UPR vs MISHIMOTO OIL Catch Can

tatarin

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Does the UPR block access to the oil filter, if so can one easily move it out of the way when changing the filter??

I changed the oil in the Jeep and drained the Mishomito for the 3rd time, about 2000 miles, had a couple of ounces come out.
On mine I just disconnect the hoses, unscrew the can to drain it and swing it out of the way to remove the filter housing.
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Mike630

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Just because I enjoy the back and forth of this, I just pulled two ounces of oil out of my UPR catch can at 1,000 miles.
 

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A lock washer may be a better bet to solve this. The aluminum bracket is going to expand and contract a good bit with the heat of the engine and with the can wanting to swing every time you get on and off the throttle, the Loctite might break free.

Thanks!
-Steve
Your kit comes with a lock washer. Put some loctite on awhile back and its still tight.
 

GHJeepVA

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I bought the Mishimoto kit for my 18’ JLUR 3.6L. I owned heavily modified Subaru prior, and ran a air oil separator from IAG alongside a baffled and filtered Mishimoto can. Had good results with the tandem set up. I was a little curious when installing the JL kit as to why the valve cover vacuum lines aren’t routed to the can as well; I realize it’s apples to oranges but the Subaru with the air oil separator had 3 entry ports- both valve covers from the two heads, and the PCV all went to the AOS can with the 1 return line headed back to the intake track. I wonder if oil vapor is also present in those two valve cover vacuum lines. Forgive me if this is a noob question, only owned the Jeep now for three weeks. Cheers
 

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Removed my UPR because i was taking the jeep in for service. Noticed some wear in the braided line and quickly saw what it was rubbing on.

20191202_161157.jpg


I put some friction tape on the braided line and twisted the OEM zip tie over. May even put some tape on it.
 

Penance81

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Not sure if anyone else has had this issue, but when running my UPR catch can I had issues when at extreme angles way too much oil running into the motor. Now before anyone ask, yes this was tested with emptying the can right before taking the rig out on a trail. My guess would be the larger hose and improved airflow allow the oil to move in larger amounts to the engine. The first time this happened it partially hydro-locked my engine and burned up my starter. The second time the vehicle just kept coming close to dying. I have since removed the catch can and this issue seems to be much less common. Before if I was at an extreme angle for more than 1-2 mins the engine would begin to smoke heavy. Since removing the can it takes more like 10-15 mins.
 

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Punkindave

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I'm guessing that UPR is not an option as I have a 2.0l.
@Mishimoto - What is required to empty the can? I see there is no drain due to the volume issues causing CELs. Is the can accessible without removing the intake snorkle? Does the can unscrew from below or would you have to remove the top mounting screws to dump? Does it come with an extra seal for the can? (as it's a high temp area) ANy discount codes?
 
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Mishimoto

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I'm guessing that UPR is not an option as I have a 2.0l.
@Mishimoto - What is required to empty the can? I see there is no drain due to the volume issues causing CELs. Is the can accessible without removing the intake snorkle? Does the can unscrew from below or would you have to remove the top mounting screws to dump? Does it come with an extra seal for the can? (as it's a high temp area) ANy discount codes?
Hi David,

To empty the can, you simply unscrew the base from the lid. To do that, we recommend removing the intake pipe. On the stock setup the intake pipe can be removed by removing two bolts and loosening two hose clamps, and should only take a minute or two. However, some of our customers have said that you can also access the can from underneath the vehicle. There's also a plug in the bottom of the can that could be removed and may make draining from below easier as well.

We do not include an extra seal as the o-ring is a high-quality Viton™ material that's extremely resistant to oil, heat, and abrasion. This o-ring should not need to be replaced for the life of the vehicle, but if you ever do have an issue, feel free to reach out to us and we'll be happy to send out a replacement.

Finally, we do not have a discount for the catch can at this time, but we often run sales through the summer. If you sign up for our newsletter, you'll be alerted any time a product for your vehicle goes on sale as well.

Feel free to let me know if you have any other questions. Thanks!
-Steve
 

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Not sure if anyone else has had this issue, but when running my UPR catch can I had issues when at extreme angles way too much oil running into the motor. Now before anyone ask, yes this was tested with emptying the can right before taking the rig out on a trail. My guess would be the larger hose and improved airflow allow the oil to move in larger amounts to the engine. The first time this happened it partially hydro-locked my engine and burned up my starter. The second time the vehicle just kept coming close to dying. I have since removed the catch can and this issue seems to be much less common. Before if I was at an extreme angle for more than 1-2 mins the engine would begin to smoke heavy. Since removing the can it takes more like 10-15 mins.
Interesting. I thought these were supposed to prevent that. Was Litebrite's catch can a UPR, or Mishimoto? From their video, it looked like it stopped the smoking issue. Also, how steep an angle is the threshold for this to happen?
 

