Way better design - Engine Stop/Start

[modeler]

I recently pickup 2023 Jetta sedan, it has Engine Stop/Start feature as well, and way better.

The ESS function only kick-in when you press brake much deeper, so you effectively CAN control the ESS, - I found JL had same design, but the threshold of ESS kick-in is extremely light, so not really helpful.

And most importantly the ESS remain stop when you shift to P, it actually force engine stop when you shift to P, so you can rest foot during long red light. This is day and night better than JL, I don't know what's in the engineer mind that they design JL to restart the engine when you shift to N or P, it is just so stupid.

 

[The Last Cowboy]

These stop/start systems just aren't very practical, especailly for the amount of realized fuel savings. It's just another layer of expensive complexity that we a forced to pay for new and many will begin deleting after the warranty expires.

 

[entropy]

ESS is about emissions not about fuel savings. Sounds like the one in your jetta is a bit more user friendly but still useless piece of tech.

 

[modeler]

ESS is about emissions not about fuel savings. Sounds like the one in your jetta is a bit more user friendly but still useless piece of tech.

I just hope Jeep read the thread and learn something - don't really think they want to learn but - so next generation show some brain there behind design.

ESS is useful, for those long light, not really mean to change emission whole lot, but at least save some noise and fuel and my leg. I personally think all these emission talk are b/s hypocrisy, but I don't mind save fuel, LOL.

So yes, Jeep need to learn, and I will not tolerate jeep stupidity for next car purchase, their scummy dealership experience is particularly irritating.

The car idea was great, but in wrong hand.

 

[Apexcars]

I think I know the reason the stop/start is disabled in park. At first I thought it was dumb to do it that way, then my wife bought a Mercedes. It does turn the engine off when you put it in park. The problem is when you are getting out of the car it’s hard to tell if you actually turned it off, especially if you don’t drive it often. I have gotten out and walked off only to come back later and realize I had left it in run mode. That WILL run the battery down if you are gone very long.

 

[entropy]

I just hope Jeep read the thread and learn something - don't really think they want to learn but - so next generation show some brain there behind design.

ESS is useful, for those long light, not really mean to change emission whole lot, but at least save some noise and fuel and my leg. I personally think all these emission talk are b/s hypocrisy, but I don't mind save fuel, LOL.

So yes, Jeep need to learn, and I will not tolerate jeep stupidity for next car purchase, their scummy dealership experience is particularly irritating.

The car idea was great, but in wrong hand.

If you run the numbers it saves you very very little gas, almost negligible. At the expense of your batteries life. Battery replacements occur more often, so you end up spending more money on batteries.

 

[mnjeeper]

I just hope Jeep read the thread and learn something - don't really think they want to learn but - so next generation show some brain there behind design.

ESS is useful, for those long light, not really mean to change emission whole lot, but at least save some noise and fuel and my leg. I personally think all these emission talk are b/s hypocrisy, but I don't mind save fuel, LOL.

So yes, Jeep need to learn, and I will not tolerate jeep stupidity for next car purchase, their scummy dealership experience is particularly irritating.

The car idea was great, but in wrong hand.

You want Jeep/Fiat to learn about emissions...from VW? I assume you are young. Your writing style and not knowing about VW trying to screw the system with their diesels says that to me. Google VW diesel recall if you get curious.

 

[Fudster]

I recently pickup 2023 Jetta sedan, it has Engine Stop/Start feature as well, and way better.

The ESS function only kick-in when you press brake much deeper, so you effectively CAN control the ESS, - I found JL had same design, but the threshold of ESS kick-in is extremely light, so not really helpful.

And most importantly the ESS remain stop when you shift to P, it actually force engine stop when you shift to P, so you can rest foot during long red light. This is day and night better than JL, I don't know what's in the engineer mind that they design JL to restart the engine when you shift to N or P, it is just so stupid.

I'm not taking issue with your thoughts.

