Wrangler Rubicon JLU 3.6 engine pre-detonation

schumbox

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Hi schumbox,

We’re sorry to hear about this. We certainly understand how frustrating this may be. Please feel free to let us know if you decide to continue working with your dealer to address this and we will gladly assist you during that process.

Lydia
Jeep Social Care Specialist
Dealership had Jeep for almost a month straight. Put more miles on rental vehicles than my Wrangler had on odometer. Regional engineer and technician looked at it. They were easily able to reproduce detonation on both my manual and another on the lot. One of my rentals was a 2018 Wrangler with automatic transmission. I was able to reproduce the issue on it, although much tougher as automatic changes engine RPM with load. I let the engineer and technician know it is reproducible on auto also. They then were able to replicate issue on automatic in lot.
Have been in contact with JeepCares the majority of the time, although no resolution in sight!
FCA engine engineering - Please get a new tune released soon!

#ManualTransmissionsMatter
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Hau82

Hau82

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Dealership had Jeep for almost a month straight. Put more miles on rental vehicles than my Wrangler had on odometer. Regional engineer and technician looked at it. They were easily able to reproduce detonation on both my manual and another on the lot. One of my rentals was a 2018 Wrangler with automatic transmission. I was able to reproduce the issue on it, although much tougher as automatic changes engine RPM with load. I let the engineer and technician know it is reproducible on auto also. They then were able to replicate issue on automatic in lot.
Have been in contact with JeepCares the majority of the time, although no resolution in sight!
FCA engine engineering - Please get a new tune released soon!

#ManualTransmissionsMatter
Its all about the tuning, but FCA looks like they don't want to take care of it because getting EPA approval on a new tune is a pita for them and takes time, but it would definitely be the remedy for the misfire. Only thing we can do is wait wait and keep waiting for a possible "solution"
 

dl87z28

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hi guys,

Only have 2,200 miles and about a month ago I started hearing some knocking/pinging noise in my engine particularly between 2nd and 3rd gear at about 2k to 2.8k rpms more noticeable when going uphill or from a stop when taking off in 2nd gear (auto tranny) , I blamed the fuel so I tried a new brand and higher octane to see if the sound goes away. So after a month of testing, the noise has become more noticeable and I'm starting to worry about something getting broken. Does anyone have had this problem and got it solved?
I have a 2018 Wrangler JL Unlimited 3.6 and I have had this problem since my Jeep was new. First trip in to the dealer they had it for one day and said there was nothing wrong with it, did a couple of ECM updates, took it out of "shipping mode" and returned the vehicle to me. It detonated after each shift all the way home. Fast forward to now with 10000 miles on it and I took it back after doing my own diagnosis. (I am a repair shop owner and an ASE certified Master Tech) The problem it has, is that the knock sensors aren't picking up the detonation and the computer isn't rolling back the timing (retarding) as it should when the detonation occurs. The dealer has had my Jeep going on 3 weeks and when I talked to them yesterday they were waiting for the local FC engineer to look at it but admitted that they have no idea what is wrong with it. They, and I have both driven other examples of the same model and have not heard the detonation in any of them. It wasn't until after I asked for their diagnostic technician to take a ride with me and I duplicated the problem for him that they even admitted it had a problem. When I get the FC STAR case number I will post it along with their resolution they said they would have this coming week.
 

