The "hate" on Jeeps + Speed

[Reflektr]

And thats the crux of all the arguments here. Its the "for what it is" of it all. Can you hustle a 392 around a track and be on the edge of rolling it? Sure but that doest make a wrangler fast or be something that should be looked at for going fast in that context. Can you bounce a JLU up Chocolate Thunder at 25mph? Sure but that 4400 is sure gonna do it faster. Will a Mojave waddle itself 60+ over some whoops in the Arizona desert? Yea but a TRX or Raptor will do it 100+ smoother. At the end of the day the Wrangler should never be the choice do to anything "fast". Anyone can go ahead and try to make it something to do those things, but its still shouldnt be the first choice.

Nail on the head right there. As a mechanic I’ve generally always been a “right tool for the job” kind of person. Yeah, you can build or modify many things to try and accomplish whatever it is you’re going for, but at what point does it stop being what it was.

I remember looking at magazine builds when I was a teen and rolling my eyes when I found out there was literally nothing original left of the cover vehicle. Magazine covers were the “Click Bait” of the 1990’s.

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[Ratbert]

On December 14th it was snowing hard with 10-12 inches of fresh snow on the ground. I drove 2 and a half hours to Rausch Creek and it was basically deserted due to the weather. There was a dozen jeeps in our group, and we had the entire place to ourselves except for another group of 5. Which gave us an opportunity to use Rausch's high speed course. I have a 2021 392 with 35x12.50's Kenda Klever M/T2 KR629's, a 3 inch AEV lift with their HD springs, and Bilstein 8100 remote reservoirs.

That course was originally built to host a Ford Raptor racing series (pickups). It consists of fine crushed gravel which is graded and has no large rocks. It has multiple small jumps, and a few water bars. I snagged the opportunity to take the lead, and I got to go as fast as I wanted to. 4 hi, traction and stability aids disabled, offroad+ enabled, and exhaust valves open. I had the time of my life flying through the woods at freeway speeds in 10-12 inches of fresh powder, drifting through every turn, and ramping the small jumps at speed. The vehicle and it's suspension never felt uncomposed to me, and the 392 / 8 speed pulls like a runaway freight train.

I'm no professional driver. I've been driving cars/trucks/bikes, and operating heavy equipment for 4+ decades. I've drag raced cars and bikes, done my share of motorcycle road racing track days, and ridden enduro and motocross. I was pushing my comfort zone around that course, but that jeep had a lot more left for someone with more skill and bigger balls.

With the current suspension and aired up to 34 psi, it is stable on a deserted offramp to the point that you can work the edge of traction by listening to the tires. In that situation, you can be cautiously aggressive with the throttle but you MUST be smooth. You can predictably modulate traction with your right foot or the steering wheel in that situation. There isn't much body roll or weight transfer if you are smooth.

Of all the vehicles I've owned, this one is my favorite by far. It's like a 60's muscle car that I can do blue and black trails in. On road, or off road, it's a blast.

Pre-runners though, are a bit of a different animal. They tend to exploit a longer wheelbase and independent front suspension for increased stability on whoops and jumps. My boss owned a 1st gen Raptor with 6.2L, now he owns a 2025 Raptor. Both of those vehicles are substantially more stable at high speeds on rough or undulating terrain.

Rally-cross favors a low center of gravity and you could build a low cog jeep, but it would still be heavier than desirable with a lot more un-sprung mass. On the other hand,

Man, you are so confused it’s almost impressive. The crotchety old men on these here forums have spoken, shaking their canes with ultimate authority.

You're NOT having FUN at speed in a Wrangler! Absolutely NOT! How DARE you suggest otherwise!

Case closed.

Admins: please delete this thread.

 

[Ratbert]

Gotta love the your own lights shining in your face!

 

[Sean L]

Gotta love the your own lights shining in your face!

I don't think anybody has used those in YEARS. But they've got neat remote controls to point them where you need the light. We just don't have much night work right now.

 

[yokramer]

Admins: please delete this thread.

Woah what the fuck did the puppies do to you?

 

[Ratbert]

Woah what the fuck did the puppies do to you?

Shit, we can't have fun driving fast and we can't ask for threads to be deleted anymore? WTF?

 

[yokramer]

Shit, we can't have fun driving fast and we can't ask for threads to be deleted anymore? WTF?

