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ResponsibleAdult

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Oh boy... Union debate about to begin... :devil:
Better invite @ResponsibleAdult

I will say that the miners up here truly needed the unions during the early days. The working conditions were so poor and unfair that many lives were lost.

This kids/young adult book has a great historical view of it. It’s an interesting quick read if you can find a copy.
“My Name Is America: The Journal Of Otto Peltonen, A Finnish Immigrant”
I’ll look it up!

I can say that unions continue to spend an enormous amount of their time doing that same sort of work that saved lives in the mines. People continue to be injured at work, and unions continue to press for better systems to keep people safe, and better support to help people return to their lives and their work. No one should die at work, nor should they suffer injury.
 

CrazyKASG

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It’s the union’s responsibility to seek the betterment of its members. If a company can’t afford increasing wages, then it’s their responsibility to negotiate for what they can afford. I disagree with you about the labour cost being the sole reason for the increasing price of a new car.

I believe that making union membership optional is a critical tool in the corporate agenda, served to them by politicians who are in their back pocket. It drives wages down for the entire economy, further destroys the middle class, and takes away the workers’ ability to balance the scales of corporate power.
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ResponsibleAdult

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Difference in culture as well I think, If conditions suck at work, the workers just leave and go work where it doesn't suck. (putting it lightly)

So employers will either keep the pay good, or have stellar benefits that go along with the job. Or both.
Conversely if you the employee suck, you're sent packing. We had to do that with a Project manager whose excessive micromanaging made work come to a virtual standstill.
There are certainly great non-unionized employers. I’m not suggesting that being unionized is a requirement for a “good job”


But there are large segments of society who do not have the means to walk away from poor quality employment. Yes, the highly skilled, highly educated have extensive options and the ability to negotiate for betterment. Higher rates of unionization mean that those who don’t have the same opportunity can have job security, better pay, benefits, etc. Areas with high rates of union membership have better jobs in non-unionized sectors as well. Because employers need to compete, and because government starts to respond to organized workers, rather than corporate executives, meaning things like minimum wage increases are passed by the legislature.
 

CrazyKASG

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I’ll look it up!

I can say that unions continue to spend an enormous amount of their time doing that same sort of work that saved lives in the mines. People continue to be injured at work, and unions continue to press for better systems to keep people safe, and better support to help people return to their lives and their work. No one should die at work, nor should they suffer injury.
:like:
 

Sean L

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It’s the union’s responsibility to seek the betterment of its members. If a company can’t afford increasing wages, then it’s their responsibility to negotiate for what they can afford. I disagree with you about the labour cost being the sole reason for the increasing price of a new car.

I believe that making union membership optional is a critical tool in the corporate agenda, served to them by politicians who are in their back pocket. It drives wages down for the entire economy, further destroys the middle class, and takes away the workers’ ability to balance the scales of corporate power.
If the company takes care of its own employees then there would be no need for an outside union to handle things and that's what happens in areas without required union membership. If a company fails to take care of its own employees there are plenty of competing companies to work for.

As an estimator I've had to put a good increase on my prices I've been putting out because the state may be implementing a minimum wage hike, (from 7.25 an hour to 15) so I've had to increase my labor costs by 20% to account for the boss needing to pay higher than minimum wage to make the company appealing to work for. That makes 15% of the total price of a lighting job to my own companies labor force, and that's not counting the subcontractors, or our logistics and office personnel and before I've even taken travel time and per diem into account. Basic Labor costs make a huge deal in the price of the final product.

I will admit, that upon further research that I did have bad information about the UAW factory minimum wage. An old article stated 29 an hour, and I just read another one that broke it down even further as that is the top pay of the second tier in actuality.
 

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Sean L

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:devil:Time to head to my nonunion job now. On today’s agenda: local union audits. Ironic? You decide. ;)
lol, well they still gotta pay taxes...
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