For example, once the vehicle is in an ESS event, switching it to "Park" shouldn't prematurely end ESS. Only switching it out of park into a gear that, when you take your foot off the brake, effects mobility (e.g. reverse gear, drive gear), and then releasing that brake, should, it would seem to me, terminate an ESS event--other factors like a battery getting too low in voltage during an ESS event notwithstanding.

But--if I am not mistaken--the US EPA standard for a vehicle being able to report on its Monroney sticker the more favorable MPG ratings of an engine start stop system, is for it to conform to certain US government set standards that include, or perhaps I should say necessitate an ESS event ending when the vehicle is put into the parking gear.

It seems stupid right? I admit to not completely knowing the standard nor the underlying intentions of its language, but automobile manufacturers are far more concerned with their vehicles passing these rules (when brand spanking new), so as to report better MPG ratings and increase their overall fleet MPGs to meet government objectives, than they are about you saving gasoline or emissions.

While I'm the first to point the finger at automobile manufacturers when appropriate, I'm afraid, IMHO, that blame best be assigned here to EPA language. The overall motives behind these ever belt tightening with time CAFE (Corporate Average Fuel Economy) standards are well intentioned, as they increase the overall price of ICE (internal combustion engine) vehicles relative to, and incentivizing the market to switch to electric vehicle offerings--along with the presumed decrease in real cost of such battery powered vehicles with economies of scale, but some of the written standards that must be passed for ESS systems reflect the competing needs of politicians, along with some poorly worded bureaucratic specifications, seem to stink.

 

[modeler]

I think I know the reason the stop/start is disabled in park...

Jetta require you manually restart engine, if you put in park (ESS kick in) and opened the door, so the question you mentioned is well thought for.

 

[modeler]

You want Jeep/Fiat to learn about emissions...from VW? I assume you are young. Your writing style and not knowing about VW trying to screw the system with their diesels says that to me. Google VW diesel recall if you get curious.

This is not about my brand is always better, but how I think FCA can improve based on feature of my new car.

I am not sure how you figure I didn't know vw diesel gate, either, omg.

 

[modeler]

I'm not taking issue with your thoughts.

For example, once the vehicle is in an ESS event, switching it to "Park" shouldn't prematurely end ESS. Only switching it out of park into a gear that, when you take your foot off the brake, effects mobility (e.g. reverse gear, drive gear), and then releasing that brake, should, it would seem to me, terminate an ESS event--other factors like a battery getting too low in voltage during an ESS event notwithstanding.
...... relative to, and incentivizing the market to switch to electric vehicle offerings--along with the presumed decrease in real cost of such battery powered vehicles with economies of scale, but some of the written standards that must be passed for ESS systems reflect the competing needs of politicians, along with some poorly worded bureaucratic specifications, seem to stink.

CAFE rule is what automaker must comply with, vw of stlantis FCA whoever. But I think jeep did superficially by only help themselves to mark a better score in test, rather indeed help driver to save fuel or just better looking word save environment.

 

[Scott.B]

I click the off button after starting. Works great

 

[modeler]

I click the off button after starting. Works great

I recently replaced small battery and main battery is short of charge so no need to push the button, LOL, see my other thread.

Anyway, poor design, useless feature to justify the complication.

 

[58Willys]

My wife’s RAV4 is similar to OP’s VW. I prefer my Jeep’s SS. Why do you need to mash the brake to the floor to engage SS. Yes, I’m one of the few who don’t mind the SS. Jeep’s battery system could be better.

 

[Fudster]

CAFE rule is what automaker must comply with, vw of stlantis FCA whoever. But I think jeep did superficially by only help themselves to mark a better score in test, rather indeed help driver to save fuel or just better looking word save environment.

Could be. But a more robust system would have cost us more in sticker price and likely eaten away more at the very MPGs the system seeks to report to save.

You're right, sort of. All Stellantis did is the bear minimum to pass a test that had it failed, would have required it to report higher fleet MPGs that may have resulted in whopping penalties accessed against them, whose cost would in part would have been passed along to you and me.

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