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Interesting. I thought these were supposed to prevent that. Was Litebrite's catch can a UPR, or Mishimoto? From their video, it looked like it stopped the smoking issue. Also, how steep an angle is the threshold for this to happen?
LiteBrite intalled a UPR catch can -
 

DanW

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LiteBrite intalled a UPR catch can -
Honestly, their video of the steep angle smoke job was the main reason I even gave thought to a catch can.
 

DanW

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I spoke to my new Bitog friend, Kevin, who was on the Pentastar design team. I asked him for his thoughts on catch cans. In summary, he said, yes, the oil in the combustion chamber DOES rob power and efficiency. BUT, not enough to notice or make a significant difference. He said if you have enough gain to notice, you've got other bigger problems. He said if it even gained 0.1 mpg in testing, they'd have put them on there from the factory. He did say, though, that they have no downside. They cause no harm, at all, and even though benefits are imperceptible, there is a benefit to not having the blow by oil go in there. (I asked him if that blow by oil had any lubricating function in the valves or valve train, he said no. It serves no purpose other than to burn it off cleanly so as not to pollute.) He also said that the catch can won't add to the life of the engine. The blow by oil causes no wear or problems, in a healthy engine. (Remember the 625k mile Pentastar? No catch can. And the area where it failed was only in the timing chains and guides. The rest of the engine was like new with little or no wear visible.)

I did not ask him about spark plug life. Certainly a can won't hurt there, either.

He did have some interesting things to say about the smoking at extreme angles. He believes that is more from overfilling the crank case, even very slightly, and unintentionally. He said he drains his Pentastar (Chrysler 300) overnight and is always surprised at how much oil comes out after he thought it was empty. He recommended trying it. THEN, add your 5 quarts (or 6 in his case) and know you have the right amount. He did say that in this extreme angles condition the catch can *might* make a difference. He recommended a good garage discussion of that! Lol. In other words, he doesn't know. Probably those with experience are best to answer this one. @Kevin8086 (Litebrite) appeared to see a benefit, while @Penance81 had the opposite experience.

He did NOT say that the smoking from extreme angles caused any damage, unless you are hitting those angles frequently. For that, he said again the can might be a good solution.

After our conversation, I like the idea of stopping that blow by from getting in the engine. I like not gunking up the intake, as well. However, I'm not settled on my own cost/benefit analysis. Of course, I buy things all the time on the basis of liking it more than through cost/benefit analysis, so I may just go for it anyway, just for my entertainment and desire to provide pampering type maintenance on my beloved engine.

Some more interesting stuff.....He said the cam driven centrifugal "pump" on the back side of the outside cam does a "great job" of removing heavy oil before it heads toward the intake. (See it on the right of the rear cam in the pic)

1599074797086.png


He said this pump is in almost a perfect position. He said it would take a "rollover-type" angle to cause it to starve and fail to lubricate the valve train. That's good to know!

I did not get into other questions, like DI engines and LSPI. I don't know his experience with those other than he said they designed the Pentastar with both DI and turbo charging in mind for the future. That's why many parts in the engine are overbuilt.

In the end, he said to run a catch, if you'd like, and feel good about it. But if you don't, you are fine. That's kind of what I expected him to say. More importantly, we learned just a little more about this great engine.

If you have a question that is good enough to send to him, let me know. I don't want to bug him too much, but at the same time, he loves to talk about this engine. He talks of it as if it is his baby, and he's very proud of it. I think he should be.
 

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Just to be clear...

Oil in the combustion chamber DOES rob power and efficiency. If you can see on varying vehicles between 1 and 2 miles per gallon increase is average in most Jeeps. I would say that's a pretty noticeable difference. I'm only here to keep things true and accurate about ingesting oil in the cylinders. I'm replying to this as I have always been involved in engine performance and combustion chamber efficiency.

I have tons of experience with normally aspirated engines and trucks/vehicles that operate a lot at low rpm where the load and combustion chamber efficiency is as important as not running diluted fuel. Any oil even synthetic creates reduced combustion and cylinder pressure. The only difference between regular oil and synthetic is one is highly combustible and one is not.

Many engineers define oil in the cylinder acceptable as that is the only way to make the vehicle legal and minimize maintenance. In the correct setting, you want your engine to be oil-free in the combustion cylinders and know that that will also improve performance, mpg, and longevity. Plug life will almost be doubled as well. But if the oil in the cylinder didn't matter the plugs should last as long either way.

I build performance parts and started life with every type of performance vehicle imaginable. Also, I learned about stock vehicles and oil ingestion from experience with how they perform and respond to oil in the cylinder. Maybe a clean perfect running vehicle is not important to some. But I have to say it should be important to everyone and it directly affects the environment as well.

The benefits of a catch can vs not having one when everyone always has a comment about someone somewhere that got 10 gazillion miles without a catch can. That is fine I don't argue it. The thing I can state is that the condition and performance it returns if it would have been equipped with a catch can all that time would be the difference in a life long healthy diet vs eating fast food.

