For folks frustrated with the FORM issues

[DocNau]

As someone who lives in the Midwest I have count the FORM issues super frustrating. I understand there are reasons why it happens. And I’m not complaining about the gas getting old - I am referring to the cold operation. My issue with Jeep has more to do with how the car is advertised and the feedback I have been given by the company. I was not sold a car that would only run pure electric in good weather. I was told this would run 26 miles pure electric - which is exactly what I needed to commute to and from work and not use the ICE. I was hoping there would be a software adjustment after the first winter but it appears that Jeep has doubled down on the gas lighting treatment of the owners who think this is bad business. I think that this is a classic example of false advertising. There is now a group that is looking to establish a class action lawsuit against them. I have zero financial relationship with this group. My only reason for posting this is that I think there has been a huge lack of transparency and disingenuous treatment of the folks who purchased these cars. I feel like Jeep needs to be held accountable and the consumer protected from these type of practices. If you’re interested you can follow this link here to be involved.

https://classlawdc.com/2022/03/16/2022-jeep-wrangler-4xe-hybrid-deactivation-investigation/

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[AcesandEights]

Not just Jeep.

 

[lindaspins]

There have been one or two attempts at class actions that have been dismissed. This one doesn't look like it will make it very far either, given that their first statement is already wrong:
"Migliaccio & Rathod LLP is currently investigating the 2022 Jeep Wrangler 4xe for advertising a hybrid powertrain that does not function as a hybrid powertrain in cold temperatures."
The 4xe is always operating as a hybrid, even in FORM.

 

[sconrad24]

I was not sold a car that would only run pure electric in good weather. I was told this would run 26 miles pure electric - which is exactly what I needed to commute to and from work and not use the ICE.

https://classlawdc.com/2022/03/16/2022-jeep-wrangler-4xe-hybrid-deactivation-investigation/

That's the problem, its a plugin hybrid not an EV. The ICE is meant to used and it kicks on more in the winter to efficiently heat the cabin. Which is fine except that a lot of short uses of the ICE is not good for it. Which is why there is FORM. I havent gotten FORM yet probably because I get my ICE up to running temps atleast once a week.

 

[GtX]

Read the footnotes. It's where the real information is.

21-mile all electric range [based on manufacturer's estimate with a fully charged battery. Actual mileage may vary].

No different than EPA estimated fuel economy.

 

[Killed by Death]

What is "FORM"

 

[DocNau]

This is my second winter with this car. Last year I was in FORM for over three months. It’s not about heating the cabin. This is a purposeful design in how Jeep addresses cold temp operations. This was not advertised as such. That’s the issue - you cannot tell someone they’re buying a car that will give you 26 miles pure electric and then be ICE after all the while knowing that the car won’t function that way in the winter. I don’t drive for the necessary time to get out FORM mode for months. These are misleading business practices that would’ve influenced many owner decisions. This is false advertising. They are being obstinate in that this is operating as designed. Nobody is arguing that. The issue is whether they are being transparent in what they are selling versus what is being delivered. I think they aren’t. I suspect many others would agree. This is exactly what this type of lawsuit is for - to protect the consumer from shady business o practices.

 

[DocNau]

Read the footnotes. It's where the real information is.

21-mile all electric range [based on manufacturer's estimate with a fully charged battery. Actual mileage may vary].

No different than EPA estimated fuel economy.

I would say it is different because you cannot access all electric. That’s the issue. They sell a potential for this all electric, but do not deliver this based on their purposeful design. If they said up to 21 miles pure electric in warm w weather then I would agree with you.

 

[sentience]

What is "FORM"

Fuel or Oil Refresh Mode. Prevents 4xe from running in pure electrical operation. Causes vary from estimated freshness of fuel, amount of fuel in oil, and ambient air temperature.

 

[GtX]

I would say it is different because you cannot access all electric. That’s the issue. They sell a potential for this all electric, but do not deliver this based on their purposeful design. If they said up to 21 miles pure electric in warm w weather then I would agree with you.