Yea you know what @Opus does when a thread gets deleted

 

[2nd 392]

Nail on the head right there. As a mechanic I’ve generally always been a “right tool for the job” kind of person. Yeah, you can build or modify many things to try and accomplish whatever it is you’re going for, but at what point does it stop being what it was.

I remember looking at magazine builds when I was a teen and rolling my eyes when I found out there was literally nothing original left of the cover vehicle. Magazine covers were the “Click Bait” of the 1990’s.

Hey, my 63’s body was “almost” original when I got finished, everything else swapped or upgraded. But there was no alternative back then if you wanted great off road and on road performance.

 

[Zandcwhite]

Serious question for the gatekeepers of fast, is a demon 170 swapped gladiator still not fast because it doesn't track like a 911? Personally I would say anything that does 0-60 in 2.7s is fast and the fact that it will do it on tons and 40s is even more impressive. But it's a solid axle Jeep so it can't be fast right?

 

[yokramer]

Serious question for the gatekeepers of fast, is a demon 170 swapped gladiator still not fast because it doesn't track like a 911? Personally I would say anything that does 0-60 in 2.7s is fast and the fact that it will do it on tons and 40s is even more impressive. But it's a solid axle Jeep so it can't be fast right?

You can put a 1500hp big block in a Chevy Spark too doesnt make Chevy Sparks fast.

 

[2nd 392]

Serious question for the gatekeepers of fast, is a demon 170 swapped gladiator still not fast because it doesn't track like a 911? Personally I would say anything that does 0-60 in 2.7s is fast and the fact that it will do it on tons and 40s is even more impressive. But it's a solid axle Jeep so it can't be fast right?

The early 3.73 392’s could break 12 sec. by removing the spare while bumping the speed limiter. The video is likely still available. The fastest NA “Muscle Car” ever was the 11.7 sec. 19 Challenger Scat Pack 1320. The only one out of the top 10 to break 11 seconds, the only Classic is the Boss 9 at 12.3. Shaving another second off the 392 shouldn’t be extremely difficult. …. And still very capable off road.
Think about that Y’all.
Stats per “Top Speed”

 

[Zandcwhite]

You can put a 1500hp big block in a Chevy Spark too doesnt make Chevy Sparks fast.

It would make at least 1 spark fast though? That's the problem with statements like Jeeps aren't fast. Most aren't. The 392 absolutely is in a straight line, 4.5s 0-60 is faster than even the super limited production muscle cars which @Terrymo used as the bench mark... until I pointed that out. Nobody claimed they were the fastest bricks on the planet. Nobody said they make good track cars. But fast is fast. Fast enough on the dirt that the Jeep is more capable than the fear most on this forum would ever let them find out.

 

[yokramer]

It would make at least 1 spark fast though? That's the problem with statements like Jeeps aren't fast. Most aren't. The 392 absolutely is in a straight line, 4.5s 0-60 is faster than even the super limited production muscle cars which @Terrymo used as the bench mark... until I pointed that out. Nobody claimed they were the fastest bricks on the planet. Nobody said they make good track cars. But fast is fast. Fast enough on the dirt that the Jeep is more capable than the fear most on this forum would ever let them find out.

Still doesnt make a Spark or a Jeep a vehicle to buy if you want to go the general perception of the word "fast". Like has been stated over and over, the Wrangler is fast for what it is and there is nothing wrong with that.

 

[Ratbert]

Still doesnt make a Spark or a Jeep a vehicle to buy if you want to go the general perception of the word "fast". Like has been stated over and over, the Wrangler is fast for what it is and there is nothing wrong with that.

Today I learned that ~4.5 second 0-60 vehicles are no longer considered "fast". Yep, it's all relative.

They suck balls when you put curves in the mix, but that's true for pretty much anything from US-based Stellantis companies.

Man, I miss my '99 10AE Miata. It sure as hell wasn't fast, but fuck yeah it was fun!

 

[liquids]

There is definitely hate, or something like it. On the pre-JL forum (before this one existed) I got ripped for relaying my attempt to see how fast my stock '08 JKU could go on a dead flat, straight, empty, rural interstate at 7am on a Sunday morning.

For those curious, it was 104 mph, and I had to drop the MT down to 5th to get the rpms up and into a higher torque band to get the acceleration needed to get beyond 93. I would have gotten more out of it, but at 104 my radar detector beeped. 30 seconds later I was at 70 mph when I innocently passed the state trooper going the other way. I'm sure he thought there was no way a Wrangler was doing that.

People have since reminded me that the tires are the most serious limiting factor.

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