JL Rubicon Axle Question

[rcr1340]

I have watched all the Lite Brite videos(and alot of JL wheelin' videos) and they wheel the hell out of the JLUR. They did install RCV's recently but not because it broke, just for more strength. There are also Chro-Mo rear axles available from Dana-Spicer. I believe with the front and rear shaft upgrades they will last very well. Only time will tell. Also, you can get the RCV's with or without the FAD. RCV claims there is only a 5% strength difference between the 2.

Sponsored

 

[mgroeger]

That's all well and good for the Rubi's, they have Dana 44s in them. The question is what about the M200 (which replaced the Dana 35 piece of crap) axles that are in the Sport and Saharas?

 

[Kel 78]

So for the non Rubi owners...

We have the Sahara and right now I have Rubi rims/tires on it, 2.5" RC spacer lift and will be throwing a Rubi suspension on it soon as well as an aluminum Barricade bumper and a 9500 lb winch. When these 33"ers wear out I'm thinking about 35". It is my understanding after researching that the DANA M200 has a 7.87" ring gear and NO C-Clips where as the old DANA 35 has a 7.62" ring gear and does have C-Clips, which as we all know, love to snap. So in summary the M200 is much sturdier than the 35.
Will the new M200 handle 35" tires OR should I consider a re-gear/internal upgrade or flat out M220 upgrade? We are already talking about dropping some $ and have a locking diff installed. We off road whenever possible and do a decent amount of rock crawling. And the answer to why we didn't buy a Rubi is because we didn't plan it out.

I Have a Sport S JLU. I have 35" tires on mine and I have gone on 4 and 5 trails with no issues I also drive like 500 miles to get to work. 17,000 miles on it and no issues. I am planning a axle swap to the Rubicon axles here this month so that I can have a better starting base to build from. I dont see the need to regear dana 30s and 35s. I will eventually regear the 44s

 

[mgroeger]

I Have a Sport S JLU. I have 35" tires on mine and I have gone on 4 and 5 trails with no issues I also drive like 500 miles to get to work. 17,000 miles on it and no issues. I am planning a axle swap to the Rubicon axles here this month so that I can have a better starting base to build from. I dont see the need to regear dana 30s and 35s. I will eventually regear the 44s

OK, glad I can bump to 35's with no issues. Why would you regear the Dana44s but not the 35s?

 

[JIMBOX]

If you're switching to RUBICON AXLES(4.10), why will you regear--??

JIMBO

 

[Kel 78]

OK, glad I can bump to 35's with no issues. Why would you regear the Dana44s but not the 35s?

Well I could regear to accommodate 37" but I would also need to upgrade axel shafts. The other issue is lockers. Time I add the gear and the kit for the gears to go from 3.73 to 4.88 then axles shafts and then lockers to be in the smaller dana 30 and 35 i can have the dealership put the dana 44 Rubicon 4.10 axle with electric lockers in under warranty for the same price. Then I can always regear a stronger axle to 4.88+.

 

[mgroeger]

The Dana35s were prone to snap especially when lockers and bigger tires were added. I wonder if the M200 are more robust that they can handle having a locker.

 

[ChattVol]

The Dana35s were prone to snap especially when lockers and bigger tires were added. I wonder if the M200 are more robust that they can handle having a locker.

@Kel 78
I went deep down this path last month and was the guinea pig doing a full jl d44 conversion on a sport. You can read about ot here:
https://www.jlwranglerforums.com/forum/threads/billet-stallion-sport-s-d44-conversion.19973/

 

[mgroeger]

@Kel 78
I went deep down this path last month and was the guinea pig doing a full jl d44 conversion on a sport. You can read about ot here:
https://www.jlwranglerforums.com/forum/threads/billet-stallion-sport-s-d44-conversion.19973/

Good grief that was a lot of info... lol.
The problem is it doesn't answer my question. Seems like no one has put lockers on the new M200 rear axle yet. It's not correct to call it a D35 either, the D35 used C clips and the axles were prone to snapping whereas the M200 is not the same design and has no C clips.
I was shocked to hear him say the M200 struggled with the 315s. I've seen people run up to 37s and had no complaints. I also believe the Sahara has 3.73 rear gears. I was also shocked to hear him say he struggled up a moderate hill with open diffs. My wife's Sahara, aired down to around 25psi and in 4L is a beast. We have climbed up some seriously tricky areas and had little to no problems. I was shocked at how well it did with open diffs. I have an '04 LJ with lockers and she went right up after me with only a little slipping.

 

[rcr1340]

Good grief that was a lot of info... lol.
The problem is it doesn't answer my question. Seems like no one has put lockers on the new M200 rear axle yet. It's not correct to call it a D35 either, the D35 used C clips and the axles were prone to snapping whereas the M200 is not the same design and has no C clips.
I was shocked to hear him say the M200 struggled with the 315s. I've seen people run up to 37s and had no complaints. I also believe the Sahara has 3.73 rear gears. I was also shocked to hear him say he struggled up a moderate hill with open diffs. My wife's Sahara, aired down to around 25psi and in 4L is a beast. We have climbed up some seriously tricky areas and had little to no problems. I was shocked at how well it did with open diffs. I have an '04 LJ with lockers and she went right up after me with only a little slipping.

The only gear available on JL Sport and Saharas are 3.45. Rubicons have 4.10s. JL's have a much deeper 1st gear. 4.71 on auto and 5.13 on manual. With the auto on JL it is equal to a 4.56 gear on gen 2 JK. Drive ratio as follows. 4.71(1st gear)x 3.45(axle ratio)=16.25. JK 3.59x4.56=16.37. Almost exact same drive ratio.

