Why all 8 arms?

[ExitLeft]

So I'm considering the MetalCoak lift (with Rocksport shocks) for my 2019 JLUR. Still undecided between 2.5" with 35s or 3.5" with 37s. Leaning towards a 2.5" with 35s because it's still unknown how JL axles will hold up to 37s long term. Anyway, in looking at MC's offerings they have the Game Changer with all 8 arms or their Dual Rate lift with only the front upper arms. I realize that replacing the rear arms will help locate the wheels in the wheel wells better, but is there a real advantage to this? More flex? Would I still need to replace the drive shaft if I don't replace all 8 control arms? This is my daily driver with monthly trips to Rausch Creek or AOAA. Would I be better to save the coin and just get the Dual Rate Lift? Also, why include front upper control arms rather than lower? When I had my JKUR, it was the front lower arms that were replaced to help with caster.

Does anyone have any experience with the dual rate lift? any regrets? I assume I can just add the other control arms later if I want them.

Thanks!

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[rustyshakelford]

So I'm considering the MetalCoak lift (with Rocksport shocks) for my 2019 JLUR. Still undecided between 2.5" with 35s or 3.5" with 37s. Leaning towards a 2.5" with 35s because it's still unknown how JL axles will hold up to 37s long term. Anyway, in looking at MC's offerings they have the Game Changer with all 8 arms or their Dual Rate lift with only the front upper arms. I realize that replacing the rear arms will help locate the wheels in the wheel wells better, but is there a real advantage to this? More flex? Would I still need to replace the drive shaft if I don't replace all 8 control arms? This is my daily driver with monthly trips to Rausch Creek or AOAA. Would I be better to save the coin and just get the Dual Rate Lift? Also, why include front upper control arms rather than lower? When I had my JKUR, it was the front lower arms that were replaced to help with caster.

Does anyone have any experience with the dual rate lift? any regrets? I assume I can just add the other control arms later if I want them.

Thanks!

No advice on what’s the best but we went with the game changer rocksport and added the front drive shaft. 3.5” on 37s. Really wanted all the control arms for the adjustability and to have stronger components

Brett

 

[Tech Tim]

So I'm considering the MetalCoak lift (with Rocksport shocks) for my 2019 JLUR. Still undecided between 2.5" with 35s or 3.5" with 37s. Leaning towards a 2.5" with 35s because it's still unknown how JL axles will hold up to 37s long term.

With a Rubicon you can do 37"s with a 2.5" lift no problem.

 

[ExitLeft]

No advice on what’s the best but we went with the game changer rocksport and added the front drive shaft. 3.5” on 37s. Really wanted all the control arms for the adjustability and to have stronger components
Brett

Thanks Brett, hows it been with the kit and 37s? Also what’s you wheel backspacing? I have quadratic 17x8.5 Hardrock wheels with 5.2” Backspacing from my JK that I’d like to run on the JL.

With a Rubicon you can do 37"s with a 2.5" lift no problem.

Thanks Tim, I know you can, but the question is should you. Will the JL Rubi axles be ok with 37s? Time will tell I guess.

Thanks for the replies

 

[rustyshakelford]

Thanks Brett, hows it been with the kit and 37s? Also what’s you wheel backspacing? I have quadratic 17x8.5 Hardrock wheels with 5.2” Backspacing from my JK that I’d like to run on the JL.


Thanks Tim, I know you can, but the question is should you. Will the JL Rubi axles be ok with 37s? Time will tell I guess.

Thanks for the replies

We’re still waiting for our Jeep. Spend a bunch of time on with phone with MC when planning our build. Hope to get it sometime during the week of the 17th. Have everything sitting in the shop ready to go. Have Dana 5.13 ready to roll when I put it all together to help move that big meat with the 6 speed

Brett

 

[XJrider]

Jeeps are 5 links and yes your assumptions are correct. Ive installed this same lift on 2 jk’s in the past.
First, primarily the front lower control arms provide the centering of the axle as well as lever arm for the springs and dampeners to cycle off of (more on operating angle later). They also provide a pivot point to which the upper arms can influence caster and pinion angle in tamdem (one in detriment to the other). Its more common to adjust caster with lower control arms but you can do just the same with uppers,its just after adding lift and increasing operating angle of LCA’s you actually shorten wheelbase a touch. Longer lowers will re-center wheel in wells. Shortening upper control arms will give you positive caster , lengthening lowers will also add positive caster.

Secondly, when you step up to a full kit and 37’s matching rear adjustable “trailing arms” will also allow you to set pinion angle as well as re center wheels in wheel well. Also they have better contour and allow for a lot more articulation over stock ... like , a LOT more. The downward articulation is impressive with the duel rate springs. They are not the most soft riding kits tho. Cloak kits and the joints they put in those arms are actually really good. The flag nut in the rear upper arm is a major pain in the ass to thread so enjoy that.

Dont get 5.13’s unless yr running 37’s.

