Jeep TRUE off-road ruggedized version (base)

[Zandcwhite]

To me it would make sense to sell a “bare” Rubicon, with the luxury goodies being options vs “standard”. Knock a few k$ off the base price and allow folks to build with comfort items as they wish. There are some folks who’d buy a stripped rubicon, others would opt them up. (Might see a lot fewer mall crawler Rubi’s then too)

The question is, how many of those that want the rubicon off road goodies opt for a stripped sport because they hate creature comforts? I'm guessing it's not very many. If 9 out of 10 will pay top dollar for the tech and the off road bits vs the 1 who goes full bare bones, I think Jeep is still money ahead doing it the way they are. Why build an in-between model at a lower profit margin if most of those potential buyers want or at least tolerate the luxuries? I still think very few people would pay $45k+ for manual windows, no ac, and rubber flooring.

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[Iggy]

Fun topic, but I think the great majority of Jeep buyers are opting for creature comforts. They like the beefiness of the Rubicon can-do look, but they want the 8.4 Nav, boom woofer, auto door locks, power sun roof, etc.

My CJs had rubber mats, drain holes for river crossings, no factory cage, no hard top, no A/C, no power anything, no glass side windows, two-speed wiper, and a lousy defrost. They were lightweight, rode like horse wagons, were noisy, but they really did have soles. I don't miss those times much.

My 2018 JLU has no power door locks or windows, has a hard top I probably won't remove, a baby AM/FM radio, and a weird lawyer-approved protecto-gear shift linkage. I love the auto transmission over the 3 and 4-speed manuals, I love the power 4-wheel disc brakes, I love the A/C, I love the hard doors and glass windows, I love the power steering, I love the cruise control, I love the take-off Rubicon suspension, and I love the fuel mileage (2.0L). I would, however, like a factory power door lock upgrade...

Other than that, going back to "the good old days" ain't that great of an idea for me.

 

[SirMagnus89]

I have a 3.6l Sport with manual windows/locks/transmission, with 2” of lift, 35’s, bedlined fender flares (doing interior soon!), manual disconnects, and am swapping on Rubi axles w/lockers. When the axles with e-lockers and the bedlined interior are done, I’ll be under that $35k mark... just sayin’

I agree. I have a 2 door, Base Sport with Manual everything. I got simple cause i wanted simple and dependable. Why people dont just get a Sport and Mod it the way they actually want it is beyond me. I think People just see the RUBICON name and think it is the King of Wranglers. That or they dont want to do the work..... Either way. The Rubicon name doesn't do anything for me. A modded Sport going down the road covered in much though, that turns a smile. :D

I gave my brother my Old 94 when i got my new JL. We did a frame swap, 2.5 inch lift, tires, bedlined the whole inside and out and added armour. He has more fun in his when we go wheeling than I do because i am alittle more cautious than he is when it comes to sending it

 

[JerseyMark]

I think the offroad ruggedized version is the Willys Sport 2 door:
Interior has no AC, no power windows or locks
It has 32” MTs, rock rails and LSD but does not have modern hi-tech offroad features(like e-locker, e-sway disco)
I think it is more of a traditional offroad model than any of the Bronco’s(they all have ac, power, independent front suspension, turbo DI engines...)

 

[FunWagon]

Could you pull the top down with that?

You could but it’s a pain. The rack tilts backwards. For me it’s more about the openness all around rather than on top.

 

[DanW]

The question is, how many of those that want the rubicon off road goodies opt for a stripped sport because they hate creature comforts? I'm guessing it's not very many. If 9 out of 10 will pay top dollar for the tech and the off road bits vs the 1 who goes full bare bones, I think Jeep is still money ahead doing it the way they are. Why build an in-between model at a lower profit margin if most of those potential buyers want or at least tolerate the luxuries? I still think very few people would pay $45k+ for manual windows, no ac, and rubber flooring.

How dare you introduce logic into this!

Actually, you are right....somewhat. I would not give up my Rubicon. However, there is a very good chance I would sell my JKUR and add one of these to the fleet if they made it available. There is something a bit liberating about a back to the basics Jeep. That's why I miss my YJ so much. That danged thing didn't even have a radio until I added one a year or so after buying it. No air, no radio, zip up windows. LOVED it!

