Rough Idle P02F0

[4r4m1s]

Good morning dear folks, happy New Year,





My big guy (2.0) runs relatively rough at idle when cold. I initially blamed it on the E85 in the tank (it’s been converted for that). When it’s cold, it doesn’t like it much. Sometimes I also get a yellow warning light, but that usually disappears after a few kilometers at the latest once there’s fresh E5/E10 in the tank.





This time, though, it didn’t — despite good fuel. So I fired up JScan and voilà: misfire on cylinder 3 and fuel injector circuit range/performance.





It still drives, but every now and then you notice a bit of hesitation. It never lasts long, just a few seconds, and once it’s warm there’s nothing anymore. Overall it runs a bit more “diesel-like” than you’d expect from the 2.0.





Spark plugs look good.





Any advice, or should I go ahead and order injectors already?

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[4r4m1s]

 

[Deleted User 38384]

Good morning dear folks, happy New Year,





My big guy (2.0) runs relatively rough at idle when cold. I initially blamed it on the E85 in the tank (it’s been converted for that). When it’s cold, it doesn’t like it much. Sometimes I also get a yellow warning light, but that usually disappears after a few kilometers at the latest once there’s fresh E5/E10 in the tank.





This time, though, it didn’t — despite good fuel. So I fired up JScan and voilà: misfire on cylinder 3 and fuel injector circuit range/performance.





It still drives, but every now and then you notice a bit of hesitation. It never lasts long, just a few seconds, and once it’s warm there’s nothing anymore. Overall it runs a bit more “diesel-like” than you’d expect from the 2.0.





Spark plugs look good.





Any advice, or should I go ahead and order injectors already?

You can start by putting in the correct fuel. 2.0 recommends premium fuel.

What kind of modifications did you do to your engine to run e85?

After a simple Google search, I quickly found that you'll need specialized spark plugs, fuel injectors, potentially a different fuel pump, and also possibly upgraded fuel lines, along with a tune for the ECM.

If you haven't done at least the spark plugs and the fuel injectors, then you're likely killing your engine and if so misfires are only the start of your problem.

 

[Deleted User 38384]

I understand there's a lot of misinformation out there about ethanol in fuel. But because of its nature, you could be wearing out your plastic or ABS parts that the e85 runs through much more quickly. Also if you haven't upgraded the parts I listed above, there's a chance the e85 is causing issues with those already.

E85 is not good for your vehicle. I know I'm one to talk, but there is a point where saving money is a bad thing.

It functions a lot like diesel fuel, I believe you said that already. The biggest issue here is that the 2.0T does not come with a replaceable fuel filter, only a "lifetime" fuel filter built into the tank. So any water in your fuel is going right into your engine once that "lifetime" filter is maxed out. Which now that you have changed it to a fuel that is likely to max it out significantly quicker, and with no way to swap it out without dropping the tank... again we come back to the issue where you're probably killing your engine. The bad part about this is, you're probably not under warranty at this point.

I'm going to step back and not get in the way of others who might be able to help you at this point. But keep in mind, there's a really solid chance here that this is only the first of many future problems for you because of your E85 conversion.

Good luck


Ps. After a few searches for E85 kits compatible with the 2.0T, I have found countless pages that sell options, and none of them are compatible with the 2.0T. Most sites selling it here in the USA are saying the kits are compatible with the 3.6L and the 6.4L. I have yet to see an e85 conversion kit being sold in the USA for the 2.0T. There is one being sold out of England for the 2.0T, but they won't even tell you what's included in it. They want you to contact them for more info...

I hope you didn't spend a lot of money on this "conversion".

 

[4r4m1s]

I understand there's a lot of misinformation out there about ethanol in fuel. But because of its nature, you could be wearing out your plastic or ABS parts that the e85 runs through much more quickly. Also if you haven't upgraded the parts I listed above, there's a chance the e85 is causing issues with those already.

E85 is not good for your vehicle. I know I'm one to talk, but there is a point where saving money is a bad thing.

It functions a lot like diesel fuel, I believe you said that already. The biggest issue here is that the 2.0T does not come with a replaceable fuel filter, only a "lifetime" fuel filter built into the tank. So any water in your fuel is going right into your engine once that "lifetime" filter is maxed out. Which now that you have changed it to a fuel that is likely to max it out significantly quicker, and with no way to swap it out without dropping the tank... again we come back to the issue where you're probably killing your engine. The bad part about this is, you're probably not under warranty at this point.

I'm going to step back and not get in the way of others who might be able to help you at this point. But keep in mind, there's a really solid chance here that this is only the first of many future problems for you because of your E85 conversion.

Good luck


Ps. After a few searches for E85 kits compatible with the 2.0T, I have found countless pages that sell options, and none of them are compatible with the 2.0T. Most sites selling it here in the USA are saying the kits are compatible with the 3.6L and the 6.4L. I have yet to see an e85 conversion kit being sold in the USA for the 2.0T. There is one being sold out of England for the 2.0T, but they won't even tell you what's included in it. They want you to contact them for more info...

I hope you didn't spend a lot of money on this "conversion".

thanks for the reply. It was the pre-owner who spent close to 600 USD here in France for the flex fuel conversion at a specialized company. Although it ran smooth and normal, I didn’t use e85 much, just every now and then in summer (In winter I always questioned the cold start performance).