They also sold me a JLURD with a 22 MPG city rating. And you know what? I get 22 MPG in town all summer long! But, when winter arrives in Illinois my MPG drops to 19. I just checked my window sticker and it does not say 22 MPG in warm weather. I'm beginning to see your point.

 

[AcesandEights]

This is my second winter with this car. Last year I was in FORM for over three months. It’s not about heating the cabin. This is a purposeful design in how Jeep addresses cold temp operations. This was not advertised as such. That’s the issue - you cannot tell someone they’re buying a car that will give you 26 miles pure electric and then be ICE after all the while knowing that the car won’t function that way in the winter. I don’t drive for the necessary time to get out FORM mode for months. These are misleading business practices that would’ve influenced many owner decisions. This is false advertising. They are being obstinate in that this is operating as designed. Nobody is arguing that. The issue is whether they are being transparent in what they are selling versus what is being delivered. I think they aren’t. I suspect many others would agree. This is exactly what this type of lawsuit is for - to protect the consumer from shady business o practices.

That's the lie that is electric or hybrid vehicles. People should know that going in. 26-mile range sounds too good to be true. So do so many other things that people buy into because they want something to be true that is just too good to be true. Doesn't everyone know what temps do to batteries, propane, diesel, etc.?

 

[sconrad24]

This is my second winter with this car. Last year I was in FORM for over three months. It’s not about heating the cabin. This is a purposeful design in how Jeep addresses cold temp operations. This was not advertised as such. That’s the issue - you cannot tell someone they’re buying a car that will give you 26 miles pure electric and then be ICE after all the while knowing that the car won’t function that way in the winter. I don’t drive for the necessary time to get out FORM mode for months. These are misleading business practices that would’ve influenced many owner decisions. This is false advertising. They are being obstinate in that this is operating as designed. Nobody is arguing that. The issue is whether they are being transparent in what they are selling versus what is being delivered. I think they aren’t. I suspect many others would agree. This is exactly what this type of lawsuit is for - to protect the consumer from shady business o practices.

But it can give you 26 miles in the winter. I do get 26 miles. I also get 18 when I put it 4 auto and am hard on the accelerator. Just like any vehicle, the advertised numbers are possible. But each individual's use pattern will determine what your mpg is or what your range is. Ideally I'd get 30 mpg in my wife's car doing 80 down the highway, unfortunately I can only that doing 65. That doesnt mean that Chevy is false advertising.

 

[ChadP]

I am very new to having a 4xe, and I'm already exhausted from the FORM bitching. I'm going to guess this is the issue that makes me jump off of any 4xe specific forums. I just can't handle people complaining about their own bad decisions.

Some people just like to complain and bitch because they didn't do any homework on their own. As someone earlier and several people have stated, this is not an EV. This is a hybrid that has an electric option. Expecting it to be your 20 mile tesla is about as realistic as expecting your Subaru outback to make it through the Rubicon trail because it has AWD.

If people are dumb enough to believe everything a salesperson tels them, then they must be extremely disappointed in damn near everything they buy. And it is this sue happy society that makes it worse. I would like to remind you that nobody is making you own or drive your jeep. If you are unhappy, sell it. Or, go to school and learn how to design and develop your own perfect ride. Either way, you will clearly be happier and the universal energy will be more positive with one less human bitching about something thay they can so easily change.

 

[Wbino]

The only way to get true electric range is with a vehicle without an ICE engine for "backup".

 

[BXFXJeep]

I can get the advertised range in the winter, but I prefer a warm cabin.

One thing I have noticed is that I get the FORM message when I put on the heat to keep the cabin warm, it has only been cold enough for this to happen to me 2 times, then the temps warmed up, so I'm not sure what was going on, coincidence perhaps. I didn't want to fiddle too much because it was cold, and I preferred it driving the way it was, otherwise I would have had to press e-save.

I got the FORM messaging, parked overnight in a semi heated garage, next day I fired up and it was in pure electric, one thing I did was turned of the heat before I shutdown the Wrangler, so it doesn't fire up the heat the next day. I'll have to see more about this when it gets cold again.

All in all I don't have an issue the way the 4xe works, and I prefer using the ICE when it's frigid.

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