schumbox

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I have a 2018 Wrangler JL Unlimited 3.6 and I have had this problem since my Jeep was new. First trip in to the dealer they had it for one day and said there was nothing wrong with it, did a couple of ECM updates, took it out of "shipping mode" and returned the vehicle to me. It detonated after each shift all the way home. Fast forward to now with 10000 miles on it and I took it back after doing my own diagnosis. (I am a repair shop owner and an ASE certified Master Tech) The problem it has, is that the knock sensors aren't picking up the detonation and the computer isn't rolling back the timing (retarding) as it should when the detonation occurs. The dealer has had my Jeep going on 3 weeks and when I talked to them yesterday they were waiting for the local FC engineer to look at it but admitted that they have no idea what is wrong with it. They, and I have both driven other examples of the same model and have not heard the detonation in any of them. It wasn't until after I asked for their diagnostic technician to take a ride with me and I duplicated the problem for him that they even admitted it had a problem. When I get the FC STAR case number I will post it along with their resolution they said they would have this coming week.
Sure hope you have better luck with your STAR case than I did mine!! The FCA local engineer deemed it to be 'normal'. The tech and service manager are at a loss, as there is no software updates to program. All admitted to it having pre-detonation, where it is easily reproducible.
FCA Cares won't do anything anymore.. Comment is 'bring it in when it gets worse.' (guess that is when the parts appear below the Jeep?)

Tough to keep positive attitude to all my friends that are purchasing or interested in new JL or JT Jeep...

#ManualTransmissionsMatter
#FCAEngineEngineering https://www.onallcylinders.com/2015...mination-9-ways-to-prevent-engine-detonation/
 

intentsrig

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Yeah mine still does it all the time. Super loud and noticeable.
 

JeepCares

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I have a 2018 Wrangler JL Unlimited 3.6 and I have had this problem since my Jeep was new. First trip in to the dealer they had it for one day and said there was nothing wrong with it, did a couple of ECM updates, took it out of "shipping mode" and returned the vehicle to me. It detonated after each shift all the way home. Fast forward to now with 10000 miles on it and I took it back after doing my own diagnosis. (I am a repair shop owner and an ASE certified Master Tech) The problem it has, is that the knock sensors aren't picking up the detonation and the computer isn't rolling back the timing (retarding) as it should when the detonation occurs. The dealer has had my Jeep going on 3 weeks and when I talked to them yesterday they were waiting for the local FC engineer to look at it but admitted that they have no idea what is wrong with it. They, and I have both driven other examples of the same model and have not heard the detonation in any of them. It wasn't until after I asked for their diagnostic technician to take a ride with me and I duplicated the problem for him that they even admitted it had a problem. When I get the FC STAR case number I will post it along with their resolution they said they would have this coming week.
Hi dl87z28,
Please let us know via private message if you need any additional assistance. We'd be happy to have a case escalated in your behalf so a Case Specialist can work with your dealer to help address this.
Lydia
Jeep Social Care Specialist
 

dl87z28

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Hi dl87z28,
Please let us know via private message if you need any additional assistance. We'd be happy to have a case escalated in your behalf so a Case Specialist can work with your dealer to help address this.
Lydia
Jeep Social Care Specialist
Sure hope you have better luck with your STAR case than I did mine!! The FCA local engineer deemed it to be 'normal'. The tech and service manager are at a loss, as there is no software updates to program. All admitted to it having pre-detonation, where it is easily reproducible.
FCA Cares won't do anything anymore.. Comment is 'bring it in when it gets worse.' (guess that is when the parts appear below the Jeep?)

Tough to keep positive attitude to all my friends that are purchasing or interested in new JL or JT Jeep...

#ManualTransmissionsMatter
#FCAEngineEngineering https://www.onallcylinders.com/2015...mination-9-ways-to-prevent-engine-detonation/
Sorry to hear about that. Mine has been at the dealer for 3 1/2 weeks and now after the "field engineer" has listened to it the entire staff at the dealer has changed their story from "yes this is detonation and is a serious issue" to and I quote "the noise is totally normal and it is the VVT cam phasers trying to find their optimum torque settings". If you know anything at all about how this system works then you know that that explanation is absolutely ridiculous and doesn't make any sense at all. I am an ASE certified master technician with 30+ years under my belt, I own a repair shop with the latest and best diagnostic equipment and have a firm understanding of how FCs 3.6 VVT system works. Cam phasers don't make noise, EVER, unless it is on a FORD V8 and they are failing. So now we have to go pick it up and I'm going to have to hire an attorney and go after FC to clear up this issue. It's sad that big companies can't own up to problems that are this obvious and you have to get a damn lawyer. I used to love JEEP but I will never buy another product of theirs again. It's pretty funny that the lead diagnostic guy at my dealer who understands detonation and what causes it was totally on board along with STAR as they directed numerous repairs which didn't help, and all of the sudden the "field engineer" takes one ride and claims that severe detonation and 26 degrees of ignition timing during detonation with no change is "normal". I'm glad one of my customers is a well known attorney in the automotive field. Will post another update after I retrieve my 3.6L Pentastar gas/diesel JL and meet with my attorney. This should be interesting. All they had to do was fix my wife's little JL she loves so much. She's pretty tore up about her little JL, She loves that thing and can't drive it because it sounds like it's coming apart but that's normal.
 