I didn’t know it’s that rare (in the US). I’ll probably check the injectors next. As I said: spark plugs looked good. Exhaust is good. When the engine is warm it runs smooth as always. Just when there was a cold start and I’m putting it too soon into “Drive” the engine sometimes stutters a bit and I give it another 5 seconds. But that’s also not on a regular base.

if anyone has an advice other than “you probably did a wrong conversion” I’m all open ears.

 

[Deleted User 38384]

thanks for the reply. It was the pre-owner who spent close to 600 USD here in France for the flex fuel conversion at a specialized company. Although it ran smooth and normal, I didn’t use e85 much, just every now and then in summer (In winter I always questioned the cold start performance).

I didn’t know it’s that rare (in the US). I’ll probably check the injectors next. As I said: spark plugs looked good. Exhaust is good. When the engine is warm it runs smooth as always. Just when there was a cold start and I’m putting it too soon into “Drive” the engine sometimes stutters a bit and I give it another 5 seconds. But that’s also not on a regular base.

if anyone has an advice other than “you probably did a wrong conversion” I’m all open ears.

If you have any information on the specific company who did the conversion so that we can look at what the conversion entails, then it will probably give us a better understanding as to potential issues.

One of the big issues you're going to run into from getting help here is most of us are fairly knowledgeable on Jeep related products, and outside of someone who has done a similar conversion themselves, most of us won't know enough about a potentially differing engine.

Even in the case of someone around here who has done something similar, they are still going to need to know what was done to the engine.

Like I said, there are similar conversions here for the 3.6L, and they are as basic as a simple tune for $700, stating that all of the parts on the vehicle are good enough, upwards of a complete conversion with new fuel lines, fuel pump, injectors, fuel rails, and a tune for a few thousand dollars, including one that offers a supercharger package for over $14,000.

Basically unless you can narrow down what conversion you have and what has changed in your engine bay and along the fuel line, we might as well be throwing darts at a board. It's going to become a guessing game and it's going to become way too big for you too actually find any solutions. You're going to have to narrow it down for us to even have a starting point.

 

[Deleted User 38384]

Here's some of the things that I found that potentially could be your tune, though I understand the internet that you look at in France will potentially get different hits than what I'll get here in the USA. But anyways here's what I found so far:

https://www.br-performance.be/en-be...jeep/1374-wrangler/10452-2018/10455-2-0t/e85/

One from BR performance is simply just a chip tune right around the price range that you were talking about. Simply put this one isn't enough. If this is your tune, I would highly recommend you undo it and go back to a normal stock tune and stop using E85 cuz this tune alone will eventually kill your engine.

https://eflexfuelfrance.com/?_gl=1*dk63o7*_gcl_au*Nzg1MDk5MzA2LjE3Njc1MjY3MjQ.

This one is Eflexfuel on their French page, and as you can see they don't even offer this conversion for a 2.0T.

This picture below is what a decent kit should look like, in this case it's the same Eflexfuel, but for the 3.6L engine, and again they don't make one for the 2.0T.

https://www.shiftech.eu/en/shop/pro...ep-wrangler-jl-2018-2-0t-multiair-270ch-400nm

Shiftech here is another tune which will slowly kill your engine.

 

[Deleted User 38384]

@4r4m1s here's the link to another thread on the 2.0T forum here on this site in which a company who is making a tune for the 2.0T specifically, and their post here relates to a E85 conversion:

https://www.jlwranglerforums.com/fo...elopment-by-eurocompulsion.51961/post-2488551


I will say as an added thought, that if you don't get the help you're looking for here, I would recommend going to a shop that specializes in these conversions. You may end up spending a boatload more money in the long run, but at least you'll have someone looking at your engine who knows what they're doing in relation to an E85 conversion.

Shiftech seems to have a bunch of shops in France and per their website they're clearly used to working with E85 vehicles, in case it doesn't work out for you here, that is a possible lead for you.

 

[4r4m1s]

Wow ! Thanks for the detailed reply. Appreciate it. I’ll reach out to the guys who actually converted /enhanced the engine/chip/mapping… but yeah I assume it’s been only an expensive software upgrade.

I’ll go ahead and go on error search and look at the injectors. I got a total of 88k km/ 55k miles on it… spark plugs look good.

It all started just after I came back from a 2 months vacation. Maybe the hydrophilic e85 damaged the injector when it was standing that long. Hope nothing worse.

the jeep still drives great but yeah, symptoms are clear: rough idle when cold, higher fuel consumption, a little more diesel like sound…

 

[alphawolff]

Wow ! Thanks for the detailed reply. Appreciate it. I’ll reach out to the guys who actually converted /enhanced the engine/chip/mapping… but yeah I assume it’s been only an expensive software upgrade.

I’ll go ahead and go on error search and look at the injectors. I got a total of 88k km/ 55k miles on it… spark plugs look good.

It all started just after I came back from a 2 months vacation. Maybe the hydrophilic e85 damaged the injector when it was standing that long. Hope nothing worse.

the jeep still drives great but yeah, symptoms are clear: rough idle when cold, higher fuel consumption, a little more diesel like sound…

Assuming your E85 tune is correct we've seen injectors fail on the 2.0L pretty often. Just replace the injector and see. Do make sure no oil is in the connector for the injector. We've seen a handful of times where people spill oil when filling up which ends up causing this issue. Usually it's on cyl 1/2 though, not 3.

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