JL Security in the Digital Age

[RussJeep1]

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A recent post by much liked forum member Tai @TaiMc , and her choice to use a physical locking device on her rig to reduce the likelihood of its theft beyond the security mechanisms provided by FCA got me thinking that this subject matter might deserve its own thread, and that her actions may not seem as silly or paranoid as we may think (I just don't know.)

I have a Club (TM) device sitting unused in my garage. I'm not in a particularly high vehicle car theft area, (as if vehicle's aren't stolen from all zip codes) but I've been reading lately about how people are encapsulating their key fobs in radio frequency transmission blockage devices https://clark.com/cars/can-wrapping-your-key-fob-in-foil-stop-car-thieves-we-put-it-to-the-test/ be that tin foil or a Faraday bag https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Faraday_cage (think the bag that came with your electronic toll pass device (e.g. EZ Pass (TM)) etc. to inactivate its signal when circumstances warrant.)

You'll note I "copied" Mark, @Blkjak maker of the much loved here leather key fob holder (disclaimer: I'm a happy client.) Maybe if this fear of thieves zeroing in on fob transmissions is legitimate, that some sort of Faraday key fob encapsulating device (with easy ability to open when transmitting via the fob) could be (or he'll want to offer such things) integrated into his product line.

Can anyone speak to the legitimacy of such theft mechanisms? I must admit to hearing more about the *possibility* that such theft is possible than it actually happening: which may only be my ignorance here.

Should we be backing up our rig's base security with such Club like devices, or at least making them part of the gear we travel with for installation when parking in higher none crime areas?

I will also reiterate my 2 cents from another post. If you choose to go this route, devices that merely attach around the steering wheel (and not the brake pedal) are IMHO not worth the money.

Both designs safety motivated: a steering wheel is designed to give to reduce injuries in an accident, and easily cut by a hacksaw. A brake pedal is made of metal not subject to easy bending/breaking/sheering. And a "chain" (the auto theft reduction device) "is only as strong as its weakest link" (the steering wheel or brake pedal.)

Thoughts?

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[AMG]

My bare bones 1997 TJ had a hidden toggle switch that needed to be flipped before the engine could start. I have no idea if that's possible in the JL with all of its technology, but it was a simple way to get some extra peace of mind.

Edit - spelling

 

[RussJeep1]

My bare bones 1997 TJ had a hidden toggle switch that needed to be flipped before the engine could start. I have no idea if that's possible in the JL with all of its technology, but it was a simple way to get some extra piece of mind.

I had a vehicle back in the day with the same feature.

I wonder if an FCA dealer would even install it. I say this not so much because it is necessarily a difficult thing to do, provided you have knowledge of what wires to tap, and can possibly be a DIY or 3rd party installer job, but my fear that having all but an FCA dealer futz with such things might be warranty risking.

 

[PavementWarrior]

Maybe a 30 second slow down, and guys really after stuff use tow trucks. It would not hurt if you are parking someplace wierd I suppose, but anything other than punks I doubt its gonna help.

Number 1 use of a club is actually as a club, its not really a weapon wink wink

 

[old8tora]

Can anyone speak to the legitimacy of such theft mechanisms? I must admit to hearing more about the *possibility* that such theft is possible than it actually happening: which may only be my ignorance here.Thoughts?

My JK has the following : (a) Club ; (b) stainless steel chain anchored to seat extender and wrapped around steering wheel and club , and padlocked ; (c) Tuffy hood lock ; (d) wheel locks ; spare inside , and heavy-duty bicycle chain lock if spare ever put in trail rack outside ; (e) black card over vin behind windshield preventing dealer giving thief entry to my vin ; (f , g , and h) various strong means of self-defense within reach .

Theft has happened to others , but not to me . Wonder why ?

 

[rustyshakelford]

Get a manual. It’s the most effective anti theft device for these millennials

Brett

 

[Redneck_Jedi]

Maybe a switch or something to make the Jeep think the door is still open. The JL's anoying Autopark feature would prevent the vehicle from being driven away.

 

[RussJeep1]

Maybe a 30 second slow down, and guys really after stuff use tow trucks. It would not hurt if you are parking someplace wierd I suppose, but anything other than punks I doubt its gonna help.

Number 1 use of a club is actually as a club, its not really a weapon wink wink

Yes, the steering wheel lock's a waste of money. The brake lock is, I think, a lot better value.

 

[RussJeep1]

Maybe a switch or something to make the Jeep think the door is still open. The JL's anoying Autopark feature would prevent the vehicle from being driven away.

Love it! The greatest payback after thwarting a criminal....driving them insane!

 

[Blkjak]

A recent post by much liked forum member Tai @TaiMc , and her choice to use a physical locking device on her rig to reduce the likelihood of its theft beyond the security mechanisms provided by FCA got me thinking that this subject matter might deserve its own thread, and that her actions may not seem as silly or paranoid as we may think (I just don't know.)

I have a Club (TM) device sitting unused in my garage. I'm not in a particularly high vehicle car theft area, (as if vehicle's aren't stolen from all zip codes) but I've been reading lately about how people are encapsulating their key fobs in radio frequency transmission blockage devices https://clark.com/cars/can-wrapping-your-key-fob-in-foil-stop-car-thieves-we-put-it-to-the-test/ be that tin foil or a Faraday bag https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Faraday_cage (think the bag that came with your electronic toll pass device (e.g. EZ Pass (TM)) etc. to inactivate its signal when circumstances warrant.)