 

[Schmeegz]

I am in the exact same boat. I am torn between true dual rate and the game changer. I’ve decided on 2.5” for sure and am staying with 35’s on my JLUR

 

[ExitLeft]

Jeeps are 5 links and yes your assumptions are correct. Ive installed this same lift on 2 jk’s in the past.
First, primarily the front lower control arms provide the centering of the axle as well as lever arm for the springs and dampeners to cycle off of (more on operating angle later). They also provide a pivot point to which the upper arms can influence caster and pinion angle in tamdem (one in detriment to the other). Its more common to adjust caster with lower control arms but you can do just the same with uppers,its just after adding lift and increasing operating angle of LCA’s you actually shorten wheelbase a touch. Longer lowers will re-center wheel in wells. Shortening upper control arms will give you positive caster , lengthening lowers will also add positive caster.

Secondly, when you step up to a full kit and 37’s matching rear adjustable “trailing arms” will also allow you to set pinion angle as well as re center wheels in wheel well. Also they have better contour and allow for a lot more articulation over stock ... like , a LOT more. The downward articulation is impressive with the duel rate springs. They are not the most soft riding kits tho. Cloak kits and the joints they put in those arms are actually really good. The flag nut in the rear upper arm is a major pain in the ass to thread so enjoy that.

Dont get 5.13’s unless yr running 37’s.

Thanks for the info. appreciate the reply

 

[Tech Tim]

Thanks Tim, I know you can, but the question is should you. Will the JL Rubi axles be ok with 37s? Time will tell I guess.

@ExitLeft , you've got for sure... Time will tell... these new axles are better than the JK axles which seemed to come apart if they just looked at 37s :cwl:. Ok, maybe not that bad, but not that far off.

We've had 37s under the bosses JLUR since February and so far everything has been holding up. I believe it has more than 8K miles on it. Admittedly it's not getting wheeled every weekend, but when it does get wheeled, the boss isn't afraid to use it.

My comment was more saying that you didn't need to 3.5" for 37s, the 2.5" is fine. So go 2.5" and 35s until you feel you're wanting to go bigger and if you do, your JL can fit them!

 

[ExitLeft]

@ExitLeft , you've got for sure... Time will tell... these new axles are better than the JK axles which seemed to come apart if they just looked at 37s :cwl:. Ok, maybe not that bad, but not that far off.

We've had 37s under the bosses JKUR since February and so far everything has been holding up. I believe it has more than 8K miles on it. Admittedly it's not getting wheeled every weekend, but when it does get wheeled, the boss isn't afraid to use it.

My comment was more saying that you didn't need to 3.5" for 37s, the 2.5" is fine. So go 2.5" and 35s until you feel you're wanting to go bigger and if you do, your JL can fit them!

Good to know. Thanks for clarifying, 8k miles and no known issues is saying something.

 

[JLUSoCal]

@ExitLeft , you've got for sure... Time will tell... these new axles are better than the JK axles which seemed to come apart if they just looked at 37s :cwl:. Ok, maybe not that bad, but not that far off.

We've had 37s under the bosses JKUR since February and so far everything has been holding up. I believe it has more than 8K miles on it. Admittedly it's not getting wheeled every weekend, but when it does get wheeled, the boss isn't afraid to use it.

My comment was more saying that you didn't need to 3.5" for 37s, the 2.5" is fine. So go 2.5" and 35s until you feel you're wanting to go bigger and if you do, your JL can fit them!

Tim, did you mean JKUR or JLUR? I think the latter.

 

[Tech Tim]

Tim, did you mean JKUR or JLUR? I think the latter.

Yes, JLUR... damn fast fingers... :cwl:

 

[Fire Burns]

Hoping they'll hold up to the 38s I intend to install. No plans to change the axels unless problems arise.

 

[Namib]

Thanks Brett, hows it been with the kit and 37s? Also what’s you wheel backspacing? I have quadratic 17x8.5 Hardrock wheels with 5.2” Backspacing from my JK that I’d like to run on the JL.

I am running 3.5" Game Changer and 37s. I do not think the 5.2" backspacing will work - You will need to push it out at least a 0.5", maybe 0.75". I have Method 307s with 4.75 backspacing and that is pushing it. I believe they recommend 4.5".

 

[ExitLeft]

I am running 3.5" Game Changer and 37s. I do not think the 5.2" backspacing will work - You will need to push it out at least a 0.5", maybe 0.75". I have Method 307s with 4.75 backspacing and that is pushing it. I believe they recommend 4.5".

Thanks @Namib What interferes? Is it the front relocation brackets? Or the rear sway bar link? In doing some research, it seems I may be able to run 5.2 backspace if I don't install the front shock relocation brackets and if I use a drop bracket on the rear sway bar (instead of a longer links). It's a bit confusing, especially since MetalCloak's website asks if your wheels are more or less than 5.5" backspacing. 5.2 is less than 5.5, but may still cause issues.
Thanks again!

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