 

[jl_misfit]

I agree. I have a 2 door, Base Sport with Manual everything. I got simple cause i wanted simple and dependable. Why people dont just get a Sport and Mod it the way they actually want it is beyond me. I think People just see the RUBICON name and think it is the King of Wranglers. That or they dont want to do the work..... Either way. The Rubicon name doesn't do anything for me. A modded Sport going down the road covered in much though, that turns a smile. :D

I gave my brother my Old 94 when i got my new JL. We did a frame swap, 2.5 inch lift, tires, bedlined the whole inside and out and added armour. He has more fun in his when we go wheeling than I do because i am alittle more cautious than he is when it comes to sending it

Exactly. Jeep knows there’s weirdos like us though and that’s why they offer what they do. I wanted to build everything exactly they way I wanted it, albeit over time because money. I’m sure there’s dozens of us who think that way but I also think the Sport / Willys Sport fill the need for the “bare bones” Jeepers.

Not knocking the Rubi bros, but a sport is incredibly capable with some good tires and minor upgrades. Besides, wrenching on and modifying a Jeep is 62.75% of the fun anyways, right??

My Sport and copilot:

 

[Zandcwhite]

Exactly. Jeep knows there’s weirdos like us though and that’s why they offer what they do. I wanted to build everything exactly they way I wanted it, albeit over time because money. I’m sure there’s dozens of us who think that way but I also think the Sport / Willys Sport fill the need for the “bare bones” Jeepers.

Not knocking the Rubi bros, but a sport is incredibly capable with some good tires and minor upgrades. Besides, wrenching on and modifying a Jeep is 62.75% of the fun anyways, right??

My Sport and copilot:

I'm all for building it the way you want, on a budget, starting with a base model. After 6 jeep builds and 25 years of working in the trades, we went rubicon because we didn't need to build it. It is my wife's daily, so the creature comforts were a big selling point. Peppy enough with the turbo to be fun to drive. Supremely capable stock, with the beef to go big when we were ready. Kept it stock and wheeled it all over the west for the first year. Planning our 1st Moab trip last August we decided it was time to go up. 2.5" of lift and 37's. Dominated every trail we hit, from hell's revenge to poison spider, all the way through gold bar rim. After living with the 37's she decided a little aid in access would be helpful. Sliders with a step were next. A smashed steering stabilizer and dented oil pan on holcomb creek led to some relocation brackets and an engine skid. Point being, nothing is perfect from the factory but the rubicon was a far closer start for our use. A few of our previous rigs from the budget side.

 

[FunWagon]

I also like the Rubicon because it minimizes the mods I need to make. I love that it has the heavier duty axels and gears, and front/rear lockers, and front disconnects. I got the first TJ Rubicon when they came out, and then a 4 door JK Rubicon.

Every time I just added a good complete suspension lift and bigger tires, first time 35s and second time 37s.

I just wish it was easy again to get a manual transmission and half doors without being pushed to pay a huge premium for something that used to come with a huge discount.

I understand now a days there is lots of electronics, and I like that too, but the Jeep lost something in the process as far as interior ruggedness and function, as far as the elements, being an open vehicle (waterproofness of interior).

You know what else... I’m not sure the JL fits five people as comfortably as the JK, partly because of bucket seats these days, I think. I want to fit more people comfortably. At least 5 adults on long trips.

 

[The Last Cowboy]

There’s always this for a no frills “Jeep”. Actually Mahindra has been building jeeps longer than any of the companies who have owned Jeep.

 

[Kurt0]

When is Jeep finally going to go backwards in time and make the Jeep far more utilitarian?
Things such as:

• Rubberized flooring.
• Abrasion resistant, non-leather seats.
• A real rack mounting system for the hard top.
• 35" tires
• Durable stock Rubicon rims.
• Real mount points inside around the dash.

Honda element, new Defender - and other vehicles that don't even pretend to be as capable as a Rubicon trim have these.
Bronco is hitting many of these elements.

How long (with this new accessories factory) will it take before Jeep offers TRUE off-roadering grit with the same reflected on the inside. Will this PSA deal make this happen with new capitol?

Now that I have lived with a Rubicon for 2 years, I am getting concerned with the amount of wear it's getting and annoying amount of vacuuming of the carper I have to do. I need more utility.

Anyone else second these notions? Is it time for another trim level?

i think youd be surprised what a new Defender can get through, homie. It might not be a rock basher like a built rubicon can be; but when you need high payload and GVWR, the Defender crushes the jeep. Badly. Assuming it runs, anyway. Haha

just pull your carpet and spray on a rubberized floor. Shit gets added to jeeps all the time to suit the owners preference. Nothing says you cant remove the shit.

 

[Zandcwhite]

i think youd be surprised what a new Defender can get through, homie. It might not be a rock basher like a built rubicon can be; but when you need high payload and GVWR, the Defender crushes the jeep. Badly. Assuming it runs, anyway. Haha

just pull your carpet and spray on a rubberized floor. Shit gets added to jeeps all the time to suit the owners preference. Nothing says you cant remove the shit.