You'll note I "copied" Mark, @Blkjak maker of the much loved here leather key fob holder (disclaimer: I'm a happy client.) Maybe if this fear of thieves zeroing in on fob transmissions is legitimate, that some sort of Faraday key fob encapsulating device (with easy ability to open when transmitting via the fob) could be (or he'll want to offer such things) integrated into his product line.

Can anyone speak to the legitimacy of such theft mechanisms? I must admit to hearing more about the *possibility* that such theft is possible than it actually happening: which may only be my ignorance here.

Should we be backing up our rig's base security with such Club like devices, or at least making them part of the gear we travel with for installation when parking in higher none crime areas?

I will also reiterate my 2 cents from another post. If you choose to go this route, devices that merely attach around the steering wheel (and not the brake pedal) are IMHO not worth the money.

Both designs safety motivated: a steering wheel is designed to give to reduce injuries in an accident, and easily cut by a hacksaw. A brake pedal is made of metal not subject to easy bending/breaking/sheering. And a "chain" (the auto theft reduction device) "is only as strong as its weakest link" (the steering wheel or brake pedal.)

Thoughts?

Hello RussJeep1, Thank you for the shout out and being a valued customer.
Tia@TiaMc reached out to me early on regarding doing this. I have invested a considerable about of time into trying to develop something for her. I have learned that their are a lot of "RF Blocking" fabrics out there and from my experience most of them are junk.
A high level overview of how the system work on most vehicle is that when (for example) you activate proximity entry via the handle, the system wakes up and via antennas in the vehicle it transmits a signal to out key to wake the key up. Once the key receives this, it transmits a code back to the vehicle (which confirms the code) and unlocks the doors. When you hit the start button, a similar sequence happens. This is different than say remotely reading a credit card as the card does not transmit. In order to secure this for our FOBs, we would need to prevent signal transmission into and from the FOB. From my test with several different fabrics, multiple layers of fabric wrapped in various directs is needed (at least for those that I have tested) and the FOB must be completely contained within. I have had several test where as the wrapping was good 7 out of 10 times, but getting it to 100% consistently has been a challenge. I am sure TiaMC thinks that I have forgotten about her, but I have not. I am hoping to find a solution that I am confident in that also doesn't looks that something I would be proud to show.
The sad reality is that no matter what we do, we can only be a deterrent thieves. I am a big believer in a strong sense of situational awareness, a good dog and the ability to protect yourself and others.
If I come up with anything, TiaMc will be the first to know ...
I wish I had better news

 

[Blkjak]

I prefer 37 mm anti-tank myself ; they were towed behind Jeeps during WW 2 .

I hear you...always kind of trusted my old 1911 myself .. it's a little more portable and concealable ... but a strong display of force with 37mm can be one hell of a deterrent

 

[TaiMc]

....I am sure TaiMc thinks that I have forgotten about her, but I have not. I am hoping to find a solution that I am confident in that also doesn't looks that something I would be proud to show.
The sad reality is that no matter what we do, we can only be a deterrent thieves. I am a big believer in a strong sense of situational awareness, a good dog and the ability to protect yourself and others.
If I come up with anything, TaiMc will be the first to know ...
I wish I had better news

Not at all! ALL Good and Don't worry, I'm patient!

 

[Kent5]

Faraday bags are cheap and easy to test. Drop the fob in the bag, jump in the car and try to start it. Repeat a few times with the bagged fob near the start switch. If the car can’t read the fob, a man-in-the-middle scanner will have a very hard time reading it as well. Foolproof? Nope, but pretty good for most civilian purposes.

As previously mentioned, another effective method would be a hidden toggle switch. Good selection of wires to tap that, if interrupted, would prevent drive-away theft without risking normal vehicle circuit function. For example: toggling the brake pedal switch would prevent shifting from Park on an automatic. Similarly, toggling the clutch switch prevents engaging the starter on the manual. (Yes, I know about the low-range override, but most jerks stealing cars wouldn’t) There is a lot more — that’s just a sampling of a few simple & quick ones.

For me, I just keep the keys under control, do my best to stay out of high-risk areas, and carry good insurance. No passive or non-deadly force method is going to stop a determined thief with a trailer.

Remember “impossible to steal” is unrealistic for most of us — we’re just trying to make it more difficult.

 

[TaiMc]

Maybe a 30 second slow down, and guys really after stuff use tow trucks. It would not hurt if you are parking someplace wierd I suppose, but anything other than punks I doubt its gonna help.

Number 1 use of a club is actually as a club, its not really a weapon wink wink

LOLLLLLL! Mann this video was hilarious! Dude was struggling and he got a good workout trying to get it off. This still makes me happy about my decision to get the Club. They were not able to take it off quickly and they needed huge bolt cutters to get it which seems like it would be hard for a thief to get inside the Jeep, close the door and try to get enough leverage inside the cabin to cut it off, because of lack of room. Otherwise they would have to leave the door open to have enough room for the bolt cutters but that wouldn't be too inconspicuous; which defeats the entire method of stealing a vehicle: Quick & discreet.

So thanks for posting this video lol, gives me more peace of mind than before! :cwl:

 

[TaiMc]

...Can anyone speak to the legitimacy of such theft mechanisms? I must admit to hearing more about the *possibility* that such theft is possible than it actually happening: which may only be my ignorance here....

I will say that this a problem in my city, as I first came to know about it because an entire story was featured on the news about it earlier this year. It is a real problem. Peoples' vehicles are being stolen from their driveways while they sleep because their key fob code/frequency was copied.

As for my fob, I made my own little device that consists of bobby hair pins and foil, in which I've wrapped in cute green fabric :cwl:

It works quite well, as when I get into the jeep and try to start it with my "device" the Jeep will say "key fob not detected".
I'll just roll with this until @Blkjak designs a beastly product

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