Undersized Winch Results

[nU7OuxIx]

I have a stock Jeep winch and I was surprised to see that it's only 8,000 pounds. When I tow a trailer, it's starting to get up to the max weight capacity of the winch.

Simple question, what happens if you use an 8,000lb winch to recover a 10,000lb load? Does it just make noise and not move anything? Does it start smoking? I'm trying to see the signs before any damage occurs.

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[Suffolklou]

Interestingly enough, the pull strength also depends on how much winch rope is still on the drum. Typically you would not be pulling dead weight, you would be winchin and trying to drive out at the same time. Use a pulley and double your weight.

 

[Terrymo]

Here’s the short answer from a recovery training course my wife and I took

A number of variables go into estimating the stuck load:
Stuck Factors are:
Weight of the vehicle and its contents (aka Gross Vehicle Weight “GVW)
Type of material it’s stuck in and how deep
Slope to be pulled up or down


Here’s the longer version if math doesn’t make your eyes glaze over

Ground Conditions Resistance
For only shallowly stuck (i.e. no traction) here are the numbers for various types of ground. Don’t try to memorize them all. Assume 70% for mud and 35% for any other type of ground. Those numbers will get you close enough in your calculations in the field.

% OF GVW
Pavement/ Hard Surface 2-4%
Grass 8-14%
Wet sand 15-20%
Gravel 10-20%
Soft, Dry sand 25-35%
Light, shallow mud 30-35%
Heavy, deep mud 40-60%
Deep Clay Mud 50-70%

Depth Resistance
(Overrides ground condition “ use this instead of the shallowly stuck numbers above.)

Up to axles 100% of GVW
Top of the tires 200% of GVW
Hood / Body 300% of GVW

Slope Resistance
(Gravity has to be taken into account. It adds to the load for uphill pull)
Slope in degrees divided by 60 times the vehicle’s weight up to a 60-degree slope. For a more severe angle, use 100% of vehicle weight.

Let’s say the vehicle is on a 30-degree slope: 30 degrees / 60 = 50% x 5,000 GVW = 2,500 lbs.

Finally Calculation
Add ground conditions resistance (or depth resistance) to slope resistance for load estimate.

 

[BDinTX]

While Lou and Terry are attempting to be helpful, I understand what you're really asking.

Your 8k winch won't work. Tell you wife the internet says you need a new Warn 12-S XD winch. Linked for your convenience.

Warn Zeon XD 12S Winch | 110012|Northridge4x4

You're welcome.

 

[Terrymo]

While Lou and Terry are attempting to be helpful, I understand what you're really asking.

Your 8k winch won't work. Tell you wife the internet says you need a new Warn 12-S XD winch. Linked for your convenience.

Warn Zeon XD 12S Winch | 110012|Northridge4x4

You're welcome.

How did I miss the obvious here?

 

[BDinTX]

How did I miss the obvious here?

Your writeup looked pretty thorough though, nice work. I find myself adding valuable commentary less and less these days. One benefit is the entire internet doesn't swoop down and tell me I'm wrong.

 

[Terrymo]

Your writeup looked pretty thorough though, nice work. I find myself adding valuable commentary less and less these days. One benefit is the entire internet doesn't swoop down and tell me I'm wrong.

Those cut and paste for dummies classes really paid off for me today. Credit to Tom Severin at Badlands 4x4 Training.

 

[Snacktime]

Typically the only difference is the gear reduction between 8k and 12k winches. Just carry a pulley so you can double down when needed. The 12k winch gear reduction lowers the amp load while winching which is why I always run the bigger winch.

If I had a 8k winch I would just change how I winch vs buying a bigger winch. Its not a bad idea to carry an winch extension and 2-3 pullies with any setup to allow for complex rigging.

 

[2nd 392]

How did I miss the obvious here?

At the risk of being told I’m wrong again about the old rule of thumb, it was a winch at least 2x the vehicle weight, A JLU is ~5K lbs before a single mod, supplies or equipment loaded, or fat arse sitting in it. 8K was typical on our small light Willys, Jeep uses an 8K on a Jeep that can be 6K lbs just with passengers. …..

 

[Terrymo]

At the risk of being told I’m wrong again about the old rule of thumb, it was a winch at least 2x the vehicle weight, A JLU is ~5K lbs before a single mod, supplies or equipment loaded, or fat arse sitting in it. 8K was typical on our small light Willys, Jeep uses an 8K on a Jeep that can be 6K lbs just with passengers. …..

Good info.
I’m assuming if you’re married you don’t need anyone else telling you you’re wrong

 

[Pape]

8k is more than enough for standard jeep equipment / general public / soccer mom.
As other mentioned get a snatch block to double your pulling power or 3 to quadruple it.... make sure you have the matching equipment to go along with it.

I recommend you get familiar with rigging and recovery before upgrading the winch.

 

[2nd 392]

Good info.
I’m assuming if you’re married you don’t need anyone else telling you you’re wrong

 

[cj7ox]

OP, just remember that the max rating for the winch is when you only have one wrap on the drum (i.e. the very last layer of line on the winch, which is immediately touching the drum - MAKE SURE YOU ALWAYS HAVE AT LEAST 5 WRAPS ON THE DRUM). You can overcome that by using snatch blocks (pulleys) to increase the amount of weight the winch can pull. It just means you'll need more line (extensions), and the rigging will get a little more complex than if you had a heavier winch. It'll still get the job done.

 

[2nd 392]

8k is more than enough for standard jeep equipment / general public / soccer mom.
As other mentioned get a snatch block to double your pulling power or 3 to quadruple it.... make sure you have the matching equipment to go along with it.

I recommend you get familiar with rigging and recovery before upgrading the winch.

Correct, if you have sufficient cable to the nearest anchor point. Anyway, I would never buy an 8K for a JLU, but if I bought one with an 8K, yeah, do what you can to make it work.

 

[Pape]

Correct, if you have sufficient cable to the nearest anchor point. Anyway, I would never buy an 8K for a JLU, but if I bought one with an 8K, yeah, do what you can to make it work.

I agree, if you have the chance to chose get a 10 or a 12. Unless the OP have money to waste: getting the snatch block, shackle, tree saver / strap and make due with what you have would be the course of action. Especially as is concern look to be for self recovery, this is where the use of snatch block is the easiest and provide the most return. The cable length is always the issue

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