dl87z28

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hi guys,

Only have 2,200 miles and about a month ago I started hearing some knocking/pinging noise in my engine particularly between 2nd and 3rd gear at about 2k to 2.8k rpms more noticeable when going uphill or from a stop when taking off in 2nd gear (auto tranny) , I blamed the fuel so I tried a new brand and higher octane to see if the sound goes away. So after a month of testing, the noise has become more noticeable and I'm starting to worry about something getting broken. Does anyone have had this problem and got it solved?

Sorry to hear about that. Mine has been at the dealer for 3 1/2 weeks and now after the "field engineer" has listened to it the entire staff at the dealer has changed their story from "yes this is detonation and is a serious issue" to and I quote "the noise is totally normal and it is the VVT cam phasers trying to find their optimum torque settings". If you know anything at all about how this system works then you know that that explanation is absolutely ridiculous and doesn't make any sense at all. I am an ASE certified master technician with 30+ years under my belt, I own a repair shop with the latest and best diagnostic equipment and have a firm understanding of how FCs 3.6 VVT system works. Cam phasers don't make noise, EVER, unless it is on a FORD V8 and they are failing. So now we have to go pick it up and I'm going to have to hire an attorney and go after FC to clear up this issue. It's sad that big companies can't own up to problems that are this obvious and you have to get a damn lawyer. I used to love JEEP but I will never buy another product of theirs again. It's pretty funny that the lead diagnostic guy at my dealer who understands detonation and what causes it was totally on board along with STAR as they directed numerous repairs which didn't help, and all of the sudden the "field engineer" takes one ride and claims that severe detonation and 26 degrees of ignition timing during detonation with no change is "normal". I'm glad one of my customers is a well known attorney in the automotive field. Will post another update after I retrieve my 3.6L Pentastar gas/diesel JL and meet with my attorney. This should be interesting. All they had to do was fix my wife's little JL she loves so much. She's pretty tore up about her little JL, She loves that thing and can't drive it because it sounds like it's coming apart but that's normal.
 

dl87z28

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Dealership had Jeep for almost a month straight. Put more miles on rental vehicles than my Wrangler had on odometer. Regional engineer and technician looked at it. They were easily able to reproduce detonation on both my manual and another on the lot. One of my rentals was a 2018 Wrangler with automatic transmission. I was able to reproduce the issue on it, although much tougher as automatic changes engine RPM with load. I let the engineer and technician know it is reproducible on auto also. They then were able to replicate issue on automatic in lot.
Have been in contact with JeepCares the majority of the time, although no resolution in sight!
FCA engine engineering - Please get a new tune released soon!