The difference is you will get a much better running and longer lasting engine that will require a fraction of the maintenance and or time over the life of the vehicle. I'm not here to flame or go back and forth as I'm speaking from collected results and experiences over tens of thousands of friends, customers and vehicles I have dealt with over the years.

I was that guy in the early 80's making short jokes at one of our engine builders that was decades ahead of the industry by trying to make oil separators on light-duty trucks to maintain full vacuum to the engine and eliminate any chance of oil ingestion. Needless to say that was one of the people that showed me how flawed PCV systems were and still are to this very day.

I know too long and drawn out. So let me reiterate that a PROPERLY functioning catch can with a real diffuser and media for the internals, not a honeycomb filter or air compressor muffler like many models use. The properly designed catch can will reward you every time and for the small investment, you make it will always be saving you money and maintaining your vehicle's performance and reliability.

If you just don't want a catch can then don't get one. But, please do not misinform your fellow enthusiasts trying to make a point that is not true when it comes to someone asking is a catch can beneficial.

------------------------------

One important thing when you have catch can and go rock crawling always be sure you have drained your catch can and didn't let it fill up. The JEEP platform tends to pass the must oil through the PCV system by design. If you maintain the catch can level it's very uncommon to experience smoking as described in an earlier post.

Thank you for sharing, Joe
 

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Just to be clear...

Oil in the combustion chamber DOES rob power and efficiency. If you can see on varying vehicles between 1 and 2 miles per gallon increase is average in most Jeeps. I would say that's a pretty noticeable difference. I'm only here to keep things true and accurate about ingesting oil in the cylinders. I'm replying to this as I have always been involved in engine performance and combustion chamber efficiency.

I have tons of experience with normally aspirated engines and trucks/vehicles that operate a lot at low rpm where the load and combustion chamber efficiency is as important as not running diluted fuel. Any oil even synthetic creates reduced combustion and cylinder pressure. The only difference between regular oil and synthetic is one is highly combustible and one is not.

Many engineers define oil in the cylinder acceptable as that is the only way to make the vehicle legal and minimize maintenance. In the correct setting, you want your engine to be oil-free in the combustion cylinders and know that that will also improve performance, mpg, and longevity. Plug life will almost be doubled as well. But if the oil in the cylinder didn't matter the plugs should last as long either way.

I build performance parts and started life with every type of performance vehicle imaginable. Also, I learned about stock vehicles and oil ingestion from experience with how they perform and respond to oil in the cylinder. Maybe a clean perfect running vehicle is not important to some. But I have to say it should be important to everyone and it directly affects the environment as well.

The benefits of a catch can vs not having one when everyone always has a comment about someone somewhere that got 10 gazillion miles without a catch can. That is fine I don't argue it. The thing I can state is that the condition and performance it returns if it would have been equipped with a catch can all that time would be the difference in a life long healthy diet vs eating fast food.

The difference is you will get a much better running and longer lasting engine that will require a fraction of the maintenance and or time over the life of the vehicle. I'm not here to flame or go back and forth as I'm speaking from collected results and experiences over tens of thousands of friends, customers and vehicles I have dealt with over the years.

I was that guy in the early 80's making short jokes at one of our engine builders that was decades ahead of the industry by trying to make oil separators on light-duty trucks to maintain full vacuum to the engine and eliminate any chance of oil ingestion. Needless to say that was one of the people that showed me how flawed PCV systems were and still are to this very day.

I know too long and drawn out. So let me reiterate that a PROPERLY functioning catch can with a real diffuser and media for the internals, not a honeycomb filter or air compressor muffler like many models use. The properly designed catch can will reward you every time and for the small investment, you make it will always be saving you money and maintaining your vehicle's performance and reliability.

If you just don't want a catch can then don't get one. But, please do not misinform your fellow enthusiasts trying to make a point that is not true when it comes to someone asking is a catch can beneficial.

------------------------------

One important thing when you have catch can and go rock crawling always be sure you have drained your catch can and didn't let it fill up. The JEEP platform tends to pass the must oil through the PCV system by design. If you maintain the catch can level it's very uncommon to experience smoking as described in an earlier post.

Thank you for sharing, Joe

Disagreeing is fine. You are not the only one I know who swears by the catch can. However, acusing me or Kevin at Oil-Udder (Former FCA Pentastar Engineer) of spreading misinformation is simply untrue not cool. I've got no dog in the fight other than the fact I'd love to know I could buy a device for 150 bucks that could give me more power and fuel economy. Unfortunately, that's not clear enough to me yet to justify the expens.

I haven't ruled out purchasing one, and yours would be the one, based on what I've learned. But I don't think I'd expect much more than what Kevin told me to expect. The main reason I'm interested would be to prevent smoking at extreme angles, even though I'm told it causes no damage. I still wouldn't like it and would like to prevent it, if it indeed does that. Although one gentleman in this thread said it had the opposite effect. Just my 2 cents.
 
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