tested it.

the ability to get to 60-70mph means there is no reason to have the gas engine mixed in if you are driving within the electric range, I drive hard, and the gas never kicks on if I'm in Electric mode, in hybrid it will definitely fire up, coming out of some underground garages causes the gas engine to start if I'm in hybrid mode.

 

[RubiX4xe]

That's the problem, in EV mode you never need the gas mixed in, hybrid causes the gas motor to start up when it's not really needed, but the throttle input caused it to come on, and that contributes to the FORM problems, short engine runs.

I can go upwards of 60 mph in EV, some people say they go 70mph, at those speeds I fire up the gas engine so I never tested it.

the ability to get to 60-70mph means there is no reason to have the gas engine mixed in if you are driving within the electric range, I drive hard, and the gas never kicks on if I'm in Electric mode, in hybrid it will definitely fire up, coming out of some underground garages causes the gas engine to start if I'm in hybrid mode.

It's just simply not my experience at all. I guess we can agree to disagree. I park in a steep underground garage for work. I live on a massively steep hill. I've never experienced the gas firing up under those conditions.

 

[laroo]

Just for everyone else reading this thread, you are maybe the only person I have ever read say that hybrid is a bad choice for modes. The only difference between the three modes is how much bias exists between electric and gas. There is no full electric or full gas mode. In general, with hybrid, the engine will turn on when you need: for example, under heavy acceleration, going up steep hills at a prolonged rate, or when you get on freeway speeds. I literally live in the hills of Bay Area and the gas engine rarely comes on going around town. It's not a problem. If I drive in hybrid around flat towns in the Bay Area, you have to drive like a maniac to get the engine to come on.

I avoid the hybrid setting in almost all cases. I am either in electric or e-save, because I want to control whether I'm using the ICE. I find the hybrid setting a little too quick to start the ICE for my liking.

But my daily commute is well within electric range, so my (maybe OCD) behavior fits well just using the two modes.

 

[graytag]

2 years and 13K miles in, I have, for the most part, really enjoyed my 4xe. It has been a (knocking on laminate) bulletproof vehicle so far. If I could do it over again, I would have gotten a diesel for the torque and consistent driving experience. As many have said, the ICE on these make a John Deere sound menacing. It is archaic and rough. If I had a magic wand, I'd want more electric miles or have it mated with a 6 cylinder. The other disappointment has been resale value. I thought about trading it for an i4 M50 to take advantage of the EV rebates before end of year and my trade in was $36K with a 45K lease residual. Glad I like driving it. Moral of the story- great lease Jeep, mostly fun but far from flawless.

 

[jeepoch]

Leasing is for sure the only attractive plan when driving any type of EV. You are obviously worried about any over/under value at lease expiration, imagine the loss in resale when that battery is depleted and needs to be replaced.

Take advantage of the incentives. Get the rest of us poor schmucks to chip in. Within today's society it's clearly everyone for themselves. Take every advantage they offer, if nothing other than to just clear their stockpiling inventory.

If it's purely manufacturer incentives and not subsidies, then we all win. The automotive company will take the hit and add it in to their next bailout exercise. Of course if that happens, then we all lose.

In the end, do what you want. You'll gain your own experience if you do. You'll need to balance weighing any regret vs relief from your own perspective regardless.

Personally, I'm going to avoid the EV gambit for as long as possible. My daily commute falls well outside the nominal operating conditions of any battery solution. I'm routinely externally charging my batts now on my 3.6L as it is. I know, I know, apples to oranges in comparison. But I'm a skeptic and have zero to little confidence that batteries are the answer. They certainly are not yet ready for primetime, at least not for anyone with other than short commutes, a temperate climate and a reliable power grid.

It sounds like you can make it work. Go for it.

Jay

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