#ManualTransmissionsMatter

Sorry to hear about that. Mine has been at the dealer for 3 1/2 weeks and now after the "field engineer" has listened to it the entire staff at the dealer has changed their story from "yes this is detonation and is a serious issue" to and I quote "the noise is totally normal and it is the VVT cam phasers trying to find their optimum torque settings". If you know anything at all about how this system works then you know that that explanation is absolutely ridiculous and doesn't make any sense at all. I am an ASE certified master technician with 30+ years under my belt, I own a repair shop with the latest and best diagnostic equipment and have a firm understanding of how FCs 3.6 VVT system works. Cam phasers don't make noise, EVER, unless it is on a FORD V8 and they are failing. So now we have to go pick it up and I'm going to have to hire an attorney and go after FC to clear up this issue. It's sad that big companies can't own up to problems that are this obvious and you have to get a damn lawyer. I used to love JEEP but I will never buy another product of theirs again. It's pretty funny that the lead diagnostic guy at my dealer who understands detonation and what causes it was totally on board along with STAR as they directed numerous repairs which didn't help, and all of the sudden the "field engineer" takes one ride and claims that severe detonation and 26 degrees of ignition timing during detonation with no change is "normal". I'm glad one of my customers is a well known attorney in the automotive field. Will post another update after I retrieve my 3.6L Pentastar gas/diesel JL and meet with my attorney. This should be interesting. All they had to do was fix my wife's little JL she loves so much. She's pretty tore up about her little JL, She loves that thing and can't drive it because it sounds like it's coming apart but that's normal.
 

JeepSmash

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Would this be the same thing I hear in very low speeds when the engine is sort of lugging? It’s kinda of a popping crackly sound. I only hear it when creeping along on trails and giving it a little gas
 

guarnibl

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Sorry to hear about that. Mine has been at the dealer for 3 1/2 weeks and now after the "field engineer" has listened to it the entire staff at the dealer has changed their story from "yes this is detonation and is a serious issue" to and I quote "the noise is totally normal and it is the VVT cam phasers trying to find their optimum torque settings". If you know anything at all about how this system works then you know that that explanation is absolutely ridiculous and doesn't make any sense at all. I am an ASE certified master technician with 30+ years under my belt, I own a repair shop with the latest and best diagnostic equipment and have a firm understanding of how FCs 3.6 VVT system works. Cam phasers don't make noise, EVER, unless it is on a FORD V8 and they are failing. So now we have to go pick it up and I'm going to have to hire an attorney and go after FC to clear up this issue. It's sad that big companies can't own up to problems that are this obvious and you have to get a damn lawyer. I used to love JEEP but I will never buy another product of theirs again. It's pretty funny that the lead diagnostic guy at my dealer who understands detonation and what causes it was totally on board along with STAR as they directed numerous repairs which didn't help, and all of the sudden the "field engineer" takes one ride and claims that severe detonation and 26 degrees of ignition timing during detonation with no change is "normal". I'm glad one of my customers is a well known attorney in the automotive field. Will post another update after I retrieve my 3.6L Pentastar gas/diesel JL and meet with my attorney. This should be interesting. All they had to do was fix my wife's little JL she loves so much. She's pretty tore up about her little JL, She loves that thing and can't drive it because it sounds like it's coming apart but that's normal.
How much detonation until it blows up? Sounds like your only options are to escalate what happens next or wait on lawyers.
 

dl87z28

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Would this be the same thing I hear in very low speeds when the engine is sort of lugging? It’s kinda of a popping crackly sound. I only hear it when creeping along on trails and giving it a little gas
Yup, that is it. The warmer the weather gets the worse it will be. Usually happens on the road just after the 1-2 or 2-3 shift when it lugs a little. Mine is really loud on a hot day. It is detonation and is a serious condition. An engine that is allowed to continue with this condition will eventually have major issues. Detonation eats away at pistons, valves and combustion chambers and can wreak havoc eventually.
 

MurphysLaw

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Hey I actually started a thread on this for my 2017 JKUR (3.6l) on the JK tech forum. Only have 15k miles. I have engine pinging when climbing hills low speed in warm weather with 87 octane. I ran a tank with 93 octane to confirm...quiet and smooth with the 93. Going to go to the dealer tomorrow and see what they say. I'll let you know if I figure anything out.

Edit: apparently the manual says "light knocking" is normal on 87 octane.

Screenshot_20190625-103408.png
 
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Litfuse

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Heck, I would drive the vehicle until it implodes. You should have plenty of warranty left, unless you drive a lot of miles. Either way, with heavy detonation. It won’t take long for it to pop. And then you can say with a big smile on your face, I told you so.
 
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