The base price of $50k, the fact that you'd be hard pressed to find one at a dealer under $70k, the fact that the tfl guys had to go through 3 of them just to get one offroad for more than 10 minutes (and it still throws check engine lights every time they take it out), the lack of suspension travel, the airbags that have the potential to strand you the second a stick gets kicked up wrong, the British reliability, the much wider sheetmetal. Why would anyone choose a new land rover other than to look tough at the country club? Even former sponsored land rover guys like ronnie Dahl recommend against it. Any vehicle with lockers and ground clearance will go every place a new defender will, and almost all will do it more reliably for far less.

 

[Kurt0]

The base price of $50k, the fact that you'd be hard pressed to find one at a dealer under $70k, the fact that the tfl guys had to go through 3 of them just to get one offroad for more than 10 minutes (and it still throws check engine lights every time they take it out), the lack of suspension travel, the airbags that have the potential to strand you the second a stick gets kicked up wrong, the British reliability, the much wider sheetmetal. Why would anyone choose a new land rover other than to look tough at the country club? Even former sponsored land rover guys like ronnie Dahl recommend against it. Any vehicle with lockers and ground clearance will go every place a new defender will, and almost all will do it more reliably for far less.

im not arguing that the new defender is built well. They havent really ever been. But i do find it hilarious when jeep owners talk trash about defender reliability. It makes me ask “youre new here, arent you?”

its a status symbol and an expensive one here. And so are a lot of jeeps. The notion that “it cant get anywhere” is non sense. Land rover traction control is easily the best on the market followed closely by ATRAC.

jeep‘s quality has come a long way. The biggest glaring weakness in jeeps is the lack of payload and gvwr. Its one reason why you see very few jeeps internationally as expedition vehicles compared to defenders and toyotas. Im pretty sure a 4runner has a higher payload than my Gladiator.

 

[Zandcwhite]

im not arguing that the new defender is built well. They havent really ever been. But i do find it hilarious when jeep owners talk trash about defender reliability. It makes me ask “youre new here, arent you?”

its a status symbol and an expensive one here. And so are a lot of jeeps. The notion that “it cant get anywhere” is non sense. Land rover traction control is easily the best on the market followed closely by ATRAC.

jeep‘s quality has come a long way. The biggest glaring weakness in jeeps is the lack of payload and gvwr. Its one reason why you see very few jeeps internationally as expedition vehicles compared to defenders and toyotas. Im pretty sure a 4runner has a higher payload than my Gladiator.

I agree 100% that Jeep’s could use better payload capacity. As far as the type of wheeling we do, I prefer to pack light. If I need to haul or tow heavy I use my truck, but I understand not everybody has that option. All manufacturers do have their weaknesses, but the days of the stripped down utility rig are gone in America. The side by sides fill that niche. The $70k defender is way further toward the luxury side than Jeep for sure. Land rovers traction control is legendary, but our lockers do just fine. I don’t drive in many icy conditions, about the only place that traction control will shine in comparison. A g wagon is amazing off road as well, but I’ve yet to see one on the trail. There’s a reason that 9 out of 10 rigs on most major trails are Jeep’s, and it’s not marketing alone.

 

[Kurt0]

I agree 100% that Jeep’s could use better payload capacity. As far as the type of wheeling we do, I prefer to pack light. If I need to haul or tow heavy I use my truck, but I understand not everybody has that option. All manufacturers do have their weaknesses, but the days of the stripped down utility rig are gone in America. The side by sides fill that niche. The $70k defender is way further toward the luxury side than Jeep for sure. Land rovers traction control is legendary, but our lockers do just fine. I don’t drive in many icy conditions, about the only place that traction control will shine in comparison. A g wagon is amazing off road as well, but I’ve yet to see one on the trail. There’s a reason that 9 out of 10 rigs on most major trails are Jeep’s, and it’s not marketing alone.

for sure. Here its a mix of jeep “home turf” brand image; capability; and availability. Heck, im a prado/land cruiser fan boy and i still bought a jeep. Shrug.

ive seem several upfit G wagons getting used hard abroad, but not as many as defender or toyota. The idea of a full size diesel truck abroad (in many places) is cost prohibitive because of cost and taxes, and sometimes a license restriction. Its why you see more vans short of full size delivery trucks. for us, its a size on the trail issue. Full size trucks are simply too big for a lot of trails...why i traded my 2500 in for the Gladiator. I still needed a pick up, but didnt need to haul as much anymore and the new Tacoma sucks.

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