 

[ChattVol]

Good grief that was a lot of info... lol.
The problem is it doesn't answer my question. Seems like no one has put lockers on the new M200 rear axle yet. It's not correct to call it a D35 either, the D35 used C clips and the axles were prone to snapping whereas the M200 is not the same design and has no C clips.
I was shocked to hear him say the M200 struggled with the 315s. I've seen people run up to 37s and had no complaints. I also believe the Sahara has 3.73 rear gears. I was also shocked to hear him say he struggled up a moderate hill with open diffs. My wife's Sahara, aired down to around 25psi and in 4L is a beast. We have climbed up some seriously tricky areas and had little to no problems. I was shocked at how well it did with open diffs. I have an '04 LJ with lockers and she went right up after me with only a little slipping.

My classification of a moderate rutted hill climb is probably different than yours. Point being, lockers are a game changer. The probable reason you arent finding answers to your question anout adding lockers to the sport/sahara is because it doesnt make financial sense. After extensively researching the cost of adding air/e lockers to the sport, it was about the same price and made alot more sense to pay a little more to swap in takeoff jlur d44 axles considering they're significantly stronger and came with bigger brakes, 4.10 gearing and lockers. I talked with Dana design folks and several gurus and they didnt recommend running 35's on the m186 and m200 axles if you're going offroad.

 

[mgroeger]

My classification of a moderate rutted hill climb is probably different than yours. Point being, lockers are a game changer. The probable reason you arent finding answers to your question anout adding lockers to the sport/sahara is because it doesnt make financial sense. After extensively researching the cost of adding air/e lockers to the sport, it was about the same price and made alot more sense to pay a little more to swap in takeoff jlur d44 axles considering they're significantly stronger and came with bigger brakes, 4.10 gearing and lockers. I talked with Dana design folks and several gurus and they didnt recommend running 35's on the m186 and m200 axles if you're going offroad.

Thanks for this info. I did price out a locker for the rear on the Sahara and it came out to around $1500. The Saharas do have the bigger brakes like the Rubi which is a plus but I'm kind of surprised that the Dana folks didn't recommend 35s on the M200. We've got a dealer here throwing the Fox 2" lift and 35s on Sports and since they put on the Mopar lift and 35s it is covered under warranty.
If you don't mind me asking what did you pay per axle for the Dana44s? I'd be interested in the rear only for now.
I have a D44s and Detroit locker on the rear of my '04 LJ and an Eaton electric locker up front. I find that the rear locker is all that is needed 99% of the time especially after seeing my wife climb the rocks and trails with open diffs. She does have the advantage of traction control which helps her and I don't have that.

I talked to a guru on the TJ forum and we were talking about the old Dana 35s. He said he ran 35" tires and offroaded heavily but was always wise and never bounced the rear repeatedly while spinning the tires, he never had a problem. Then the day came when he put a locker in and within a very short period of time he snapped the axle. The axles in the old Dana35 were their weak points.

 

[Litfuse]

Thanks for this info. I did price out a locker for the rear on the Sahara and it came out to around $1500. The Saharas do have the bigger brakes like the Rubi which is a plus but I'm kind of surprised that the Dana folks didn't recommend 35s on the M200. We've got a dealer here throwing the Fox 2" lift and 35s on Sports and since they put on the Mopar lift and 35s it is covered under warranty.
If you don't mind me asking what did you pay per axle for the Dana44s? I'd be interested in the rear only for now.
I have a D44s and Detroit locker on the rear of my '04 LJ and an Eaton electric locker up front. I find that the rear locker is all that is needed 99% of the time especially after seeing my wife climb the rocks and trails with open diffs. She does have the advantage of traction control which helps her and I don't have that.

I talked to a guru on the TJ forum and we were talking about the old Dana 35s. He said he ran 35" tires and offroaded heavily but was always wise and never bounced the rear repeatedly while spinning the tires, he never had a problem. Then the day came when he put a locker in and within a very short period of time he snapped the axle. The axles in the old Dana35 were their weak points.

I can almost guarantee you explode an axle running 35s, no matter if the dealer put them on or not, you will be on your own.

I have seen many D35s explode on the trail. And I’m not sure who thought c-clips were a good idea. I have seen many Wranglers with snapped D35 axles coming out of the trails with a thick branch tied to the frame pressing on the tire to keep the wheel and tire attached so it didn’t fly off. I always chuckled at the sight. I can swear many off-roaders are better engineers than who FCA has doing their designs. Lol

 

[mgroeger]

I can almost guarantee you explode an axle running 35s, no matter if the dealer put them on or not, you will be on your own.

I have seen many D35s explode on the trail. And I’m not sure who thought c-clips were a good idea. I have seen many Wranglers with snapped D35 axles coming out of the trails with a thick branch tied to the frame pressing on the tire to keep the wheel and tire attached so it didn’t fly off. I always chuckled at the sight. I can swear many off-roaders are better engineers than who FCA has doing their designs. Lol

Necessity is the mother of invention

Question though... these are not Dana35s, these are Dana M200s and they no longer use C-Clips that's why I was wondering if I could do it.
I guess the best thing to do is actually call Dana. We do run some pretty tough trails and the last thing I need is axle damage on a daily driver.

 

[Litfuse]

Necessity is the mother of invention

Question though... these are not Dana35s, these are Dana M200s and they no longer use C-Clips that's why I was wondering if I could do it.
I guess the best thing to do is actually call Dana. We do run some pretty tough trails and the last thing I need is axle damage on a daily driver.

I don’t know enough about the m200s, but I would imagine 35s put a lot of stress on an untrussed stock axle. Especially on trails.

Sponsored