Rubicon sand driving issues

[Jeepjenn1970]

I have a 2019 Rubicon 2 door. Used to be able to just shift and go at the beach, but.....Recently it has started struggling in the soft sand. Even aired down, and Traction Control manually turned off. The "Service traction control" comes on and the steering wheel looks like I am turning a hard left to go straight. ONLY on the sand. I have two seemingly capable Mopar master techs at 2 different Jeep dealerships stumped about it. Only stored code Is for some type of steering sensor, and not wheel speed sensors.... which they have dismissed as it is perfect on the road. This is a sand only issue. As soon as I am out of 4x4, its as if it never happened and all the lights that were on, go off. Anyone have any insight for me?

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[jaymz]

My guess is it isn't sand related as much as it is 4wd related. Engage the 4wd on a hard surface and drive it a short distance. Let us know what happens.

I'd also be wary of just dismissing the steering sensor code.

From ALLDATA:
"If the steering wheel position message is lost the EHPS Pump will use a default steering wheel rate of 230°/sec to calculate desired flow and as a result, steering effort may be higher on evasive steering maneuvers. The EHPS pump will resume normal operation automatically once any missing message or out of range condition noted above is restored to normal."

 

[oldcjguy]

Try going in the sand and locking your lockers. See if it behaves any different. With both lockers locked all wheels are mechanically linked and must turn the same speed. That should take any BLD issues off the table. Without the lockers engaged the traction control system will try to use the BLD which uses the brakes to transfer power from the faster spinning wheel to the slower spinning wheel (I think BLD works even when traction control is turned off). It should at least try to go straight. See if you get any lights that way.

 

[Jeepjenn1970]

My guess is it isn't sand related as much as it is 4wd related. Engage the 4wd on a hard surface and drive it a short distance. Let us know what happens.

I'd also be wary of just dismissing the steering sensor code.

From ALLDATA:
"If the steering wheel position message is lost the EHPS Pump will use a default steering wheel rate of 230°/sec to calculate desired flow and as a result, steering effort may be higher on evasive steering maneuvers. The EHPS pump will resume normal operation automatically once any missing message or out of range condition noted above is restored to normal."

4wd in grass yielded no results. Seems to be only sand. ugh. That's what I bought her for!

 

[GATORB8]

The Jeep sensing the steering wheel is off can throw the TC Issue (happens when you mis-adjust the drag link). Do you have the code?

EDIT: Hard left as in 90 degrees?

 

[Jeepjenn1970]

The Jeep sensing the steering wheel is off can throw the TC Issue (happens when you mis-adjust the drag link). Do you have the code?

EDIT: Hard left as in 90 degrees?

Yes to the 90 degrees.


stored codes:

PCM U0432 INVALID DATA FROM MULTI AXIS ACCELERATION SENSOR MODULE "A"
ABS C0051-62 STEERING WHEEL POSITION SENSOR-SIGNAL COMPARE FAILURE
DTCM U0451-00 INVALID DATA RECEIVED FROM ANTI-LOCK BRAKE SYSTEM (ABS) CONTROL MODULE A

 

[five9dak]

Take a tech to the beach with you. (kinda serious) sometimes you just need to recreate the scenario and look at the live data while its happening. A good tech, not a parts swapper.

 

[Jeepjenn1970]

Take a tech to the beach with you. (kinda serious) sometimes you just need to recreate the scenario and look at the live data while its happening. A good tech, not a parts swapper.

I offered to make a video. He seems to think that won't help. Entirely possible since the beach is only 10 minutes away from us at work (Jeep store).

 

[GATORB8]

I’m thinking it’s something physically happening to get the steering wheel 90 off. With the TC Code being a symptom.

That would make the list:
Intermediate shaft
Steering box (and it’s frame mounting)
Drag link
Track bar
Maybe Tie Rod

Do you have the revised steel steering box? Can you take some close ups of the items above.

@Roky

 

[Jeepjenn1970]

I’m thinking it’s something physically happening to get the steering wheel 90 off. With the TC Code being a symptom.

That would make the list:
Intermediate shaft
Steering box (and it’s frame mounting)
Drag link
Track bar
Maybe Tie Rod

Do you have the revised steel steering box? Can you take some close ups of the items above.

@Roky

I don't think anything on this Jeep is "revised" I got her with 8k miles, now has 25k miles. When it goes back on the lift, I can get pictures. I certainly appreciate the help/opinions.
It was in the sand several times with no surprises, so something is physically going on. But only on sand is what is throwing techs off, no issues on road, or grass in 4wd.

 

[GATORB8]

I don't think anything on this Jeep is "revised" I got her with 8k miles, now has 25k miles. When it goes back on the lift, I can get pictures. I certainly appreciate the help/opinions.
It was in the sand several times with no surprises, so something is physically going on. But only on sand is what is throwing techs off, no issues on road, or grass in 4wd.

This is the TSB for the steering gear box change: https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/tsbs/2020/MC-10181634-9999.pdf

Are you hitting the beach at a pretty good speed?

 

[Jeepjenn1970]

This is the TSB for the steering gear box change: https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/tsbs/2020/MC-10181634-9999.pdf

Are you hitting the beach at a pretty good speed?

Maybe at 10- 15mph. Not any faster than I used to.

 

[ABRubi]

Have you tried turning on the lockers?

 

[AdventureDog]

I have a 2019 Rubicon 2 door. Used to be able to just shift and go at the beach, but.....Recently it has started struggling in the soft sand. Even aired down, and Traction Control manually turned off. The "Service traction control" comes on and the steering wheel looks like I am turning a hard left to go straight. ONLY on the sand. I have two seemingly capable Mopar master techs at 2 different Jeep dealerships stumped about it. Only stored code Is for some type of steering sensor, and not wheel speed sensors.... which they have dismissed as it is perfect on the road. This is a sand only issue. As soon as I am out of 4x4, its as if it never happened and all the lights that were on, go off. Anyone have any insight for me?

from the sounds of it you might have a front locker trying to engage…or it’s engaging on a partially striped drive shaft.
Try using the front locker and see what happens!

 

[Glamisfan]

Maybe a broken axle shaft? That would make it pull hard to one side, especially in the sand.

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